Dieting

[RandBlade]

So it's the New Year, traditional time for people to try and diet for a day or two until they give up. Personally I've struggled with my weight on and off for years. I want to get in shape for my wedding next year. Ideally I'd like to lose 5 Stone (70 lbs). I currently weigh 15st 6lb (216) and ideally want to get to about 10st 6 (146). The weddings end of May next year so although I want to lose about a third of my weight, it's just 1lb a week which is quite safe.

My view on dieting is to avoid any fad diets - Eat less, move more.

However my problems is my lifestyle. I'm quite active, but can do quite long hours and often in my car for ages. So I frequently tend to live off McDonalds, Subway, Dominos, KFC etc - plus local Chinese or curries. It's difficult to manage food to take in the car and eat there, drive thrus are so tempting.

So trying a new plan. Make sure to have breakfast every day - no more McMuffins - find the time to have a proper homemade dinner each night. In between fill up on bananas. Bananas are easy to keep in the car, come individually wrapped etc. Yesterday did this and every time hungry and for lunch I'd eat another banana. Ate 6 throughout the day and never felt starving hungry. Other advantage is so cheap, just bought 4 bunches (24 bananas just counted) and it only cost £2.80 - thinking that should last 4 days and couldn't even get one burger for that. Especially that's just 10p each or just 70p a day if I go through an entire bunch.

Anyone got any thoughts on diets, dieting etc?

[Loki]

Don't know what your time looks like, but from the people I've seen around me, the only consistent way to lose wait is to hit the gym. Diets are hard to stick to and have a very gradual effect even if you do. There's no way you can lose 70 pounds healthily in half a year. I'd cut back on the fast food, but don't significantly decrease calorie intake. Instead, try working out for an hour a day (you could start with 3-4 times a week). I know five males who were roughly your weight (one was much heavier), and none lost the weight without extensive time at the gym/playing soccer/basketball.

I can't picture you at that weight by the way. As I recall, we weighed about the same when we met, and I'm currently 10st 2 (almost entirely a function of my metabolism and not due to the advice above).

[Nessus]

I think Loki's right. Reducing energy intake is tricky, and you'll have to think hard about what precisely to ingest to get all those goddamn nutritional things we need. It is not easy being a rat. And I mean that of us as a species rather than of you as an individual!

It will be tricky to invest, say, an hour a day into a work-out, but if you don't mind breaking routine, maybe something like an hour of swimming in the mornings? Or an hour of weights at the evening? Ostensibly you as a respectable business man already have some sort of fairly steady life-style, into which it is not excessively hard to swap around hours.

If you don't feel queasy about changing around two hours per day, I really, really recommend cooking. I've always found that it's a very pleasureful, relaxing activity. That way it is easy for you to adjust precisely what you ingest (without popping pills), and I bet you it won't take that long until you can make meals that out-taste Mickey Dee's.

It might not be a good idea to eat a whole bunch of bananas every day, or even most days. They have rather high concentrations of radioactives in them, I can do the math for you if you really want me to, but seat of my pants estimate is that you're upping your yearly rad count by easily the amount of a few international flights. Do you do a lot of flying? And do you live close to bed-rock? It's not the most pressing concern, but that thing adds up, and that's the most pernicious thing. You really don't want a cancer of the gut, those things are the most vicious.

[Veldan Rath]

I cut out soda (diet and regular) just to stop the gain and bacon only as a treat on the weekends. Eating more fruits as snacks...

[RandBlade]

Don't know what your time looks like, but from the people I've seen around me, the only consistent way to lose wait is to hit the gym. Diets are hard to stick to and have a very gradual effect even if you do. There's no way you can lose 70 pounds healthily in half a year. I'd cut back on the fast food, but don't significantly decrease calorie intake. Instead, try working out for an hour a day (you could start with 3-4 times a week). I know five males who were roughly your weight (one was much heavier), and none lost the weight without extensive time at the gym/playing soccer/basketball.

I can't picture you at that weight by the way. As I recall, we weighed about the same when we met, and I'm currently 10st 2 (almost entirely a function of my metabolism and not due to the advice above).

