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Thread: House votes to repeal health-care law

  1. #1

    Default House votes to repeal health-care law

    he House on Wednesday evening passed a bill that would repeal the national health care overhaul, approving the measure on a largely party-line vote. The repeal bill passed 245 to 189, with three Democrats - Reps. Mike Ross (Ark.), Dan Boren (Okla.) and Mike McIntyre (N.C.) - joining Republicans in backing the measure. The three were among the four Democrats who voted earlier this month to advance the measure. Rep. Gabrielle Giffords (D-Ariz.), who remains in serious condition following this month's mass shooting in Tucson, was the only lawmaker not voting.
    The bill's passage came after Democrats unsuccessfully staged an eleventh-hour vote in an effort to derail the Republican-sponsored measure.
    The Democratic move, which would have made the repeal effort ineffective unless a majority of lawmakers gave up their federal health care benefits within 30 days of the bill's passage, fell short in the GOP-led House.
    While the repeal passed the House, ultimately, it is expected to fail.
    To actually repeal the law, Republicans would need the approval of the Democrat-controlled Senate and President Obama, unless they have enough votes to override his veto. They are not likely to get that approval.
    That made Wednesday's debate look like a dress rehearsal for an entirely different discussion: not whether the bill should be repealed, but how it might be changed.
    House Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio) said in his remarks on the House floor that repeal would prevent more than $770 billion in tax hikes, reduce spending by $540 billion and protect more than 7 million seniors from losing or being denied coverage through Medicare Advantage.
    "Repeal means paving the way for better solutions that will lower the cost without destroying jobs or bankrupting our government, and repeal means keeping a promise," Boehner said. "This is what we said what we'd do. We listened to the people; we made a commitment to them, a pledge to make their priorities, our priorities."
    House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) defended the law by citing some of the stories of seven Americans who gave testimony on Tuesday at a hearing called by House Democrats. "Nothing speaks more eloquently to the success of health care reform than the success of their own personal stories," she said.
    "We don't want them to think that in order for them to have the same kind of access to health care that we do, we should say to them, 'Run for Congress,'" Pelosi said.
    Throughout Wednesday's debate, some Republicans said that elements of the current law - such as a ban on denying coverage for for pre-existing conditions, or the ability for parents to keep young adult children on their insurance - might be included in a replacement bill they want to write.
    "We will address, with a replacement bill, pre-existing conditions," said Rep. Greg Walden (R-Ore.). But Walden said Republicans wanted to to keep out of the replacement bill other elements of the overhaul law, which he said included an increase in the overall cost of healthcare.
    "We can do better than this, given a chance," Walden said.
    Democrats also said they would be willing to change elements of the law.
    "This is political theater. It's a charade," Rep. Eliot Engel (D-N.Y.) said of the repeal proposal. He continued: "I'm willing to change the bill. But repealing it is the absolutely wrong way of doing it."
    The two sides still seemed a long way from actual compromise. Republicans have not said exactly how they would replace the current bill with one that provided these benefits with lower costs. And Democrats seem unwilling to budge on some elements most unpopular with Republicans, like the requirement that all individuals buy health insurance.
    The tone of Wednesday's debate was far more muted than the first debate over the healthcare overhaul--there were fewer mentions of "job-killing," or comparisons of the bill to socialism.
    But, as the day went on, both sides slipped in bitter jabs at the other. Freshman Rep. Morgan Griffith (R-Va.), compared his state's fight against the health-care overhaul to the American Revolution.
    "We did not accept the chains of George III, nor will we accept the chains of Obamacare," Griffith said.
    After him, Rep. Anthony Weiner (D-N.Y.) said Republicans were telling untruths about the healthcare legislation. He said that, if anyone watching on television was playing a drinking game that required them to drink when a Republican bent the truth, they needed to get a designated driver.
    Weiner said the Republicans' tactics should be called the "'We don't really mean it' strategy."
    The night before, Rep. Steve Cohen (D-Tenn.) had compared the Republican tactics on this issue to ones used by the Nazis.
    "They say it's a government takeover of health care, a big lie just like Goebbels," Cohen said. "You say it enough, you repeat the lie, you repeat the lie, and eventually, people believe it. Like blood libel. That's the same kind of thing.
    "The Germans said enough about the Jews and people believed it--believed it and you have the Holocaust," Cohen said.
    Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-Minn.) on Wednesday called the health care overhaul "the crown jewel of socialism." And a handful of members of both parties used heated rhetoric in charging that the health care overhaul would "kill jobs" -- or that its repeal would result in "killing Americans."
    Wednesday's floor debate was a chance for both sides to try out the arguments they are likely to use in this year's longer debate, as Congress considers changing or eliminating the healthcare legislation one piece at a time.
    Republicans largely used their floor remarks to tie the health care law to the economy, arguing that the health care overhaul will do away with fiscal discipline through increased spending and higher taxes, cost the country jobs and create economic uncertainty.
    Some lawmakers went further, arguing that the law itself is unconstitutional, would overextend the reach of government and would allow for taxpayer-funded abortions, even though Democrats say that is not the case.
    Rep. Mike Pence (R-Ind.), a prominent conservative who is mulling a bid for president or governor, said that with Wednesday's vote, House Republicans "are going to stand with the American people and vote to repeal their government takeover of health care lock, stock and barrel."
    "Now I know the other side and some liberals in the media don't like us using that term -- government takeover of health care -- but let me break it down for you: When you mandate that every American purchase health insurance whether they want it or need it or not ... and you throw in public funding of abortion against the wishes of the overwhelming majority of the American people, that's a government takeover of health care and the American people know it," Pence said in his floor remarks.
    In the battle of constituent anecdotes, Republicans told stories about small businessmen worried about the bill's costs. Democrats, on the other hand, talked about patients: people who would get help paying for pre-natal care, or the treatment of cancer or other diseases.
    At one point, Reps. Louise Slaughter (D-N.Y.) and Marsha Blackburn (R-Tenn.) sparred over how women would be affected by a repeal of the health care law.
    "Thanks to the new law, women do not have to worry anymore about being treated as second-class citizens or about being discriminated against for being a woman," Slaughter said, arguing that the health care law made it illegal for insurance companies to charge women higher premiums and would require that insurers provide coverage for victims of domestic violence.
    Blackburn shot back that the health care overhaul would make it "more difficult for women under the age of 50 and over the age of 75 to get mammograms."
    "One of our primary concerns with this legislation was the way in which women would be adversely impacted," Blackburn said, adding that "we need this bill off the books."
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...l?hpid=topnews

