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Thread: German Education system

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    If the organization has explicitly illegal goals, I fail to see what the problem is.
    No trial? Punishing people without trial for acts committed before those acts were illegal? Collective punishment without trial?
    "One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."

  2. #32
    The organization engaged in numerous illegal acts (that were illegal at the time). The members willingly joined an organization that they knew engaged in those illegal acts. The act of membership proves guilt. You also need to learn the meaning of collective punishment: hint, it's punishing many for the crimes of a few. It's inconceivable that mid to high ranking Nazi officials didn't partake in at least some of that regime's crimes; same for al-Qaeda.

    I take it you're against the killing of known al-Qaeda members (to humor you, let's assume they're not known to have personally blown anyone up yet) without providing them a trial?
    Hope is the denial of reality

  3. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    The organization engaged in numerous illegal acts (that were illegal at the time).
    How does that matter? Do you expect the new democratic country of Germany to uphold the old laws of Nazi Germany?

    The members willingly joined an organization that they knew engaged in those illegal acts. The act of membership proves guilt. You also need to learn the meaning of collective punishment: hint, it's punishing many for the crimes of a few. It's inconceivable that mid to high ranking Nazi officials didn't partake in at least some of that regime's crimes;
    I agree, but which crimes did they partake in? If you're not punishing them as individuals for their individual crimes then you're punishing them as a collective. If you're punishing them as individuals for being members of the Nazi party then you are instead effectively criminalising political affiliation rather than the crimes they committed. While the act of membership proves guilt it is not in itself sufficient for deciding what the punishment should be.

    I take it you're against the killing of known al-Qaeda members (to humor you, let's assume they're not known to have personally blown anyone up yet) without providing them a trial?
    I'm not sure if this is a trick question, but I do indeed have some difficulties with stomaching such things in general although to be fair it's mostly because of the risk of innocent people also being harmed. That being said, you guys are currently at war with al-Qaeda. Was Germany at war with the Nazi party in 1989?
    "One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."

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