I don't have the time to go to the gym. I joined one last year but never went after January, despite being in a 12 month contract which I cancelled now so my membership expired New Years Eve. Working a lot doesn't leave much time for the Gym. I am active though, and do have the Wii Fit and other Wii and Kinect exercise games.

As for the wedding its May NEXT year so that's 70lbs to be lost in a year and a half, not half a year.

[Loki]

How can you have time for Wii Fit but not gym? As far as I'm concerned, these things are gimmicks. They might help someone who's grossly overweight lose some weight, but I can't imagine it can help someone go down to 146 pounds. What about daily jogs? Or longish bike-rides?

[Khendraja'aro]

Well, basically, your choices are the two: Either up your energy consumption (i.e. sports) or down your energy intake (eat less).

Everything else (low-carb, whatever) seems to be mainly hokus-pokus.

[DecoyMilk]

I got loads of stuff you should heed!

Firstly, you shouldn't eat more than one banana a day.

Secondly, if you had to fix one thing out of diet or exercise, make it diet EVERY TIME. If you're consuming 2500+ calories every day, then no amount of exercise is going to effectively burn calories at a safe and continuous level. However, a diet that is lower in calories, higher in protein and lower in carbs and fat will always lose you weight.

Thirdly, and I cannot stress this enough, DRINK MORE WATER. Eight glasses a day, minimum. For me, it's the hardest thing to do, but it's so important and you can't effectively burn calories without it.

My last tip to you is to count calories. It sounds long winded and boring, but you get the hang of it quite quickly, and you can quite often look at a meal and have a rough idea of how many calories you're going to consume.

If you're not sure how many calories you should be consuming a day, do this formula to calculate your Base Metabolic Rate (BMR):

(a) Firstly, you need your current weight and your body fat %. You can calculate bodyfat in a number of ways – but for a decent proxy just go here http://www.bmi-calculator.net/body-fat-calculator/ and put in some details.

(b) Then, work out your LEAN body weight. This is just your total weight x (1-your BF%). You’ll need it in kgs, so weight yourself in kg if possible.

c) Then apply the following formula to calculate your BMR:

BMR = 370 + 21.6 x Lean body mass in kg

This will give you the total calories you should eat to MAINTAIN WEIGHT in a TOTALLY SEDENTARY STATE (i.e. lying in bed all day)

d) Then apply an “activity factor” to calculate your daily calorie requirement for weight maintenance:

Sedentary (no exercise, desk job) = 1.2x
Lightly active (light exercise/activity 1-3 times a week) = 1.375x
Moderately active (moderate exercise 3-5 times a week) = 1.55x
Very active (hard exercise 6-7 times a week) = 1.725x
Extremely active (Full-time athelete) = 1.9x

e) Then, use the above result to TRIM this maintenance calorie level to give you your FAT LOSS calorie target.

As far as I’m concerned, the MAGIC NUMBER is 20% below your maintenance level

If you go below this "20% under" level for an extended period of time, your body will most likely respond by going into starvation mode, your metabolic rate will slow down, you will feel lethargic, you’ll start to burn lean mass, you’ll crave food and eventually your fat loss will slow to a crawl.



Here's an example. Imagine a man that’s 15stone with a 38” waist. He’s a lazy f**kstick who does no exercise.

a) Calculate body fat = c.22% (using the website I linked above)
b) Lean body weight = 210lbs x (1-0.22) = 163.8 lbs = 74.5kg
c) BMR = 370 + (21.6 x 74.5) = 1,978 calories
d) Apply sedentary activity factor = 1,978 x 1.2 = 2,374 calories
e) Trim by 20% to achieve calorie target for fat loss = 2,374 x 0.8 = 1,900 calories

Therefore, by these calculations, this particular guy should be eating 1,900 calories per day for fat loss. He should NOT go any lower than this to keep his metabolic rate up and continue to burn fat and not lean mass. I repeat: NO LOWER THAN 20% BELOW MAINTENANCE CALORIES IS WISE.