    This souldn't happen unless the democrats make a Faustian bargain because Getting the super majority in the Senate is gonna be next to impossible since the health care bill is the health care bill and Obama's veto going to be overridden if the senate does pass it.

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    Its a symbolic gesture but one that is appreciated.

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    It's too bad people don't blast them for wasting time and resources on meaningless garbage stunts designed to make the Pubbies have wet dreams.
    We're stuck in a bloody snowglobe.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by littlelolligagged View Post
    It's too bad people don't blast them for wasting time and resources on meaningless garbage stunts designed to make the Pubbies have wet dreams.
    Why, are there better meaningless garbage stunts for Congress to be wasting time and resources on?

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Enoch the Red View Post
    Why, are there better meaningless garbage stunts for Congress to be wasting time and resources on?
    Probably not, but they could at least pick one that wouldn't lead to Pubbie ejaculation.
    We're stuck in a bloody snowglobe.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Enoch the Red View Post
    Why, are there better meaningless garbage stunts for Congress to be wasting time and resources on?
    They could be arguing about denying the human rights of faggots, or black people (INTEGRATION IS COMMUNISM), or any number of things that has branded the Pubbie party the party of insanity and hatred. It's dubious whether debating anything in their agenda is better, but holy fuck is it all repugnant and terrible.
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Nessus View Post
    They could be arguing about denying the human rights of faggots, or black people (INTEGRATION IS COMMUNISM), or any number of things that has branded the Pubbie party the party of insanity and hatred. It's dubious whether debating anything in their agenda is better, but holy fuck is it all repugnant and terrible.
    I couldn't agree more.

    If only you were half as critical of the Bolsheviks and Nazis, you might be well on your way to becoming a halfway decent human being.

