Israel

[Wraith]

So I'm leaving for Israel in a few weeks. I'll be in Tel Aviv. I know a few of you are quite familiar with the place, any tips/warnings or other things I should know about? I'm told that Saturdays can be quirky - elevators stop on every floor, most places are closed so I should have food bought beforehand. I'll be arriving on a Saturday - the hotel restaurant will probably still be serving, right? And you can't turn right on red over there? I thought Israel was civilized!

Are there any cultural things I need to know about? What's the best way to disguise my gentile nature so my blood doesn't get stolen at night? I've been told to be careful about shaking hands with/touching any women who might be muslim. Anything else worth knowing about?

Worth seeing tourist sites near Tel Aviv would be nice to know too. I won't actually have much time for tourism, so despite the length of my stay I won't be able to visit many places.

[Hazir]

So I'm leaving for Israel in a few weeks. I'll be in Tel Aviv. I know a few of you are quite familiar with the place, any tips/warnings or other things I should know about? I'm told that Saturdays can be quirky - elevators stop on every floor, most places are closed so I should have food bought beforehand. I'll be arriving on a Saturday - the hotel restaurant will probably still be serving, right? And you can't turn right on red over there? I thought Israel was civilized!

Are there any cultural things I need to know about? What's the best way to disguise my gentile nature so my blood doesn't get stolen at night? I've been told to be careful about shaking hands with/touching any women who might be muslim. Anything else worth knowing about?

Worth seeing tourist sites near Tel Aviv would be nice to know too. I won't actually have much time for tourism, so despite the length of my stay I won't be able to visit many places.

The handshaking thing is easy; you simply slow down and let them initiate a handshake if they do those. You get used to it soon enough. Head scarves are usually an easy reminder.

[wiggin]

Really overwhelmed with work today, but I'll try to remember to respond tomorrow. Re: handshakes, it's generally an issue for many religious Muslim and Jewish women. Easiest just not to stick out your hand for any woman and let them decide. A lot of people will still shake hands if offered, even if they wouldn't do so on their own. So I wouldn't sweat it.

Honestly, there aren't many cultural things you should be worried about. Some restaurants might not be able to provide certain things you order (bacon, cheeseburgers, shrimp, etc.) but plenty of others will have them. As for Saturday, it really depends where you are. Jerusalem's streets are largely deserted and most things are closed down - in Tel Aviv more things are open, but it's still a different vibe. They'll have plenty of open restaurants, and you will be able to get food at your hotel.

You generally don't tip cabbies, but make sure you negotiate a rate before entering; they often don't use meters and will gladly rob you blind. Haggling is common in less formal transactions (open air markets, services, etc.) but generally not in more 'Western' style stores.

Tel Aviv is supposed to have a truly fantastic club scene, especially on Friday night, though I've never actually gone. If you're into that, I can get some recommendations from my friends and relatives who live there. I can probably do the same for restaurants, though I won't know which are for sure open on Saturday.

In general people work Sunday-Thursday, though some people also work half days on Friday. I don't know how that will mesh with your own work schedule, but be prepared to switch if everyone else is working on Sunday.

In Gush Dan (the greater Tel Aviv metropolitan area) there are obviously plenty of touristy things to do, but there's WAY more if you take some day trips to other areas of the country - obviously Jerusalem, but also some fantastic stuff up in the Galilee and down in the Negev desert. It all depends on what you like - nightlife? culture? archaeology? history? nature? military stuff? I can find stuff pretty close to Tel Aviv in all of those, but some places will be better.

If you're driving, be prepared for awful traffic during a rather extended rush hour. Intercity trains are comfortable and generally decent, but sometimes they run late. There are no intracity trains to speak of outside of a new light rail in Jerusalem. There's lots of intracity buses that are heavily used and relatively cheap, though not always much fun (fares are not flat, but rather dependent on point of debarkation - you will have to tell the driver when you board). Intercity buses are a bit nicer, but take their time. Most people will have decent to good English, so you shouldn't have an issue asking for directions or recommendations.

Security-wise, don't be surprised to be asked routinely if you're carrying weapons (you're a male adult, so the chances are high) and your car trunk will be searched when entering some parking structures (e.g. malls). To you, it will likely appear to be an armed camp - most places have well-armed security, especially public spaces like malls or public transit, and assault rifles are carried by most soldiers (of which there are many). On Thursday evenings and Sunday mornings transport will be a madhouse as soldiers commute to and from their bases, so ideally avoid traveling much at those times. Violent crime is not a significant concern (nor is terrorism), but property theft and the occasional mugging are not uncommon. Watch out for pickpocketers, keep track of your valuables, and take reasonable precautions when walking around at night - much like any other city. NEVER leave your bag unattended, you will quickly end up with bag confetti after the bomb squad is done with it.