Work that out for you Rand, then eat it. Drink more water. Obviously exercise is always important, but if you get the diet nailed down, then you can focus on the exercise. You're going for a life change rather than a quick fix, so plan in advance and make sure it's something you can sustain. Do you reckon you can eat bananas 3 times a day forever? If you get bored of it, you'll just quit.

If you want help counting calories, I used www.myfitnesspal.com. I found it really useful on a day to day basis. I lost a stone from using that website, eating right and drinking lots of water

I have lots of other stuff to say too, but that's probably enough to get you going for now

[RandBlade]

My first thought of the Wii Fit was that it would be a gimmick, but it (and other games I've got like The Biggest Loser) does make you sweat. I think that anything that gets your heart-rate up and sweating is exercise.

As for why on time, it takes about 10 minutes to drive to the gym, 10 minutes to get changed etc, 10 minutes to drive back - that's half an hour and that's before you've even done a bit of exercise. In a spare half an hour at home you can do a bit of exercise. Also not restricted on hours.

Firstly, you shouldn't eat more than one banana a day.

Why?

As for the rest, ballpark figure need about 1900 calories a day.

[DecoyMilk]

I think it's to do with potassium levels, but more so than that, there are just other fruits that are better. Apples, for one.


I started on about 1900 when I first started out. As I was losing weight, I recalculated it and needed to eat a bit less as I went. It all fell apart a bit from me since my wedding, but new year, new start and all that. Once you have a hang on calorie counting, think about zig zagging your calorie intake, which means you eat your 1900 calories for 3 days, then on the 4th day, eat your maintenace level, which is whatever you had before you multiplied by 0.8. So a 4 day stretch would look like this:

Day 1: 1900 calories
Day 2: 1900 calories
Day 3: 1900 calories
Day 4: 2300 calories

Repeat...

The theory behind it is that it 'tricks' your metabolism into thinking that you're not restricting calories at all. I think this is a well known trick, but many don't listen to it because it sounds counter intuitive. But work it does.

Anyway, I'll shut up now. best of luck

[RandBlade]

From what I've read through Google it seems that most people have too little potassium not too much, plus the body's good at handling potassium in fruit and simply processing or passing it if it gets too much (as opposed to supplements) unless you have kidney problems. Not sure I like the idea of radiation but not heard that elsewhere yet. The problem is it seems very hard to get any actual scientific-based facts rather than agendas on the subject. EG one cranky site keeps popping up saying to eat 30-50 a day, eat raw food and be a vegan - I have no intention of that! I like the idea of zig-zagging, that's a good tip. Like taking a rest day I guess. Plus easier to keep on top if you know you can have treats/relax every few days.

[Nessus]

It's just that K40 is one of the most significant background radiation sources, and well bananas tend to have potassium. I don't remember which chain it's from, thorium maybe?

Anyhows, Wikipedia (I know, I know...) says it's only 0.1 micros per banana (rounded up!), so my seat of pants was pretty off. Go ahead and eat bananas.

e: It's not a daughter of anyone, so I guess you can thank the stars for it...

[wiggin]

RB - I applaud your attempts to eat more healthily (though I'm afraid I can't give much advice on dieting - I just eat balanced meals and hope), but exercise is important for far more than just losing weight.

Even thin people can develop atherosclerosis and other issues even if they think they are 'healthy'. Cardio exercise is a real necessity IMO for anyone, regardless of weight. I've never been concerned about weight - I hover around 132-133 lb (~60 kg) and 1.88 m. But I'm very concerned about my relatively sedentary lifestyle - like most professionals, I spend most of my day sitting down at a computer, so my only real exercise is when I make a special effort. Wii Fit/etc. is all right, but I'd recommend something more active like a team sport (tennis/soccer/basketball/whatever) or running/biking around. Most of these have the added advantage of including high-impact events, which helps your bone health as well (Wii/Kinect do NOT do this very well). I wouldn't hit the weights or any other resistance exercises unless you really want to work on muscle bulk; it frankly isn't as important for health (though working on core strength can be useful; planks etc. - Wii Fit can actually do this pretty well).