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    I think it comes with the package of loving Nazis that one hates the Bolsheviks.
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  9. #9
    You hate me?
    We're stuck in a bloody snowglobe.

  10. #10
    Well

    You're not the kind of girl I'd take home
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  11. #11
    Can't argue with that.
    We're stuck in a bloody snowglobe.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Nessus View Post
    I think it comes with the package of loving Nazis that one hates the Bolsheviks.
    You'd think so, wouldn't you?

  13. #13
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    I have just voted to scrap the federal income tax in the US. The vote was unanimous.
    Congratulations America

  14. #14
    Hazir for President!

    Also, since you're likely to see it here Hazir, I sent you a PM a while back.

    Rep. Steve Cohen on the subject:
    They say it's a government takeover of health care. A big lie just like Goebbels. You say it enough and you repeat the lie, repeat the lie, repeat the lie until eventually people believe it. Like blood libel. That's the same kind of thing, blood libel. That's the same kind of thing. ... The Germans said enough about the Jews and the people believed it and you had the Holocaust.
    Glad to see that the new era of civility and reasonability in public discourse lasted so long.

  15. #15
    Thats funny. I like how the left brings up false comparisons regarding folks in the National Socialist German Worker's Party.

  16. #16
    Let sleeping tigers lie Khendraja'aro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    Thats funny. I like how the left brings up false comparisons regarding folks in the National Socialist German Worker's Party.
    Yeah, names. Funny things.

    Did you know that the German Democratic Republic was neither a republic nor a democracy?
    When the stars threw down their spears
    And watered heaven with their tears:
    Did he smile his work to see?
    Did he who made the lamb make thee?

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Khendraja'aro View Post
    Did you know that the German Democratic Republic was neither a republic nor a democracy?
    What is it?

    Also, can someone tell m what the hell is going on? The democrats have been losing ground to the republicans, but thy are passing bills/tearing shit up. How does that work? Maybe this losing streak isn't too bad?

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Khendraja'aro View Post
    Yeah, names. Funny things.

    Did you know that the German Democratic Republic was neither a republic nor a democracy?
    The Nazis started as a genuine (nationalist) socialist party. The socialist character of the party was gradually scaled back, especially after the purging of the SA.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  19. #19
    Just because this was symbolic doesn't mean this was meaningless. Candidly, I can't think of a time in our history where our Congress has passed a massive restructuring of an entire industry and then one house of the next Congress has voted to repeal that same legislation ten months later.

    Many of the newcomers who voted for this came into office with repeal as a key point of their campaigns.

  20. #20
    Let sleeping tigers lie Khendraja'aro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    The Nazis started as a genuine (nationalist) socialist party. The socialist character of the party was gradually scaled back, especially after the purging of the SA.
    However, I doubt that the motivation for said comparisons stem from the socialist aspect of the Nazis, y'know?

    After all, there are plenty of socialist parties all around the globe, why pick that one?

    Or does Lewk try to say that our current SPD is the same as the NSDAP just because they both have "socialist" in their titles?


    Quote Originally Posted by Omega View Post
    What is it?
    Was a genuine dictatorship.
    When the stars threw down their spears
    And watered heaven with their tears:
    Did he smile his work to see?
    Did he who made the lamb make thee?

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadnaught View Post
    Just because this was symbolic doesn't mean this was meaningless. Candidly, I can't think of a time in our history where our Congress has passed a massive restructuring of an entire industry and then one house of the next Congress has voted to repeal that same legislation ten months later.

    Many of the newcomers who voted for this came into office with repeal as a key point of their campaigns.
    Well it is of course meaningless because the repeal roughly means the repeal of a law not really implemented yet. That means there are no voters who have a vested interest in the legislation itself. By the time the law has actually come into force these brave politicians will think twice to take away the entitlements of their voters.

