Swedish Parliamentary Election

[Aimless]

Now taking bets

I believe the current opinion is that the Social Democrats are likely to get the greatest number of seats, followed by the Moderates. The Racist Dickbag Party will probably get at least 12% of the votes for parliament, and make some progress at the county and municipal levels.

For the first time in my life I've tried to vote "tactically", in that I voted for the Feminist Initiative. My reasons are twofold: 1. I believe they will be able to do the things I want them to do while being completely unable to achieve the crazy goals in their charter that I dislike the most, and 2. getting them into parliament represents the best hope we have of being able to form a new functioning government that doesn't give the RDP too much influence (without FI there's a good chance the centre-left will not be able to form a functioning govt).

At the county and municipal levels I voted for the People's Party (who used to be libertarians once upon a time and may still be out here in the sticks where they haven't gotten the memos about being weird, obsessive fascists). I would have liked to vote Social Democrat at these levels, but the honest truth is that they have not inspired much confidence in their integrity, their competence or in their capacity to make the changes, to the way this county and this municipality is run, that I believe to be necessary. I have had some contact with some of the politicians in the largest opposition-party esp. re. healthcare, and these exchanges have left me thoroughly underwhelmed as they've primarily consisted of sucking up and promising changes that can't/shouldn't be promised without a clear and palatable plan for how they should be accomplished.

All of my three votes were difficult decisions, for me, but I don't think I have any regrets at the moment other than about my disillusionment with my Mother Party.

The international media coverage has been a bit odd and sometimes a little uninformed, but so has the domestic coverage, tbh. Overall, the most prominent theme this time around has been the widespread political and public opposition to racism and xenophobia on both sides of the political left-right spectrum. That's awesome but my personal opinion is that this, along with all the other emotion-centric fuzzy-wuzzy messages, may have negatively impacted (until fairly recently) the discussion and critical examination of more concrete and equally important matters of policy. But I'll take what I can get--eg. a large number of RDP-reps who've been forced to resign after a spirited campaign to bring their blatant racism and general stupidity to the public's attention--and trust that the housing-bubble and -crisis, as well Swedes' increasingly unsustainable debt-burden, will be sorted out eventually regardless of the colours of our future govt. Those issues are among the ones that have been the most important, to me (regretfully I saw little information on those matters that could be said to have influenced my votes).

I know everyone always says their election's gonna be a nail-biter, but I think this one really is, because I haven't yet seen any credible predictions about the outcome

[Loki]

I thought the main question was whether the Social Democrats will be able to form a decent coalition not whether they'll get the most votes?

[Aimless]

Preliminary results from exit-polls suggest that FI may just barely squeeze through to parliament, and that up to 36% of voters have changed party (the highest rate recorded by this poll).

[Aimless]

I thought the main question was whether the Social Democrats will be able to form a decent coalition not whether they'll get the most votes?

That's what I was referring to when I said they wouldn't be able to form a functioning government As it is, the "traditional" lefty coalition will not have enough seats on their own to get anything past the centrist/conservative coalition.

[Loki]

I'm guessing you get a grand coalition or (depending on Swedish political tradition) a minority government will implicit support from the conservatives on a few key issues.

[Nessus]

13%, bitches

[Aimless]

The rising tide of dummies, crazies and other assorted misfits can no longer be denied so much for unleaded fuel

[Hazir]

The rising tide of dummies, crazies and other assorted misfits can no longer be denied so much for unleaded fuel

Don't expect them to go away any time soon.

[Aimless]

I was thinking maybe we could compensate them better for the jobs they've lost to the dirty Poles

But, no, I don't expect them to go away any time soon. They've gotten a taste of victory and it's just going to get worse if the other parties continue to mismanage this country and above all bungle (once again) the task of taking back voters from the ever-growing group of racists and suckers. In 8 years' time, when they get more than 25% in a national election, perhaps my wife and I will emigrate to Canada have to win the lottery first though

[Nessus]

the ever-growing group of racists and suckers

The face of compassion, embracing the little man and looking past petty boundaries, everyone

[Aimless]

What're little things like racism, hatred, misogyny, homophobia and vicious ignorance between friends, eh? Just details, just details. No doubt their rise was brought on by the little man being squeezed by unemployment, exclusion, hopelessness and other socioeconomic ills, but maybe we can still hold people responsible for their stupidity and their tiny brains. Tiny, tiny brains

[Nessus]

Yes, calling everyone who disagrees with you a dumb-dumb has been a proven tactic since time immemorial.

