Trumpocalypse Now

In the Trump 2016 thread I'd brought up some ruminations about how Trump's presidency fits into the Christian Apocalypse mythology. I'm unsure if it merits talking about, or whether it fits in Debate and Discussion, or what. But here's some paraphrase:

(Full disclosure, I do not believe in Satan or an Anti-Christ, or in the possibility that the bible contains accurate predictions of future world events, or in any revealed religion at all.)

With that, Trump's election reminded me of the apocalyptic aspect of the Catholicism I was brought up with, and a book from 1970 called The Late, Great Planet Earth. The book, later made into a movie, was the first I know of - and certainly the first to gain wide exposure - to interpret modern world events through the prism of predictions made in biblical Revelations. One of the things it said, and one of the things echoed and discussed in my grade and high school religion classes, was that the Anti-Christ would not forcefully overthrow the world. He would be welcomed into power, especially by Christians.

How could this be?

I assumed he would present himself as pious and good and only reveal his true evil nature once his power was consolidated. The stories didn't tell it that way, but that's what made sense to me. And yet, we have now witnessed good Christians accept as their leader an obviously and unquestionably very bad, very blatantly un-Christian, and immoral man. And, no less, they accepted him into the one political office in existence that, on paper at least, has the power to unilaterally End the World.

The way recent events fit into that Anti-Christ narrative strums the long-dormant remnants of my youthful indoctrination with a chilling what-the-fuck.

Two further thoughts...

First, a good Christian should actually have no interest in preventing the Apocalypse. It's the return of the Messiah, after all. As long as you're in good standing with God, it means everlasting peace, harmony, bliss, etc. will follow the carnage. But, I'm not sure how throwing one's support behind the Anti-Christ can leave one in good standing with God. With Trump, there really isn't any plausible deniability when it comes to his character, is there? Maybe, given the power of the conservative propaganda machine.

Second, thinking of Trump's recent Israel policy, I'm guessing the Jerusalem thing is actually driven by Pence, or Pence-types -- those who want to see the Temple rebuilt in Jerusalem to satisfy that prerequisite for the Apocalypse. Indeed, Trump's chief envoy for Middle-East peace, Jared Kushner, was conspicuously absent from the announcement. But Pence was there. And Pence is travelling to the region to do the diplomatic thing in the announcement's wake, not Kushner. Hmm.

I've read speculation that much of the cabinet picking, and much of the Trump Administration's domestic policy, has been driven by Pence. Which makes sense. Trump doesn't know much or care much about running the country, so he left all the bull shit details to Pence.

Consider what that means. Of course assume that Revelations and the Apocalypse and all of that is pure mythology, but consider what sort of policy comes from an ideology firmly grounded in the conviction that what really matters, here and now, is a looming war between good and evil, that will end the world as we know it, to be followed by Judgement Day, and finally the blissful reign of God forever and ever. Conveniently, anyone that does not have that same conviction - any and all atheists, moderate Christians, non-Christians, sinners - all of them will be banished away to hell for eternity. And even more convenient, all of humanity's petty problems - disease, famine, pestilence, poverty, incompetent governance - and all of humanity's golden calves - science, industry, pop-culture, much of the arts, environmentalism, you name it - are either irrelevant, or the distractions and trickery of Satan as he attempts to ensnare as much of humanity as possible before the End. If that's in the back of your mind while you formulate policy from the most powerful office in the world, then what the what?

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Originally Posted by EyeKhan

consider what sort of policy comes from an ideology firmly grounded in the conviction that what really matters, here and now, is a looming war between good and evil

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I don't think that's an entirely unreasonable prism through which to view things when it comes to certain policies, EG North Korea.

I should have used capital letters, as in the mythological struggle between God and Satan for the souls of us lowly humans. Keys in this to keep in mind:

A. It's a war that will soon culminate in the end/ abandonment of the physical world we all live in, so that all humanity's material problems within it today don't really matter, and so neither does government policy in their regards.

and

B. The war is inevitable, it's outcome can only be good for the Good People, and so it should not be avoided.

I would not be comfortable for any of our decision makers to be approaching the NK question with this on their mind.

I've pretty much given up figuring out "the religious mind", and how Christianity has managed to insert itself into US politics and government (despite a constitutional framework to avoid just that) and have such control, for so long. Alabama is like the poster child for this phenomenon, where a guy like Moore almost squeaked out an election to the Senate, with support from the RNC and the president. :bulb:

<This kind of religion-based power is also viewed as dangerous by the Christians that pump it....but only if it's from non-Christians, so>

I don't think there's any great conspiracy (based on biblical end-of-days, Armageddon, or the Rapture, or anything like that). Instead, I think the world has just gotten so complex and complicated, and people are either overwhelmed (or too tired, or even lazy) that it's just easier for them to "identify" their beliefs as religious-based. And politicians have spent decades exploiting and refining that brand of "identity politics". The bible belt is real, and the southern bible belt especially.

But it doesn't make sense, politically, because there are Christian Democrats, even Catholics (!) that are pro-choice. So, with groups like Values Voters, Faith and Family Coalition, CPAC, etc. it seems to me that religion has been co-opted by the political class. But it's really about changing culture, and culture clashes, NOT religion itself.

Maybe not the philosophical discussion you were looking for, Choobs. But I think ALL of this is in the category of man-made problems, where we are our own worst enemies, and can't get out of our own way. :(

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Originally Posted by GGT

I don't think there's any great conspiracy (based on biblical end-of-days, Armageddon, or the Rapture, or anything like that).

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No, not a conspiracy. I think they're rather open about it, actually.

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it seems to me that religion has been co-opted by the political class. But it's really about changing culture, and culture clashes, NOT religion itself.

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It IS about religion itself. While it gives people existential comfort, it has also been a tool for the ruling class to manipulate/ motivate/ control people forever. It's only recently that there was a political class separate from those wielding religion-based power. Board Historians, was the US the first to attempt a wholly secular government?

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But I think ALL of this is in the category of man-made problems, where we are our own worst enemies, and can't get out of our own way. :(

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Of course it is. All of it. Example, we throw away, what, a third of food produced in the US every year? And yet we have hungry people everywhere, and we fight politically over whether they should get food assistance, while at the same time subsidizing food production. Oh, and don't forget that for those who do have plenty to eat, we have an obesity crisis. Holy shit.