Turkey

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Originally Posted by Hazir

Actually, the fact that the operation had already started in the early afternoon under the noses of everybody made it look like a very unstoppable coup.

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Just antother wrong assumtion.

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As for wishful thinking, you tell me what's wrong with not being particular sad about a dictator being kicked out. Also, my experiences with the 1980 coup and its aftermath made me very apprehensious about the coup itself. In conversations with friends the common denominator was; no good can come from this from the moment it started. Because regardless of the outcome Turkey wasn't going to be a better country.

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I have no problem with wishes. Just with turning hopes and fears into predictions.

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Otherwise this coup is one of those things where you can say 'If he wasn't behind it, he should have been behind it'. He himself already described it at a gift of God enabling him to clean up the army. And his cronies didn't exactly stop at the army. In the hours since the coup close to 3000 judges were dismissed.

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I am not believing in the false flag yet. But I don't find it unreasonable to believe that Erdogan knew about the coup in beforehand and was actually more prepared for the events than he want us to believe.

Whatever. Good luck with living a live in which you never say something you thought would happen doesn't happen.

This is obviously the first of many successful operations conducted in collaboration with Putin :downcast:

Seriously though, if Erdogan attempts to further strengthen his grip on power and get even more authoriy than he does now, will it succeed or will it very soon backfire?

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Originally Posted by Hazir

Whatever. Good luck with living a live in which you never say something you thought would happen doesn't happen.

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I at least try to be above 50% because otherwise I can just throw a coin.

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Originally Posted by Aimless

Seriously though, if Erdogan attempts to further strengthen his grip on power and get even more authoriy than he does now, will it succeed or will it very soon backfire?

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It hasn't backfired yet (failed coup excepted :o ).

Edit: "Some 2,745 Turkish judges have also been dismissed in the wake of the coup, state media say."

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36813924

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Originally Posted by Loki

It hasn't backfired yet (failed coup excepted :o ).

Edit: "Some 2,745 Turkish judges have also been dismissed in the wake of the coup, state media say."

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36813924

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Well you know those judges were armed and helped the military... wait what?

This is why attempting coups against assholes is bad. It gives them an excuse to be even more assholish.

So, will Gülen be extradited?

No.

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Originally Posted by Aimless

So, will Gülen be extradited?

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Why would he be?

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Originally Posted by Aimless

So, will Gülen be extradited?

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Unfortunately, Erdogan has no proof to offer US courts or officials for his charge that Gulen is responsible for global warming as a plot to ruin Turkish farmers.

Unfortunately ;)

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Originally Posted by LittleFuzzy

Unfortunately, Erdogan has no proof to offer US courts or officials for his charge that Gulen is responsible for global warming as a plot to ruin Turkish farmers.

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Originally Posted by coinich

Why would he be?

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Originally Posted by Loki

No.

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In that case, will Turkey step up the rhetoric any further?

Some sources have reported that the Turkish PM at least has said that any country that helps Gulen will be considered "not a friend" and may even be considered as being at war. I think a lot may be lost in translation there so if anyone can translate the actual quote more accurately that would be helpful.




Btw, has NATO ever used military intervention in fulfilling its collective security mission to safeguard against internal threats? I can think of no examples off the top of my head.

We've already said that NATO has no collective mission to safeguard against internal threats ...

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Originally Posted by Aimless

In that case, will Turkey step up the rhetoric any further?

Some sources have reported that the Turkish PM at least has said that any country that helps Gulen will be considered "not a friend" and may even be considered as being at war. I think a lot may be lost in translation there so if anyone can translate the actual quote more accurately that would be helpful.




Btw, has NATO ever used military intervention in fulfilling its collective security mission to safeguard against internal threats? I can think of no examples off the top of my head.

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The blaming of Gulen for everything that goes wrong in Turkey or which Erdogan doesn't like is because "traitors" forced abroad make good scapegoats, not because they are actually a huge concern. Of course, we've asked on here just how rational Erdogan is so that might not be the accurate perspective to use, he might actually be the sort who has security check under the bed at night to make sure Gulen isn't lurking there.

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Originally Posted by Aimless

Some sources have reported that the Turkish PM at least has said that any country that helps Gulen will be considered "not a friend" and may even be considered as being at war.

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Good luck with that, Binali.

This coup is causing a situation where people are very afraid the country could erupt into something resembling a civil war. There's a fear the government will use it as a pretext against all opposition and the government supporters in the streets already has taken it upon themselves to 'teach a lesson' to everyone they perceive as not with them. Religious minorities amongst the first.

Headline on BBC is that 8000 police have been suspended for being connected to the coup. So I'd say that fear was well justified. Fucker's using it as an opportunity to do a full scale purge.

This coup is causing a situation where people are very afraid the country could erupt into something resembling a civil war. There's a fear the government will use it as a pretext against all opposition and the government supporters in the streets already has taken it upon themselves to 'teach a lesson' to everyone they perceive as not with them. Religious minorities amongst the first.

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Hazir, I get the feeling that if the election were a 51/49 situation then Erdogan would do enough to cheat his way to victory. What do you think?

I don't have much confidence that Turkey's democracy remains strong enough to see him out in a close result like that.

Cheating aside, he'll do his best to minimize turnout in Kurdish areas.

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