Yes. I suspect one could make a good case at my suicide attempt being a case of the faggot, as well. It all paints a neat little portrait, and little Dorian isn't half as pretty as he'd thought...Quote:
Originally Posted by CitizenCain
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Yes. I suspect one could make a good case at my suicide attempt being a case of the faggot, as well. It all paints a neat little portrait, and little Dorian isn't half as pretty as he'd thought...Quote:
Originally Posted by CitizenCain
It wouldn't fix everything. People will still make bad choice.s However by never assigning blame for bad behavior you make the problem worse.Quote:
Originally Posted by CitizenCain
I know this thread is about the gay suicides but its a larger picture.
Kids are getting fatter. Blame the kids for lack of self control? Blame the parents for letting their kids eat anything they want? Nope on both counts. Society says... blame our food. Blame our culture! Blame big evil corporations. But oh no... don't blame the kids and their parents. We can't do that.
Ditto with addiction. "Lets treat it like a disease." No lets treat it for what it is. A choice. A bad choice. And place the blame fully and solely upon the drug user. Nah... won't happen in this culture.
Oh look this guy lose his home. Blame it on the bank. Blame it on the economy. Blame it on EVERYONE but the person who signed the mortgage and agreed to pay for the house. That's the culture. Always blame the faceless entity never blame the individual.
It isn't healthy. Its actually really sad because when people look at their lives and say "This is bad and it isn't my fault." This means they will *continue* to keep doing the same self destructive behaviors. Sure its still their own fault but we as a society enable them by handing out this ready excuse.
Your fat because you lack the will power to diet and exercise.
You lost your house because you purchased too much house and got into credit card debt.
You killed yourself because your selfish. (Granted this is a bit after the fact but it provides a lesson).
And *yes* of course there are *some* situations beyond a person's control. You get hit by a bus and can't pay for your mortgage because you can't work. Sure it can happen. But the first instinct should never be to place no blame on the individual. Because if you place no responsibility on the individual they will NEVER change. They have to first realize their mistake before they can move on.
...however if you always looks to place blame on an individual, and always look for ways to justify this blame, then you will never see, let alone even begin to comprehend or understand any external factors that contributed to whatever their perceived failing was. This is constant with you.
The larger picture being that you're looking for any excuse to hate you some faggots ("assigning blame for bad behavior"), when you have nothing but excuses and justifications and denials for the same behavior from people you like (cops, soldiers).Quote:
Originally Posted by Lewkowski
Where's all the hatred and "blame" for the soldiers who "selfishly" commit suicide, and at much higher rates than gay teens, hmmm? Or do we get to look forward to another chickenhawkish rebuke of me for pointing out a truth you don't like?
And speaking of truths you don't like, there are a lot of gay guys in the Army... want me to provide you a few names of highly decorated war heroes that like to fuck other men for you to hate on? :rolleyes:
Oh, horseshit. These behaviors have been with us since the dawn of time, and will continue as long as humans exist. You getting to blame a bunch of dead faggots for killing themselves sure as the fuck won't change that, and will only serve to make things a little worse... which is fine, because you don't really care about stopping the behaviors, you just like standing in judgement over your fellow man and condemning them for the things they do that you don't like.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lewkowski
I've gone out of my way to state that there are instances where factors exist outside of the person's control.Quote:
Originally Posted by Illusions
The problem is you've been conditioned never to place blame on the individual. Its always "society" "culture" or "big business." If a person makes great choices will they be more or less likely to be successful? Obvious answer... yes. And yet you and others in the poor threads refuse to make the logical conclusion that people who are unsuccessful at life are that way due to their own choices.
How many kids committed suicide there Lewk? And I remember, even if you didn't, that not all of them were gay. There was/is something besides individuals making very poor life-ending decisions going on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lewkowski
you're using these words....you don't know what they meanQuote:
Originally Posted by Lewkowski
I like how what you consider to be out of your way is just regular logical and rational thinking to everyone else.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lewkowski
As we've stated numerous times before, those factors outside of a person's control contribute to what choices they can make, or have to make. In the instance referred to originally in this thread, these kids may not have to had to make a choice between continuing to live with bullying, or killing themselves, had there not been bullying in the first place.Quote:
The problem is you've been conditioned never to place blame on the individual. Its always "society" "culture" or "big business." If a person makes great choices will they be more or less likely to be successful? Obvious answer... yes. And yet you and others in the poor threads refuse to make the logical conclusion that people who are unsuccessful at life are that way due to their own choices.
