I have no doubt this is true, but are we talking about nations you "took an interest in" in a different way in the past?Originally Posted by RandBlade
I have no doubt this is true, but are we talking about nations you "took an interest in" in a different way in the past?
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
Like Indonesia and the Netherlands?I have no doubt this is true, but are we talking about nations you "took an interest in" in a different way in the past?
Hope is the denial of reality
Sitzkrieg, great!If just Helmut was still in the office
"Wer Visionen hat, sollte zum Arzt gehen." - Helmut Schmidt
Yeah, exactly. Although to be fair I think Britain is perhaps the only European nation that really still celebrates, or even remembers, it's own imperial past.
The light that once I thought compassion still casting shadows in your action
The words you shared were cold transactions that bring me to curse what you've done
When you're up there absorbed in greatness with such success you've grown complacent
I hope you scorch your many faces when you fly too close to the sun
While some only want to highlight the negatives, there's quite a lot to be proud about in our imperial history.
Well, I can think of one thing. What've you got?
The light that once I thought compassion still casting shadows in your action
The words you shared were cold transactions that bring me to curse what you've done
When you're up there absorbed in greatness with such success you've grown complacent
I hope you scorch your many faces when you fly too close to the sun
Quite a few, for one the abolition of the slave trade.
Merging a bunch of tribal fiefdoms into viable states. Imposition of a common language on disparate groups. Creation of infrastructure and a semblance of a mass education system. The banning of some social practices that we deem incredibly immoral (slavery for one). Creating a global economic and political structure.
Hope is the denial of reality
Like how they created countries in Africa?
Congratulations America
What's all that got to do with creating a common currency?
Ya know, as an old geezer, I actually remember a time when Canadian dimes were accepted as US dimes. Ten cents on the dollar. We "felt" we were being "generous" to our northern partners. But then it turned into to dimes and nickels ("nickel and diming one's dollars to death"), and it was strange to realize my US money was worth LESS than Canadian. Probably the first time I thought hard about 'legal tender'.
I can't imagine what this means to those who trusted the euro dollar, using a currency to unite nations....without also uniting their political structures. I guess it would be like the US and Canada having created a new North American Currency, while also keeping the US dollar and Canadian dollar, and also keeping our different political structures.
No it definitely would not. The French franc etc no longer exists.I can't imagine what this means to those who trusted the euro dollar, using a currency to unite nations....without also uniting their political structures. I guess it would be like the US and Canada having created a new North American Currency, while also keeping the US dollar and Canadian dollar, and also keeping our different political structures.
It'd be like the US, Canada, Mexico, Venezuela, Brazil and a dozen other nations deciding to give up their own currencies for one unified one.
Edit: Actually let's say the US formed a currency union with Mexico, Venezuela, Brazil and 13 other nations but Canada decided to keep their own
Yeah, the British 'abolished slavery' by ending a slave trade it was difficult to profit in, then created systems of debt in African countries and forced ownership of natural resources that makes people slaves in all but name to this day.
And why would the stronger nations decide to incorporate (and prop up) the weaker ones?
Do you think the alternative is better? Look at what's happening in Africa where the state has little authority (Somalia, Congo, South Sudan)...
You really shouldn't be making unsupported assertions as they were facts. The "system of debt" was created in the '70s by African rulers who borrowed a lot of money for white elephant projects. I fail to see how Britain was responsible for that.
The first point is even more wrong. The British outlawed the slave trade while it was still profitable, and it enforced a global ban on the slave trade at great expense to itself (including getting into numerous military exchanges to enforce it).
Hope is the denial of reality
Technically, the concept of banker's debt was introduced to Africa by Europeans.
Yes, I think the alternative of not having states constructed out of parts of hostile nations while cutting the territories fof those nations over separate states might actually have spared Africa a lot of misery.
I must say I think it's kind of funny how German politicians are giving the Brits a taste of their own remedy; making remarks they know will upset.
Congratulations America
You think non-ceasing tribal warfare would be preferable? Sorry, but the numbers simply don't play out. Tribal warfare kills far more people in Africa than do larger scale disputes (whether intra-state or interstate). The only real exception is the Congo Civil War.
By that you mean allowing people to take loans? What an awful practice that is. People should have to buy houses and expand businesses out of their own pocket! And God forbid farmers took a loan to improve their yield with the knowledge that the higher yield will help pay off the loan. Everyone should be a subsistence farmer instead.
Hope is the denial of reality
Are you so naieve as to believe that some conflicts were not sparked by foreign manipulation with a goal of either supplying arms in the conflict or securing natural resources during or after the conflict?
I understand that you're pointing out the fact that Africa's part of the modern global economy, but my original statement was 'created systems of debt' and that's what you wanted some explanation about how 'britain' (i.e. Europe) was responsible for that.By that you mean allowing people to take loans? What an awful practice that is. People should have to buy houses and expand businesses out of their own pocket! And God forbid farmers took a loan to improve their yield with the knowledge that the higher yield will help pay off the loan. Everyone should be a subsistence farmer instead.
I think it goes too far to think of the Brits as so evil that they actually wanted the continent of Africa to fail, but they sure as hell didn't do anything towards giving their old colonies a fighting chance. And Loki, I think there would have been less wars of a lesser scale if there would not have been a re-division of Africa disregarding tribal loyalties. There is a host of African states that have no more right to exist than the Habsburg prison of nations.
Congratulations America
Are you so naive as to think that many conflicts were avoided by similar foreign manipulation?
What does that even mean? Is this some South African socialist code word for something?I understand that you're pointing out the fact that Africa's part of the modern global economy, but my original statement was 'created systems of debt' and that's what you wanted some explanation about how 'britain' (i.e. Europe) was responsible for that.
Hope is the denial of reality
Loki...
In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.
You're dodging my argument. Sure, some types of intra-state wars have increased due to the creation of modern African states, but many other types of intra-state wars have been avoided for that same reason. In the past, most men of fighting age would be involved in ritual warfare with tribal/village opponents or fight over local resources. Now such fighting is limited to organized militias, which make up a tiny percentage of the male population.
Hope is the denial of reality
Since Momo supports the African National Congress, which is officially socialist and has a significant Marxist base, I really don't see why my assumption is unreasonable.Loki...
Hope is the denial of reality
I meant using 'socialist' as a swear word.
In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.
It was a descriptive term. Though the phrase Momo was using does seem to be from some propaganda leaflet.
Hope is the denial of reality
It was also the only descriptive term that could be construed as the mocking one by polite society
In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.
I don't support the ANC.
Just the inane rhetoric of their Marxist wing?
Hope is the denial of reality
Almost funny, but there is no reason to assume that civil wars are any less bloody than inter-state wars.
Congratulations America
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