iPhone4

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Originally Posted by Tylor

Since when did humans need a computer or iPhone to live? We need fire to make food, to keep us warm, and to provide light. It is totally possible to live without a computer...

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Why do we need fire started by matches to do either. Currently I'm using the Internet on my phone to write this and have an electric light on for lighting. Food was cooked earlier not on an open flame but in (surprise, surprise) the kitchen.

Which do you normally use for lighting: fires started by matches, or electric lights? Ditto for cooking: naked flames lit by matches or kitchen tools like a stove/grill/microwave etc?

In fact even for your 2 examples: food and lighting, I use my phone more than matches. If I go into a dark room or even in a dark street, I often use my phone like a torch. For food I can serve my food needs from my phone by calling a delivery company/arranging a restaurant booking etc

Matches on the other hand: I don't own any. I have no need for them, does that make me powerless? Or perhaps have I made PROGRESS beyond a cavemanesque 'ugg, fire' approach?

fuck this iphone rubbish, i want a palm that will work in Sweden :(

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Originally Posted by RandBlade

Why do we need fire started by matches to do either. Currently I'm using the Internet on my phone to write this and have an electric light on for lighting. Food was cooked earlier not on an open flame but in (surprise, surprise) the kitchen.

Which do you normally use for lighting: fires started by matches, or electric lights? Ditto for cooking: naked flames lit by matches or kitchen tools like a stove/grill/microwave etc?

In fact even for your 2 examples: food and lighting, I use my phone more than matches. If I go into a dark room or even in a dark street, I often use my phone like a torch. For food I can serve my food needs from my phone by calling a delivery company/arranging a restaurant booking etc

Matches on the other hand: I don't own any. I have no need for them, does that make me powerless? Or perhaps have I made PROGRESS beyond a cavemanesque 'ugg, fire' approach?

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Well, you couldn't live without others lighting fires for you or using things that light fires for you (to produce electricity, the engine in your car). But in your life, matches are redundant and you do need your phone fo ryour lifestyle :)

Nobody needs an iPhone, they just want/have them.

Surely you covered needs/wants in grade school Rand, and Ike WTF is with you and the end of civilisation? You're not a survivalist are you?

This one is for Ike.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/...3L._SS500_.jpg

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Originally Posted by Flixy

Well, you couldn't live without others lighting fires for you or using things that light fires for you (to produce electricity, the engine in your car). But in your life, matches are redundant and you do need your phone fo ryour lifestyle :)

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When the power goes out, for a decade or more, he'll wish he had those matches. And tomatoes. Fuckin' loser bitch. :mad:

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Originally Posted by termite

Nobody needs an iPhone, they just want/have them.

Surely you covered needs/wants in grade school Rand, and Ike WTF is with you and the end of civilisation? You're not a survivalist are you?

This one is for Ike.

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Great movie. :D :up:

As I said in another thread, I read Lucifer's Hammer at an impressionable age. I often wonder if I'll make it when the power goes out. Interestingly it DID go out for an extended period, over the entire North East of the US, some time ago - summer of 2003 iirc. That was fucked up. The pumps stopped so there was no water and you couldn't even fill up your gas tank to take your car somewhere else. If the power had stayed out much longer, things would have got ugly real quick. As it was, I was quite proud there was no looting or other violence.

Also, I've always been fond of the "If you were stranded on a deserted island, what would you want with your..." or the odd "...you're stranded in the Canadian Wilderness after a plane crash with the following items..." team building exercise. I also do a lot of back country camping so I've given a lot of thought to what you need and don't need to carry on your back. Fun stuff. :up:

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Originally Posted by EyeKhan

When the power goes out, for a decade or more, he'll wish he had those matches. And tomatoes. Fuckin' loser bitch. :mad:

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Yes, but he could still stroke his powerless, shiny, nice iPhone, precioussssss.

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Originally Posted by Timbuk2

Yes, but he can still stroke his powerless, shiny, nice iPhone, precioussssss.

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I have noticed in watching iWhatever users there is something oddly sensual in that user interface.