Uh, there's probably more but I am indeed busy. Will try to come back later with concrete suggestions on what to do.

I will be in the country in the week bracketing Thanksgiving; I have a pretty busy schedule with various family visits and a small attempt at actual vacation, but maybe we can arrange a meetup. If you're really lucky you might get to meet Mrs. Wiggin.

[Wraith]

Some Jewish women can't get handshakes either? I didn't know about that one - it makes things easier in a way, though. I just won't extend my hand to any women.

You don't tip cabbies, is tipping waiters still a thing?

Another question: I'm expecting not to have too much trouble only speaking English. Someone else told me that I won't need to know any Hebrew as long as I'm in Tel Aviv, but if I play tourist in Jerusalem I should probably have a fluent guide. Is this accurate? Related: I need to know all the Hebrew curse words. Give them to me phonetically, please.

[wiggin]

Some Jewish women can't get handshakes either? I didn't know about that one - it makes things easier in a way, though. I just won't extend my hand to any women.

Among the very religious, Jewish men and women who are unrelated do not touch. You're unlikely to run into many very religious Jewish women in your day-to-day existence, but it's definitely a possibility. A general rule of thumb: if she's wearing pants, she'll be happy to shake your hand. If she's wearing a skirt and relatively modest clothing, it's a crapshoot. Headscarves (for Muslims) are generally a sign to avoid shaking hands.

Honestly, it's just easiest to let them make the first move. Trust me, no one is going to mistake you for a religious Muslim or Jew.

You don't tip cabbies, is tipping waiters still a thing?

*I* tip cabbies, since I live in America (Fuck Yeah!). However, Israeli's don't. You definitely tip in restaurants and bars - around 10-15%. Depending on the hotel, it's sometimes nice to tip staff there something small (bellhops, etc.) but not really required.

Remember, the shekel is about $3.50, so generally people tip in increments of 5 shekalim, which is roughly 1 euro or about $1.40.

Another question: I'm expecting not to have too much trouble only speaking English. Someone else told me that I won't need to know any Hebrew as long as I'm in Tel Aviv, but if I play tourist in Jerusalem I should probably have a fluent guide. Is this accurate? Related: I need to know all the Hebrew curse words. Give them to me phonetically, please.

I don't think that's very accurate at all. There are probably more Anglos living in Jerusalem than Tel Aviv, even. Oh, sure, if you run across some Arab or a Haredi (aka ultra-Orthodox) Jew, there's a chance their English will be poor. But your random Joe Schmoe there will probably have just as good Hebrew, especially at the big touristy sites (Old City, various museums, etc.). You might want a tour guide in Jerusalem just because the city is a nightmare to navigate, but honestly I don't think it's really that important otherwise. Don't wander into East Jerusalem or Mea Shearim without a guide, though.

If you're driving alone, be VERY CAREFUL when driving near the Green Line. Depending on the security situation, it is sometimes quite possible to accidentally drive into Area A without realizing it. There are warning signs - copious ones - but it happens several dozen times a year. Often the drivers are just found by the PA police and redirected, but people have been stoned before. The Green Line is not well marked on maps or GPS, so just make sure you're following main roads.

Hebrew doesn't have curse words, they're all borrowed from other languages. A few sorta-curses that don't have much force, plus some borrowed:

1. Ben Zona (lit. 'son of a whore', roughly means bastard or SOB)
2. Kalba (bitch)
3. Koos (cunt, borrowed from Arabic I believe, do NOT call someone this unless you really mean it)
Similar: Koos Imashkha (Your mother's cunt, from Arabic, more like 'fuck your mother')
4. Leh tizdayen (Go fuck yourself (male), well literally go penis yourself since Hebrew doesn't have a word for fuck. 'Leh' should have a diacritical mark over the h, it's kinda pronounced like the ch in Loch Ness.)
5. Mamzer (bastard)
6. Timtzotz li (suck my dick (male), female is 'timtzitzi li'. Dick is implied here; kinda like saying 'suck it!' but with a bit more force)
7. Leh la'azazel (go to Hell, roughly)
8. Sharmuta (whore, from Arabic. Not nice)
9. Zayin (dick)
10. Sheet (Israeli pronunciation of shit)

Er, that's some basic ones. There's more, obviously, but many are just variations on a theme. Pronunciation of most Hebrew words places the stress on the last syllable; that is the case of all of the words above except for 8 and 9, where it is on the penultimate syllable.

[GGT]

Wow, you make it sound like Israel is still living in the 18th century. Women wearing pants, tipping cab drivers, driving alone....seriously?

