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Originally Posted by
Aimless
You're incorrect. You cannot point to X number of migrants and say "that SHOULD be enough".
I know that, do you? That was my own point.
There will never be enough as demand is ultimately infinite.
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Employers and recruiters, for both highly skilled, reasonably skilled and unskilled positions, have identified difficulties with recruiting people from the EU as an important cause. Your handwaving is not particularly compelling in light of that.
So we should address that. I never said we shouldn't. I just couldn't care less about struggling to recruit people on minimum wage into one of the most popular and expensive cities to live on in the globe.
Let's not forget either that net migration was massively high in the last 12 months, up dramatically on average and one of the highest net figures since records began.
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Wages & value of compensation packages are absolutely rising, in highly skilled jobs, a consequence of recruiters having difficulties attracting people from the EU post-referendum.
[Citation Needed]
By what percentage as despite that average wages are actually rising below inflation currently.
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Misses the point in addition to being incorrect. The shortage is not only seen among unskilled or low-skilled minimum-wage labourers. Moreover, their impact on housing costs are likely minimal when compared to impact of planning policies, land cost, govt. policies wrt social housing, etc. Their impact on demand is also low in comparison to the impact of natural population growth. Low- & unskilled migrant labourers from the EU are more likely to be seasonal workers staying in the UK for shorter periods of time in crowded accommodations.
Again there is no shortage, we have record numbers of employees and a record employment ratio. We are maybe not being efficient but we do not have a shortage.
Also you're simply incorrect in your claims. We haven't gone from 1% of the UK's population to 6% of the UK's population being being EU citizens within less than a generation because of "seasonal workers".
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I'm sorry but your point is uninformed and blinding only in its dazzling stupidity. Migrants from the EU tend to be young, reasonably healthy, and productive--and they use the NHS to a lesser extent than the native population. I said
The consequences of the chronic mismanagement of the NHS by successive Tory governments cannot be laid at the feet of non-British EU citizens or their employers.
So productive that what we are specifically only discussing people on minimum wage? You keep trying to bring skilled people into this despite it being completely off topic.
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They will need fewer doctors and nurses and homes than for example older Brits, and since we're not only talking about minimum-wage low-skilled workers this is less relevant to the discussion.
We are talking about minimum-wage lowe-skilled workers. Specifically because that is what Tim brought up.
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Originally Posted by
Timbuk2
*shrugs* not sure of the breakdown.
Anecdotally, my other half is an area HR director for a hotel chain. For the first time in this position for many years she has vacancies perpetually unfilled across the chain, primarily in the minimum-wage bracket, which is normally taken up by Eastern Europeans. Recruitment has been becoming increasingly difficult.
Recruitment fairs she attends regularly are becoming more and more sparse in attendance - conversations with other managers at these fairs all tell a similar story in difficulty in filling positions. Hospitality for one is suffering significantly, at least in London. Other industries with heavy immigrant workforces would reflect this too.
So far, so expected. :bored:
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Their impact on the housing problem is minimal while their importance to many sectors of the economy is significant, even when factoring in automation. This is true for example for seasonal agricultural work outside London. It's true for seasonal work in the hospitality industry where you still need human hands for making beds, cleaning rooms, offering personal service to confused tourists from all over the world etc. It's true for the tens of thousands of workers in the construction sector, workers who've helped the UK meet some of the demand for new housing at a lower cost than it would've had to pay otherwise.
Not talking about seasonal wrokers but [citation needed] for the idea that bringing more minimum wage people into a crowded city has a minimal impact.
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We are talking about those groups as well.
No we're not.
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Minimum-wage labourers from the EU generally do not use these services to the same extent as British-born citizens. They also enable businesses to thrive, and those businesses--presumably--pay taxes.
Minimum wage labourers don't need obstetricians or midwives?
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Oh wow. If you weren't already a parody of yourself, you'd be one now.
Pot. Kettle.