[Nessus]

Planning for longevity is a loser's game. There will, relatively speaking soon for us 20-somethings, times of crises that will escalate to war. That war must, as the ones before it, build on the lessons of those before. Therefore it seems likely we shall at least be human collateral if not combatants ourselves. Randy wants to look nice for his wedding, to appear the best he thinks he is for a woman. That is a reasonable goal. To expect to live to old age? Not really.

[Kazuha Vinland]

That you are talking about dieting in the first place, means you're approaching it wrong. As you've already stated, you have tried to lose weight, but never managed to keep it that way. Similarly, dieting is the same thing as a temporary pattern of eating. It's not a lifestyle, and hence you won't permanently stay at your achieved downsize. Dieting can also cause a lack of important nutritions that degrades your health.

To think of it another way, healthy people usually do not diet. They eat regularly. What they avoid is continously eating take-away and fill-in meals in terms of snacks. That you've got to do as well.

So really, if you're serious about this, then ignore all the talk about potassium etc. It is important that you get enough of proteins and fat, but honestly, it's quite easy to determine what is a healthy meal and what is not.

Exercising is indeed key. Many of you have stated that hitting the gym might be a good idea. Well, to add bulk it is. To lose weight there are better ideas. The best one is to start jogging. It is handsdown the most energy consuming activity which at the same time can be adjusted to any level and age. Start slow and short, and then increase the distance first, the speed second. If you weigh a lot, then it's surely hell to endure, but just think of that pain as weight going away. I would start with finding a route with a soft terrrain (anything but asphalt). Your first session of the week should be a long jog to prepare your body for the load the rest of the week. Take it real slow, and last as long as you can.

Week 1
Monday: 30 minutes slow jog. You shall be able to talk normally.
Wednesday: 10 minutes jog at normal pace. You should push yourself so that you can taste the exhaustion at goal.
Friday: Intervals. Start with 4x1 minutes run at a high pace. Allow yourself 30 seconds break between each run.

Week 2
Monday: 30 minutes slow jog.
Wednesday: 15 minutes jog at normal pace.
Friday: Intervals. Start with 4x1.5 minutes run at a high pace.


You'll find that a 50% increase is actually not that much. You'll also find your appetite changing. It'll become monstrous, so be sure to eat healthy food.

[wiggin]

For the record, I want to caution people against getting too much into the running thing. Some running is all right, but if you really get into it in a crazy way, it will come to bite you in the ass later. I've spent 6 years doing research on osteoarthritis, and it ain't pretty. A moderate, well-rounded exercise routine will work just as well from a health perspective as going all-out in a single activity, and it will probably result in lower wear and tear on the knees/etc.

I know those nihilists out there (ahem, Nessie) will feel this is wasted advice - who cares if you can't walk when you're 55? - but please take my word for it. It doesn't take that much effort to do things healthily, and the payoff in the future (should said future exist) will be much higher.

[Lebanese Dragon]

I don't have the time to go to the gym. I joined one last year but never went after January, despite being in a 12 month contract which I cancelled now so my membership expired New Years Eve. Working a lot doesn't leave much time for the Gym. I am active though, and do have the Wii Fit and other Wii and Kinect exercise games.

Food

I agree with Nessie on the don't spam one fruit, manys nutrients go to waste when you overstock, and you'll also taste wise get sick of them. So variety is key here. Carrots, brocoli, apples, oranges, and yes bananas. I like the idea of cooking for yourself at home looking up some sort of health guide to make sure you get well rounded nutrients.

Advice I like as far as eating is concerned is the "Neanderthal Man Diet" The concept is since we evovled eating the basic foods that neanderthals ate way back then, this suggests our digestive systems will have evolved around those foods so you get more bang for your buck from eating those natural foods (we evovled on/around). Aka eat meats, vegetables, and fruits, but avoid processed food (milk, bread, or any pastery), and even cooking food can take out nutritive value as well (some foods must be cooked).

Working Out

As for going to the gym, you don't have to go to the gym to work out. Do it at home, but be consistent (treat it like a JOB)! If you purchased some 25 pound free weights, you can do a range of excercises, while building the most muscle. Studies show them being superior to machine workouts. You get the wider range of motion, control, and the stabilizer muscles are built up. Also running, sit-ups, and push-ups are great ways to tone and lose body fat. If you're just interested in losing weight running 3 times a week for 30min will do it for you. If you find yourself capping out in weight loss, just need to increase the distance, or improve the time, or the acceleration. (Set goals and keep track of what you accomplish). That's the key to success, just like everything else, work hard! Good luck Rand.