[Aimless]

Not everyone, just the dumdums

[Nessus]

The face of compassion, embracing the little man and looking past petty boundaries, everyone

[Aimless]

I challenge you to prove any inconsistency in my views and values vis a vis racists and dumdums who do harmful racist things

[Nessus]

do harmful racist things

Seems like there's some axioms here we might not share

[Aimless]

Well duh, obviously YOU wouldn't

[Nessus]

You will find I am not alone

[Aimless]

Yes, I included crazies and other misfits in my list Pol Pot wasn't alone either, but, let's face it, he was still both wrong and kinda fucked-up. When I said "obviously YOU wouldn't" I wasn't implying that you were somehow unique. I was saying that obviously you wouldn't agree because you buy into beliefs that are odd and disturbing on top of being wrong. I don't think most of SD's voters are clinically braindead, but I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that a great many of those who aren't "smart racists" or "smart" scumbags are in fact dumdums who have been suckered by populistic politicians and their own dumdum friends. Sure, their crappy lives may have played a role too, but then again, maybe their lives are crappy because of who and how they are

[Nessus]

I love how clearly you enjoy portraying your perceived political enemies as less human, I'm not sure whether you're playing some kind of long-con satire on how your self-chosen political enemies appear in the left-green psyche or this is just a happy coincidence, but all the same, masterfully played.

If you can articulate how and why the "dum-dums" are "odd" and "disturbing", I am open to discussion, though the last time we tried you devolved into a self-parody too, so I'm not exactly hopeful of meaningful discussion

[Aimless]

The dumdums are odd and disturbing because they support or openly glory in hate-speech and violent threats (or actions) against darkies, muslims, leftists, centrists, attractive women, ugly women, normal women, gay people, etc and their elected officials get busted doing just the dumbest most embarrassing shit like all the frickin' time. You gotta be kinda cracked if you get behind shit like that.

It is also well known that a disproportionate number of them are poorly educated below-average alcohol-abusing angry men (and some women) with impaired impulse-control. They are so naive as to think that they can have a socialist paradise with no rapes where they get everything they want and need simply by kicking out the brownies but forget that any society that includes--and tries to cater to--a large number of people like them is doomed to fail because they generate little of value. *shrugs* That's just the way the world is, and, with Sweden's education system, culture and society being what it is I expect this trend will continue for the foreseeable future until this country once again reverts to being a third-world nation ruled by an small elite class of fashion bloggers and app-developers.

[Aimless]

My "perceived enemies" aren't less than human, but they belong to that category of people that are the closest to one day being deserving of that treatment, should I ever decide to lower my threshold. Being dumb or disgusting doesn't remove your humanity, but it really makes people want to examine your value and status, esp. when you risk harming others. It's just the rule of the golden social contract man

[Nessus]

The dumdums are odd and disturbing because they support or openly glory in hate-speech and violent threats (or actions) against darkies, muslims, leftists, centrists, attractive women, ugly women, normal women, gay people, etc and their elected officials get busted doing just the dumbest most embarrassing shit like all the frickin' time. You gotta be kinda cracked if you get behind shit like that.

Citation needed. The most violent, openly and in action, faction around in the current political scene are the Mohammedans. Breivik hasn't had that many followers, and ISIL has killed how many more "unbelievers" by now?

It's simple to hate-speech against your perceived opponents, it's quite another to voice reasonable criticism of their political views.

It is also well known that a disproportionate number of them are poorly educated below-average alcohol-abusing angry men (and some women) with impaired impulse-control. They are so naive as to think that they can have a socialist paradise with no rapes where they get everything they want and need simply by kicking out the brownies but forget that any society that includes--and tries to cater to--a large number of people like them is doomed to fail because they generate little of value. *shrugs* That's just the way the world is, and, with Sweden's education system, culture and society being what it is I expect this trend will continue for the foreseeable future until this country once again reverts to being a third-world nation ruled by an small elite class of fashion bloggers and app-developers.

Holy shit "man", do you realize how fucked up the things you say are? "Below-average", "alcohol-abusing" "angry" [people] who dislike rape? I get that these things get under your brown skin, but come on, you must have some perspective. If you wish to portray your perceived opponents as troglodytes not worth your time, go right ahead, but please understand that you are quite literally acting like a fascist when doing so. That you have the angels of Heaven behind you, sure, but you realize this isn't as evident to those minds existing outside your head?

What precisely makes your wish to exterminate people you find undesirable different from what you may think SD represents? This is all a huge troll, yes?

[Flixy]

I love how clearly you enjoy portraying your perceived political enemies as less human, I'm not sure whether you're playing some kind of long-con satire on how your self-chosen political enemies appear in the left-green psyche or this is just a happy coincidence, but all the same, masterfully played.

If you can articulate how and why the "dum-dums" are "odd" and "disturbing", I am open to discussion, though the last time we tried you devolved into a self-parody too, so I'm not exactly hopeful of meaningful discussion

I can't speak for the Swedish party, but one of my main issues with our freedom party (wilders) is that they don't offer solutions, and only use immigration, EU etc as distraction from that. Plus they have shown that they don't actually want to govern and take responsibility, they just want to complain. And the things yet do propose tend to be quite strongly unconstitutional which is somewhat odd for a group that claims to defend Dutch values. And it's often a very bad idea to begin with and they tend to ignore facts. All of that goes equally for the socialist party, though. I guess I just hate populism. I don't think their voters are stupid, alcohol abusing, at least no more than your average citizen. Angry, possibly at the establishment for being ignored, or at least feeling they are, but that's probably not what Aimless meant.