Life without a mobile phone is barely a life worth living.

Telly-phones are stupid, mobile or stationary.

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Originally Posted by Nessus

Telly-phones are stupid, mobile or stationary.

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But. They're smart phones. :confused:

Is stupid really stupid, or are you really smart?
That's how you stole my heart

Who-o-ah, I'm with stupid!

BUMP. Am surprised nobody replied with a serious suggestion of xyz smartphone is better than the iPhone4 because ...

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Originally Posted by EyeKhan

When the power goes out, for a decade or more, he'll wish he had those matches. And tomatoes. Fuckin' loser bitch. :mad:

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Seriously? What box of matches do you carry around that would last you a decade or more? As for tomatoes - I don't think they'll be particularly fresh after a week (or any left), I'd hate to imagine how rotten 10 year old tomatoes would be. The very thought makes your suggestion patently absurd.

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As I said in another thread, I read Lucifer's Hammer at an impressionable age. I often wonder if I'll make it when the power goes out. Interestingly it DID go out for an extended period, over the entire North East of the US, some time ago - summer of 2003 iirc. That was fucked up. The pumps stopped so there was no water and you couldn't even fill up your gas tank to take your car somewhere else. If the power had stayed out much longer, things would have got ugly real quick. As it was, I was quite proud there was no looting or other violence.

Also, I've always been fond of the "If you were stranded on a deserted island, what would you want with your..." or the odd "...you're stranded in the Canadian Wilderness after a plane crash with the following items..." team building exercise. I also do a lot of back country camping so I've given a lot of thought to what you need and don't need to carry on your back. Fun stuff. :up:

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Fun, yes. Serious - no.

Seriously, we have power. We have food. I can get light not from a match but from a switch. I've attempted growing tomato plants in the garden - but for fun, not for necessity. If I need a tomato I go to ASDA - or I'd go to WalMart in America.

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Originally Posted by termite

Nobody needs an iPhone, they just want/have them.

Surely you covered needs/wants in grade school Rand

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Indeed I did, and I prefer Maslow's hierarchy of needs to any survivalist dogma. While Maslow's pyramid is simplistic, I have my basic physiological needs met already which means my needs are higher up. Yes, I need a smartphone. If they didn't exist, I could do without, but they do and I couldn't do my job as well without one as I can do it with. Try saying you don't need the internet to a businessman nowadays and that absurdity is why the idea of me not having a smartphone any more is equally absurd. I work on my phone on a daily basis and am "on call" literally 24/7.

I am responsible for 7 businesses and I can on my phone at any time see all vital statistics for all 7. How many people are on the clock, of what types, what the labour expenditure is, what our sales currently are, how that compares against the same day last week/year, how we're doing week-to-date, again vs last week/year. How many customers we have yet to serve, how much we still need to do to serve them, what our service stats are like today and in the last half hour. If one location is struggling I can send help from another, if labour's out of control one phone call can bring it down. Even down to how many phone lines are currently engaged. Etc, etc, etc - with this I can macro-manage the business from wherever I am, making bottom-line differences of hundreds or thousands of pounds difference. All on my phone. Just as importantly everybody knows all this data is a fingertip away. Compared to 5 years ago when we didn't have this data available 24/7 sales are up, service is better, labour is down - everything is improved because Big Brother is never far away.

Making a profit - is that a business need?

My tomatoes off my tomato plants taste a lot better than tomatoes from Walmart.

My tomatoes off my tomato plants are better than sex, though, so the Walmart tomatoes have a hard act to follow.

Figured the general noise from the news, the lack of a consumer reports recommendation, and Apple's general douchebag responses of "everyone has reception" problems would have been good enough to show that there must be something out that would be a smarter purchase over the current iphone.
To quote the inventor of the cellphone.

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Originally Posted by Martin Cooper

Not much of an apology from Jobs; and he's simply wrong about other phones being comparable. A little humility would serve him well.

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Humility of course hasn't been in the Apple consumer playbook for several product refreshes.