[Hazir]

6 bananas in between of meals ? No wonder you didn't feel hungry; that's easily 1000 calories and about 40% of what your average daily intake should be if you are not trying to loose weight. You better reconsider this approach.

A very good way to improve your diet without going hungry is cutting out anything processed. If only because you will then at least know what it is you are eating. Knowing what you eat is the first step to controling it.

[Kazuha Vinland]

For the record, I want to caution people against getting too much into the running thing. Some running is all right, but if you really get into it in a crazy way, it will come to bite you in the ass later. I've spent 6 years doing research on osteoarthritis, and it ain't pretty. A moderate, well-rounded exercise routine will work just as well from a health perspective as going all-out in a single activity, and it will probably result in lower wear and tear on the knees/etc.

I know those nihilists out there (ahem, Nessie) will feel this is wasted advice - who cares if you can't walk when you're 55? - but please take my word for it. It doesn't take that much effort to do things healthily, and the payoff in the future (should said future exist) will be much higher.

So you are really saying that jogging on soft terrain three times a week will kill your knees when you're 55? I'm sure your research disproves all other research then...

[GGT]

So it's the New Year, traditional time for people to try and diet for a day or two until they give up. Personally I've struggled with my weight on and off for years. I want to get in shape for my wedding next year. Ideally I'd like to lose 5 Stone (70 lbs). I currently weigh 15st 6lb (216) and ideally want to get to about 10st 6 (146). The weddings end of May next year so although I want to lose about a third of my weight, it's just 1lb a week which is quite safe.

My view on dieting is to avoid any fad diets - Eat less, move more.

However my problems is my lifestyle. I'm quite active, but can do quite long hours and often in my car for ages. So I frequently tend to live off McDonalds, Subway, Dominos, KFC etc - plus local Chinese or curries. It's difficult to manage food to take in the car and eat there, drive thrus are so tempting.

So trying a new plan. Make sure to have breakfast every day - no more McMuffins - find the time to have a proper homemade dinner each night. In between fill up on bananas. Bananas are easy to keep in the car, come individually wrapped etc. Yesterday did this and every time hungry and for lunch I'd eat another banana. Ate 6 throughout the day and never felt starving hungry. Other advantage is so cheap, just bought 4 bunches (24 bananas just counted) and it only cost £2.80 - thinking that should last 4 days and couldn't even get one burger for that. Especially that's just 10p each or just 70p a day if I go through an entire bunch.

Anyone got any thoughts on diets, dieting etc?

Uhm, trying to lose weight in time for a wedding (and those ever-lasting pictures) can be done all sorts of ways. Even drastic and unhealthy ways. Ask any bride starving on carrot sticks and tuna fish to squeeze into that gown she picked....

Anyway, Rand sweetie, my best advice would be NOT to diet. Too stressful during an already stressful time. Stress unleashes steroids like cortisone that mess with glucose metabolism and sleep patterns and....well, don't DIET or change your lifestyle too drastically while anticipating a life-changing event like marriage. You're rational enough to know that's not wise.

Having said that, limit bananas. They're in the 'perfect food group', but not eaten every time you're hungry! They're a binding food, which means they're great if you've got diarrhea....but can constipate if eaten daily. Not to sound too crude, but all the thin people I've ever known (with those fast metabolisms) take at least one crap a day. Not loose stools, and nothing strained....just easily passing food debris through their GI tract. Some people use probiotics or special yogurts, some try extra fiber or supplements, but the key seems to be emptying the intestines fully and daily. Sitting in a car hour upon hour can undermine that. It's the trucker syndrome of trying to keep driving, not wanting to pull over to take a poo, or not wanting to use a dirty public restroom. (Truckers end up with constipation, belly fat, and hemorrhoids, btw.)