You've gone out of your way to make control freaks sound like saints. And you're trying to do that by de-legitimizing mental/behavioral health, conflating almost all outcomes with choices, and confusing blame with responsibility.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lewkowski
"The force said officers had spoken to him over concerns raised about his Twitter posts and had been reassured by him that he was OK."
British mental health services at their best.
Not sure what you're getting at. I'm talking in generalities here not just suicide and not just gays.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loki
Weird, because what everyone else has been talking about when they're replying to you is the topic created by the original post.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lewkowski
Yes and this is why I said this...Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleFuzzy
"I know this thread is about the gay suicides but its a larger picture."
I mean come on what does suicide have to do with more kids getting fat?
My larger belief is that people should be held responsible for their choices. These kids chose to kill themselves so pinning the blame on other people dilutes the choice they made and I don't fight that acceptable. The fact that they are gay or straight or whatever doesn't change my opinion that its their fault. If a straight kid killed themselves my opinion would be exactly the same. It was their fault, no one elses.
Again with the fault=blame=responsibility bullshit. You talk about suicide as if it's the equivalent of kid swiping a pack of gum, or something. :rolleyes:
What's your larger belief regarding behavioral science and mental health? Does it mean anything (to you, Lewk) that neuro-science can map genome types, and compare brain activity using sophisticated radiological methods?
I just had a moment of *shudder*. Lewk manning a suicide prevention phone bank.
The fact that Lewk seems to manage a life of relative success and social popularity just by being himself is a most troubling thought in general. Or on a species-wide level, anyhows.
He was referring to this:Quote:
Originally Posted by Lewkowski
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lewkowski
Moar evil, selfish faggits.
Come Lewk, tell us about how evil those people were for killing themselves.
(For the second year in a row, more American soldiers—both enlisted men and women and veterans—committed suicide than were killed in the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.)
He does? Guess anyone can be anything, depending on how far you lower the bar. Not that he's a failure or a loser or whatever, but at least my metrics for success set the bar a little higher than "married, middle class, college graduate in Texas."Quote:
Originally Posted by Nessus
If they killed themselves they are selfish. Any large group of people will have some bad apples. Can you name a large organization that has had ZERO people kill themselves? Your pathetic attempts to bring the military into this discussion is sad. Most of our military is great just because there are some bad apples doesn't change that fact. Major Hasan was a terrorist, does that make all of the American military terrorists? No of course not.Quote:
Originally Posted by CitizenCain
Oooh yes the "Of course practicing a life style that is unhealthy *might* also..." was the major point of my posts on this thread....Quote:
Originally Posted by Aimless
Military/veteran suicide rates are higher than any other demographic average. They're not just "any" large group of people with some bad apples. But they're an integral part of this discussion. If you give a shit about US military, then consider veterans, too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lewkowski
For the umpteenth time its not like they fucking chose to kill themselves out of the blue. They weren't considering the choice to kill themselves until they were continuously bullied. This bizarro world you wish to live in where no one looks at any outside reasoning for someone making a choice is beyond stupid. Do you have your head buried so far in the sand of your own talking points that you are completely and utterly unable to ever even think of considering the possibility that outside forces can have an influence in what choices a person can make, or finds palatable to make?Quote:
Originally Posted by Lewkowski
Just walk it off, son
In Lewkowskia I would've randomly walked something off as an isolated and insulated choice, because Lewk's ignorance would not have any influence on a possible decision to do physical activity.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nessus
http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/10/us/min...html?hpt=hp_t2
Another great example of school officials acting like petty tyrants.
Insane.
I like that talking to another student about sex on one's own private time is now an offense punishable by one's school.
Or any talking, for that matter.
The 'demanding facebook passwords' thing is apprantly becoming quite the trendQuote:
Originally Posted by Loki
http://redtape.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2...book-passwords
The authorities in Minnesota should talk to the ones in New York and get pointers on how to best charge all the adults in that situation with 15 felonies. :bored:Quote:
Originally Posted by Loki
It's bad, but it's voluntary, and you can always apply for a different job. Not much of a choice for a junior high school student.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steely Glint
The "we have to think about the children" comeback trumps all charges.Quote:
Originally Posted by CitizenCain
It's one thing when you do it to chavs who don't understand twitter... but this, this is just not okay :(
The "chavs" DID understand Twitter. They just apparently thought no one outside their circle of friends and immediate #followers did.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aimless
Another reason to favor the military's approach to evil government officials.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loki
Of course, in our case, the complication is that if you want to be fair, you probably need to earmark a round for all the civies who support this shit too, and before you know it, the media's going hysterical and throwing our words like "genocide" and "crimes against humanity." :(