    By 2014 all politicians will have lost their appetite for scrapping this legislation.
    Congratulations America

  22. #22
    The whole point of this action is so some politicians can go back to their constituency, point at their voting record, and say "I tried". It's called playing the long game. Seemingly meaningless ploys to set-up for some devastatingly clever maneuver later. Plus it tied up the house for a few days, keeping other issues off the table.
    The worst job in the world is better than being broke and homeless

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Hazir View Post
    Well it is of course meaningless because the repeal roughly means the repeal of a law not really implemented yet. That means there are no voters who have a vested interest in the legislation itself. By the time the law has actually come into force these brave politicians will think twice to take away the entitlements of their voters.

    By 2014 all politicians will have lost their appetite for scrapping this legislation.
    Actually, chunks of the law are being implemented piece by piece even now. That's why this controversy is ongoing.

    The folks who drafted the bill seemed to think it would gain support over time with a constant dribble of "good news" of new benefits (plus giving time for complying in stages).

    The truth is that as each stage approaches and people actually read the bill for once, it gets less popular.

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadnaught View Post
    The truth is that as each stage approaches and people actually read the bill for once, it gets less popular.
    Can you back that up with some facts?
    Faith is Hope (see Loki's sig for details)
    If hindsight is 20-20, why is it so often ignored?

  25. #25
    The poll numbers plotting a slow-but-steady increase in people who support repeal? The recent election of a few dozen House members who on a platform of repeal? The insurers getting into very public fights about premiums and asking for exemptions over specific policies in the bill?

    I mean, are you trying to argue the bill is becoming more popular?

  26. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by rumrunner View Post
    The whole point of this action is so some politicians can go back to their constituency, point at their voting record, and say "I tried". It's called playing the long game. Seemingly meaningless ploys to set-up for some devastatingly clever maneuver later. Plus it tied up the house for a few days, keeping other issues off the table.
    They must think their constituency is pretty stupid, or have incredibly short memories, since one thing the Republicans were fond of pointing out is how often the Democrats tried to do things and failed.
    . . .

  27. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    Thats funny. I like how the left brings up false comparisons regarding folks in the National Socialist German Worker's Party.
    People who vote against the Democrats hate democracy.

  28. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadnaught View Post
    The poll numbers plotting a slow-but-steady increase in people who support repeal? The recent election of a few dozen House members who on a platform of repeal? The insurers getting into very public fights about premiums and asking for exemptions over specific policies in the bill?

    I mean, are you trying to argue the bill is becoming more popular?
    Well, since you aren't citing any numbers, I will...

    Poll: Opposition to Health Care Reform Eases

    The poll finds that 40 percent of those surveyed said they support the law, while 41 percent oppose it. Just after the November congressional elections, opposition stood at 47 percent and support was 38 percent.

    As for repeal, only about one in four say they want to do away with the law completely. Among Republicans support for repeal has dropped sharply, from 61 percent after the elections to 49 percent now.
    Faith is Hope (see Loki's sig for details)
    If hindsight is 20-20, why is it so often ignored?

  29. #29
    Fact: Pieces of the bill are becoming more popular. Like children on parental policies up to age 26, pre-existing conditions being covered, removal of life-time caps, etc. Those are things the Insurance Industry has been able to hold over our heads for decades, in their rigged game.

  30. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadnaught View Post
    The poll numbers plotting a slow-but-steady increase in people who support repeal? The recent election of a few dozen House members who on a platform of repeal? The insurers getting into very public fights about premiums and asking for exemptions over specific policies in the bill?

    I mean, are you trying to argue the bill is becoming more popular?
    It'd be nice if you backed up your thoughts with actual results because all the polls I see make you out to be incredibly naive...

    Still No Popularity for GOP's Repeal Agenda
    But even after all of that, just 18% of the country supports the GOP plan to repealing the entirety of the law.

    As for the poll referred to above,

    Criticisms of Health Law Resonate - But Repeal Is Another Matter
    Finally, whatever the public's conflicts, Americans can't be accused of inconsistency; views on the law have been remarkably stable. In nearly a dozen ABC/Post polls since August 2009 it's averaged 45 percent support, 50 percent opposed -- both precisely the same as they are now.
    Where is your "slow-but-steady" increase.
    Last edited by Being; 01-22-2011 at 07:52 PM.
    Faith is Hope (see Loki's sig for details)
    If hindsight is 20-20, why is it so often ignored?

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