If you don't have time to make a "proper" breakfast or dinner each night, don't beat yourself up over it. Grab an apple or orange on your way out the door. And FFS don't try to change your lifestyle while picking out china patterns, making guest lists, and all the other stuff that comes with (formal) wedding planning! KISS---keep it simple, silly.

Drink lots of water. Fill a gallon jug and keep it in your car. Drink water when you feel hungry driving, wait 30 minutes and those drive thru fast food joints may lose their appeal. Nothing wrong with the occasional donut and coffee, either.

Your upcoming nuptials mean SO much more than your weight, or what size tux you'll need. Don't lose focus on what really matters.

[Aimless]

Go to sleep on time. This is the single most useful health-related advice I can give you (or anyone here, including myself). And sleep well. If you must, get a darth vader mask


Taking the time to cook and eat proper food is also a good idea, for the soul as much for the body But with busy schedules it might be tricky, so you might want to set up a good system for making sure you always have home-made food ready to go (some people have cooking days for example, where they make meals for a whole week, but it's not for everyone).

Try out new food ideas with your partner. Some couples adopt a GI-centered lifestyle for example, and it works great for them. My girlfriend's parents did this a few years back, and they've both lost a great deal of weight in addition to feeling (and probably being) more healthy. Find something that appeals to you if I may, I'd like to suggest one vegetarian day per week, for the sake of variety as well as for the planet.


Running is good, swimming might be better. Even walking is great. Try picking something you can occasionally do with your lady. Frequent longish walks are not to be underestimated. I think I lost about 10 - 15 kg my first year of college due to eating less and taking long walks every day. It's also very pleasant when you have good company, although it may be dangerous in England.





It's an unfortunate fact that, to this day, the evidence is fairly slim (or, at best, ambiguous) for messing about with food composition (proportions of protein, fat, carbs, etc) rather than with caloric intake for weight-loss purposes. With that said, you might still feel better changing the composition of your meals and that may make it easier for you to stick to whatever dietary changes you decide to make.

[Aimless]

And whatever you do don't fall for the water craze. It was wrong 100 years ago and it still kinda is.

[GGT]

Keeping drinking water in his car isn't exactly the "water craze". If you don't drive much, let alone for miles or hours on end....you wouldn't understand that thirst can be confused for hunger, or how appealing those fast food drive-thrus can be. For regular drivers, even pulling over to use their restrooms can turn into a master feat by refusing to buy a coffee or burger, because it smells so good. And who'd want to use a dirty gas station that requires keys, just to take a piss?

[Kazuha Vinland]

I agree completely to keep it simple. We seem to have experts of every darn field in here, telling you to count calories and prepare your meals using an atom scale weight. It's nothing like that. Eating healthy is way more important than eating to lose weight. A varied nourishment gives you excess energy to use after work on exercising. I mentioned jogging because you said you didn't have a lot of spare time available. If you are running at a speed of 11 minutes a mile (very light jogging), you spend around 850 calories an hour at your weight. If you run intervals at say 8 minutes a mile, you spend 1150. Likewise if you bike at 10 miles an hour (leisurely, which is what you can manage right now), you spend only 370. That gap is huge. So yes, running is the best in your current condition, and will continue to be so when you shape up. (source).

[Aimless]

No "drink lots of water" is "the water craze"

[Aimless]

Hey RB do you have like an exercise bike or a cross-trainer or something at home?

[GGT]

No "drink lots of water" is "the water craze"

No, drinking water instead of coffee or soda isn't "the water craze" you're thinking of....where people try to drink eight 16 ounce glasses of water per day.

Coffee and soda aren't bad per se, and have large amounts of water. (All our food contains water. Refined breads have more water content than whole grain breads.)

But they can also contain things like caffeine, high fructose corn syrup, sodium and potassium, or artificial sweeteners and preservatives that change metabolism and blood glucose in ways plain water doesn't.

[Lebanese Dragon]

So basically the conclusion is run away from your problems in life, run away from your weight, and in this one rare case they'll actually go away.

[Steely Glint]

I currently weigh 15st 6lb (216) and ideally want to get to about 10st 6 (146).

How tall are you, Randell?

[RandBlade]

5'8"