There was a problem with the phones reception if you held it in your bare hands, in a particular spot, without it having a case. I'd want a case anyway. Apple are providing all customers with a free case. Problem solved, storm in tea-cup blown over.

EDIT: I'm more concerned with the fact that my current contract has unlimited data on it while all new British contracts have a data cap.

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Originally Posted by Aimless

fuck this iphone rubbish, i want a palm that will work in Sweden :(

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Aside from the horror of getting a refurbished one (ugh, I still have a sinking feeling just thinking about all that), I've been happy with this Palm Pre Plus. WebOS really is a great operating system, and Palm has been completely nonjudgmental wrt all homebrew/patches. No jailbreak necessary, either. Just type in the Konami Code and you're in Developer Mode.

Spoiler:

http://imgur.com/U9O8g.png

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Originally Posted by RandBlade

There was a problem with the phones reception if you held it in your bare hands, in a particular spot, without it having a case. I'd want a case anyway. Apple are providing all customers with a free case. Problem solved, storm in tea-cup blown over.

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IIRC, Apple was adamant about not wanting to give out cases. It wasn't until they realized that nearly every customer was super-pissed that they caved. Apple is a market leader in new technology, but I can't support a corporation so intent on locking you down when there are competitive alternatives available. When will Google Voice be approved for the App Store?

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Originally Posted by RandBlade

Apple are providing all customers with a free case.

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You mean the phone condom thats not compatible with docks and accessories? Hardly problem solved.
but I'd be more worried that Apple lied that it was a software issue at first, and then tried to drag other cell makers down with them when people with the right equipment called them out on it. Thats the type of behavior all smart consumers should support :up:


Its not that easy to dismiss as "holding it a certain way". Its when you hold it the same way almost every iphone advertisement holds the phone.
http://imgur.com/zYhfs.jpg

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Originally Posted by Dattu

IIRC, Apple was adamant about not wanting to give out cases. It wasn't until they realized that nearly every customer was super-pissed that they caved.

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They caved, that's all that matters.

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Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer

You mean the phone condom thats not compatible with docks and accessories? Hardly problem solved.
but I'd be more worried that Apple lied that it was a software issue at first, and then tried to drag other cell makers down with them when people with the right equipment called them out on it. Thats the type of behavior all smart consumers should support :up:

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If its a crappy case than it doesn't matter since I'd be buying a case anyway even without this 'problem' :rolleyes:, I don't know many smartphone owners (or many phone owners for that matter) that don't protect their phone in a case - which prevents this being a problem.

And you seem to be making a mistake that this is about the ethics of Apple or whatever versus trying to get the best phone. I don't care if its Apple or not, right now the iPhone is the best phone I've seen and nobody has yet named a better one.

I'm a bit surprised you don't see how dodgy this is for Apple, Rand. It's a pretty clear-cut hardware problem.

Though to be fair, various parties are using this as a wholesale indictment of Apple. Or vindication of Apple.

I also don't quite understand how this is 'problem' solved for Apple. They pissed off some of their most faithful by first telling them there was no problem, then that the user was the problem (interesting that one), after that that the software was the problem (a blatant lie) to finally come up with the truth that the design was the problem (which they actually knew before they even started selling the damn things).

And yes, now people can start wrapping their sleek machines in rubber 'bouncers' so that they can actually their neat gadgets as the mobile phones they are supposed to be.

To me it sounds like a very major fuck up by Apple, and what's worse; it's not the first time they do something like this. The first iPods they put in the market were delivered with batteries Apple KNEW to be faulty. After being convicted they 'fixed' the problem, but the lasting impression that 'fix' (replacing my iPod with a new one twice within 12 months) is that Apple can't be trusted in its dealings with its customers. And just for your information, my dislike of Apple never kept me from buying their products altogether.

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Originally Posted by RandBlade

I don't care if its Apple or not, right now the iPhone is the best phone I've seen and nobody has yet named a better one.

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http://cnettv.cnet.com/iphone-4-vs-h...CarouselArea.0
And I'm sure there'll be more comparos once people get their hands on the Droid X for a little bit longer, just off the top of my head.