[wiggin]

Er? Religious women the world over don't wear pants. You can find all sorts of scantily clad women in Israel - trust me on this. But there are religious women who generally wear what is societally perceived to be as more modest; a simple rubric is whether they're wearing a skirt or not. If they're wearing a skirt, it doesn't preclude them from being secular (especially if said skirt is tight and/or short), but if they're wearing pants it kinda precludes them from being super-religious.

Not tipping for certain services is pretty common in different countries, it's just a cultural thing, don't get how that's 18th century.

And driving alone is only relevant in that Wraithy wouldn't have a helpful guide to tell him he was straying into Palestinian-administered territory where American tourists have been assaulted in the past. That's security, that's it.

[GGT]

Er? Religious women the world over don't wear pants. You can find all sorts of scantily clad women in Israel - trust me on this. But there are religious women who generally wear what is societally perceived to be as more modest; a simple rubric is whether they're wearing a skirt or not. If they're wearing a skirt, it doesn't preclude them from being secular (especially if said skirt is tight and/or short), but if they're wearing pants it kinda precludes them from being super-religious.

That's retarded. Catholic nuns wear pants. Buddhist women wear pants. Christian evangelical women wear pants.

And driving alone is only relevant in that Wraithy wouldn't have a helpful guide to tell him he was straying into Palestinian-administered territory where American tourists have been assaulted in the past. That's security, that's it.

Right, it's not like American tourists have ever been assaulted by Jews or Israelis. It's always "those Palestinians", huh.

[wiggin]

That's retarded. Catholic nuns wear pants. Buddhist women wear pants. Christian evangelical women wear pants.

Pentecostal women wear skirts. Haredi women wear skirts. Old Order Mennonites wear skirts.

I'm not saying that EVERY religious woman wears pants; in fact, some religions argue that pants are more modest than skirts. But there are definitely a number of religious communities where religious women don't wear pants. Since Wraith is going to the Jewish state, I thought I'd mention to him the rule of thumb as it applies to Jews (and Muslims, which is headscarves).

Whether or not it makes any sense is irrelevant; it's just a cultural norm.

Right, it's not like American tourists have ever been assaulted by Jews or Israelis. It's always "those Palestinians", huh.

In this very thread I mentioned the concern about getting mugged in Tel Aviv, which has a predominantly Jewish population. It's just that the risk of serious bodily harm is higher when entering Area A because it's hard for them to distinguish between American tourists and Israelis, both of which are driving Israeli cars. Jeesh. I'm not trying to be political here, just give him some useful tips.

[GGT]

I know you're being helpful to Israel tourists, and Wraith in particular. But that doesn't prohibit me from mouthing off about religious "norms" that dictate public behavior, does it?

My community is full of religious people. Pentecostals, Mennonites, Amish, Catholics, Muslims, and *Jews* But we don't have any special "tips" for tourists like Israel does. And we don't associate those "tips" with personal safety.

[Hazir]

I know you're being helpful to Israel tourists, and Wraith in particular. But that doesn't prohibit me from mouthing off about religious "norms" that dictate public behavior, does it?

My community is full of religious people. Pentecostals, Mennonites, Amish, Catholics, Muslims, and *Jews* But we don't have any special "tips" for tourists like Israel does. And we don't associate those "tips" with personal safety.

I bet there are some very important tips you should know before visiting parts of the USA in order to stay safe. In the Middle East religion also is hardly a private matter.

The 'driving' advise was clearly a 'hard security' advise as people in certain parts will throw stones at cars with the wrong colour number plates. Even my Arab-Israeli friends know better than to randomly drive around in Westbank towns.

If it makes you happy; some headscarved Turkish women find pants acceptable attire so there are places where you will see that particular combination.

[Flixy]

Even here the more religious (Christian) women wear skirts, and tipping is also different here, I guess we're also in the 18th century..

[GGT]

Then we're down to what women wear at public beaches or hotel swimming pools....as reflections of cultural norms in Israel, and "warnings" to tourists? I still think that's retarded.

[Hazir]

Just to remind you :

The warning was about a serious security concern.

The clothing issue was merely given as a pointer to avoid socially awkward situations, there are no formal rules what a woman can or cannot wear in Israel, there are predictions on whether or not she will shake your hand on the basis of what she wears. And as such the advise of Wiggin on orthodox Jewish women is sound because they have a formal taboo on touching men who they are not directly related to. With muslim women the convention is strong, but it's not a taboo.

Of course wraith could choose to play stupid and find his hand hanging empty in the air half of the time. That really should make him feel smug and happy for being modern.

[Wraith]

Different cultures can be different, GGT.

[Dreadnaught]

So I'm leaving for Israel in a few weeks. I'll be in Tel Aviv. I know a few of you are quite familiar with the place, any tips/warnings or other things I should know about? I'm told that Saturdays can be quirky - elevators stop on every floor, most places are closed so I should have food bought beforehand. I'll be arriving on a Saturday - the hotel restaurant will probably still be serving, right? And you can't turn right on red over there? I thought Israel was civilized!