Droid Incredible and Nexus One are probably the closest competitors.

The Droid X is getting a lot of press, but it's physically much larger than the iPhone. Sort of a monster, though the Sprint Evo is selling off the shelves so obviously people want phones like that.

I'm trying to decide what to buy. I made the mistake of wanting to save money when I bought the phone I have now and got a Blackjack II - Samsung's Blackberry wannabe. I've put up with it for over a year now, and as soon as I make up my mind about what I want I will be replacing it.

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Originally Posted by Dreadnaught

I'm a bit surprised you don't see how dodgy this is for Apple, Rand. It's a pretty clear-cut hardware problem.

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Oh I agree entirely it is. I went into the Apple shop the other day where they have an array of phones out for people to play with, that can call each other so people can play with the Facetalk feature. I decided to have a play with the phone, but knowing about the problems I deliberately held it to bridge the gap. The signal bar went from full, to 5 bars, 4 etc down to its last one then "Searching" (no signal). It makes logical sense why it breaks it if you short-circuit that and I think the truest response from Jobs was the alleged quote of "you're holding it wrong". The fix therefore is to prevent people from holding it and next time don't put the antennae on the case if you can short-circuit them!

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Though to be fair, various parties are using this as a wholesale indictment of Apple. Or vindication of Apple.

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Indeed, look no further than this thread for the usual suspect of Apple-hating here.

But do you think that kind of defect merits a recall?

Lolli- No one's going to buy the Nexus One these days, but I highly suggest the Droid Incredible if you're on Verizon.

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Originally Posted by Dreadnaught

Lolli- No one's going to buy the Nexus One these days, but I highly suggest the Droid Incredible if you're on Verizon.

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Funny, this feels like a repeat conversation somehow.

Not on Verizon right now, but I am quite likely to ditch AT&T for them when I decide on a phone.

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Originally Posted by Dreadnaught

Lolli- No one's going to buy the Nexus One these days, but I highly suggest the Droid Incredible if you're on Verizon.

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I ordered one last week (was able to get it for free). They're low on stock, so it hasn't arrived yet.

Yeah, I'm getting that deja vu too.

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Originally Posted by RandBlade

Seriously? What box of matches do you carry around that would last you a decade or more? As for tomatoes - I don't think they'll be particularly fresh after a week (or any left), I'd hate to imagine how rotten 10 year old tomatoes would be. The very thought makes your suggestion patently absurd.
Fun, yes. Serious - no.

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Matches and tomatoes is just a metaphor for the most basic things one would need to survive if our thin veil of civilization were scratched off by some big disaster. Don't take it so literally. And arn't you repeating yourself or something?

Also - I've seen photo and video on the new iPhone's high definition screen and its very impressive. I've never seen anything look that good on a mobile device.

Starting to like this foreign trend of visual news.

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Originally Posted by Dreadnaught

But do you think that kind of defect merits a recall?

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No, not since the solution is to keep it in a case or avoid touching a particular spot. I think it merits free cases being issued.

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Lolli- No one's going to buy the Nexus One these days, but I highly suggest the Droid Incredible if you're on Verizon.

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I've never even seen a Nexus One in the UK.

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Originally Posted by EyeKhan

Matches and tomatoes is just a metaphor for the most basic things one would need to survive if our thin veil of civilization were scratched off by some big disaster. Don't take it so literally. And arn't you repeating yourself or something?

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The fact its a metaphor kind of again makes your argument against me ludicrous.

I'm talking about real, practical things you can need or buy. I need my mobile. I need my credit card. Etc, etc

You're talking about metaphor's that you might need if an insanely unlikely situation occurs. WTF? Since these are "needs" to you, please tell me how many metaphors you carry in your pocket right now?

My mobile and my wallet are "never leave home without it" objects. I don't know about you but I never make sure to have a full supply of metaphors in my pocket when I go out.

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Also - I've seen photo and video on the new iPhone's high definition screen and its very impressive. I've never seen anything look that good on a mobile device.

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:)