Are there any cultural things I need to know about? What's the best way to disguise my gentile nature so my blood doesn't get stolen at night? I've been told to be careful about shaking hands with/touching any women who might be muslim. Anything else worth knowing about?

Worth seeing tourist sites near Tel Aviv would be nice to know too. I won't actually have much time for tourism, so despite the length of my stay I won't be able to visit many places.

Wiggin got a lot of things, but are you really gonna drive? It's definitely needed on Saturday, but every other day of the week can be crazytown on the highways. If you've driven in a place like NYC or Boston, it'll be a bit like that...except with slightly less driver fealty to lanes.

The other funny thing about driving in downtown Tel Aviv? There's basically no way to turn left. It's hard to describe...but you'll see.

As for the hotel restaurant serving on Saturday...that's tough. Depends on the hotel and the time. If you want to PM the place, I may be able to ask a friend if they know some restaurants in the area that will be open as a backup. Because it'll be slim pickings, even in Tel Aviv.

Unless you're dealing with a lot of religious people, I don't think the handshake thing will matter much. Are you looking for a few quick things to see on a tight timeframe? Will it just be TA and Jerusalem? Actually...I have a feeling I know where you might be hanging around while you're there. Sounds like a cool trip.

[Wraith]

Leaving tomorrow. Any last minute advices?

A coworker who's already there recommended I invest in Grand Theft Auto V as driving training.

[Aimless]

Leaving tomorrow. Any last minute advices?

Whatever you do, don't mention the war

[wiggin]

Leaving tomorrow. Any last minute advices?

A coworker who's already there recommended I invest in Grand Theft Auto V as driving training.

Not the worst advice, I must say. Driving there can be intense, and parking in Tel Aviv is kinda crazy.

Send us an update once you're there for a week or so and let us know if you're still hankering for a specific kind of activity (hiking, history, archeology, culture, clubbing, etc.) and I can find you some good recommendations. Enjoy yourself! I'll be wandering through your area in about a month.

Whatever you do, don't mention the war

Heh, cute. Actually I've found people are much more vocal about their politics there than in the US. Very little is off-limits in polite conversation. But I'm kinda guessing that wasn't your goal with this post.

[Wraith]

Send us an update once you're there for a week or so and let us know if you're still hankering for a specific kind of activity (hiking, history, archeology, culture, clubbing, etc.) and I can find you some good recommendations. Enjoy yourself! I'll be wandering through your area in about a month.

I'll be gone by then, but I'll be sure to scrawl "Wraith was here" in graffiti on as many historic monuments as I can, so you'll know where I've been.

[wiggin]

Hehe, I'll be sure to keep an eye out. Don't spend too much time at historic monuments when I visit, though, so you should start scrawling your tag everywhere you go. I swear, it's totally legal.

[Loki]

Are you part of the prisoner exchange?

[Dreadnaught]

Leaving tomorrow. Any last minute advices?

A coworker who's already there recommended I invest in Grand Theft Auto V as driving training.

Don't worry about the missile strike on Syria.

If you have time to kill and a car, check out this restaurant and the town it's in: http://www.casa-barone.co.il/

It's very pretty there especially around sunset.

[wiggin]

Are you part of the prisoner exchange?

What exchange? There's a release, but no exchange.

Don't worry about the missile strike on Syria.

If you have time to kill and a car, check out this restaurant and the town it's in: http://www.casa-barone.co.il/

It's very pretty there especially around sunset.

I thought you were going to go a lot farther afield than Zichron Ya'akov. Here I was about to recommend Roberg: http://www.roberg.co.il/ . But it's a smidgen more of a drive.

Zichron Ya'akov is indeed very nice; there's also a decent winery there to get a tour/tasting if you're so inclined.

[Loki]

You keep this up and there will be a need for one.

[Dreadnaught]

What exchange? There's a release, but no exchange.


I thought you were going to go a lot farther afield than Zichron Ya'akov. Here I was about to recommend Roberg: http://www.roberg.co.il/ . But it's a smidgen more of a drive.

Zichron Ya'akov is indeed very nice; there's also a decent winery there to get a tour/tasting if you're so inclined.

Well, I didn't get the sense he was gonna go that far north...unless he really wants to see some Jesus places. Though it's certainly some really pretty driving.

[Wraith]

Paula Abdul is staying at my hotel.

[Hazir]

Paula Abdul is staying at my hotel.

Don't try to shake her hand, seriously.

[wiggin]

Paula Abdul is staying at my hotel.

Apparently she's having her Bat Mitzvah.

[Hazir]

She? Wouldn't that be her daughters'?