Oh and their representatives in our congress tend to be rather bad, you could make a great blooper reel from stupid and blatantly untrue shit they've said. That's also true for other parties, but they are certainly the Kings of it (not to mention they lead by a mile with criminal records of their representatives, and for more fraud related things). But that likely also has a lot to do with being a relatively young party, and the way the party is set up (with wilders being the 'dictator' of the party, which I imagine deters capable people who want to do more than parrot what he said).

[Enoch the Red]

My "perceived enemies" aren't less than human, but they belong to that category of people that are the closest to one day being deserving of that treatment, should I ever decide to lower my threshold. Being dumb or disgusting doesn't remove your humanity, but it really makes people want to examine your value and status, esp. when you risk harming others. It's just the rule of the golden social contract man

I hope you realize just how badly you are coming across here. People don't cease to be people because they hold idiotic, harmful, or wrongheaded ideas, and you certainly aren't the arbiter of their value and worth. One of our resident forum sages recently made a post that you might find interesting, and I strongly encourage you to check it out.

[Aimless]

I agree with what you're saying, and that is one of many reasons why I deplore those who deliberately vote for SD. Theirs is a party that is expressly opposed to the notion of universal and equal human worth. Their more vocal supporters take it a few steps further by openly expressing their total disregard for human worth when it comes to brownies, women who speak up, etc.

But, you know what? I don't support the death penalty either, but, if I ever were to change my mind, who do you think I would be the most likely to support killing? Murderers or kindergarteners who stole from the cookie-jar?

[Aimless]

I invite you also to consider the fact that people don't just hold "idiotic, harmful, or wrongheaded ideas". They turn their ideas into actions. Some do it just by voting for a party that is a dark brown stain on democracy and justice, whereas others actively harm people. I believe it's misleading to speak of "ideas" as if they exist in a separate reality where they have no consequences for real people in our world.

I guess that's another beef I have with SD's electorate--many of them don't seem to realize that this group of asshats, that have been exposed over and over again for being just so completely unfit to hold power over people's lives, don't just say naughty things or have a few inconsequential thought-glitches. They actively fuck things up. It may begin with vehemently defending the use of the name "nigger-balls" for a dessert in a society where people still get called "nigger" as a slur, but it doesn't stop there.

[Enoch the Red]

I agree with what you're saying, and that is one of many reasons why I deplore those who deliberately vote for SD. Theirs is a party that is expressly opposed to the notion of universal and equal human worth. Their more vocal supporters take it a few steps further by openly expressing their total disregard for human worth when it comes to brownies, women who speak up, etc.

But, you know what? I don't support the death penalty either, but, if I ever were to change my mind, who do you think I would be the most likely to support killing? Murderers or kindergarteners who stole from the cookie-jar?

One can support the capital punishment and still acknowledge that it is a human being who is being killed. I'm troubled that you believe humanity is negotiable. People can do horrible, incomprehensible, and utterly confounding things, but that doesn't change them from being human.

Voting and supporting a political party you strongly disagree with, with values and objectives that you loathe is unfortunate, even distressing, but how can it even begin to remove the humanity of those people? Let's put this into perspective Minx. Isn't that the same simplistic thinking that you called GGT out for using?

I invite you also to consider the fact that people don't just hold "idiotic, harmful, or wrongheaded ideas". They turn their ideas into actions. Some do it just by voting for a party that is a dark brown stain on democracy and justice, whereas others actively harm people. I believe it's misleading to speak of "ideas" as if they exist in a separate reality where they have no consequences for real people in our world.

I guess that's another beef I have with SD's electorate--many of them don't seem to realize that this group of asshats, that have been exposed over and over again for being just so completely unfit to hold power over people's lives, don't just say naughty things or have a few inconsequential thought-glitches. They actively fuck things up. It may begin with vehemently defending the use of the name "nigger-balls" for a dessert in a society where people still get called "nigger" as a slur, but it doesn't stop there.

Absolutely. I'm not saying you need to accept their viewpoint as valid, befriend them, or stop actively campaigning against them. All you have to do is recognize that regardless of their perspectives they are human beings, and that you are not the judge of their absolute value and worth. Doing so isn't a reflection of them, and their relative merits, it's a reflection of you and yours.

[Aimless]

Hang on, recognising someone as being human does not require you to believe in equality of human worth. It is central to this party's ideology that not all humans are equal in worth, and that human worth is not absolute and infinite.

The contention, in the case of capital punishment, is not simply the question of human worth. It is about whether or not human life is inviolate, whether or not we can take a person's right to live away from them. And those who support capital punishment must at some point arrive at the conclusion that there are some lives that, in some situations, are okay to extinguish. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the typical example of such a life and such a situation is the case of a heinous murderer, and one common justification is that the murderer, by violating another person's right to life, has willingly surrendered his own right to the same. It is by the same reasoning I've arrived at my conclusion about who would have the least human worth, were to abandon the notion of equality of human worth: it is those who already wish to treat others as being worth less. I wouldn't wish to live in such a future, but perhaps I need to start preparing for it.

Wrt what I said, this is what I said:

Being dumb or disgusting doesn't remove your humanity, but it really makes people want to examine your value and status, esp. when you risk harming others.

Fortunately I still have the strength required to not let that urge turn into action. I've had nazi and racist patients. Those who were honest with me or at least agreed to be treated by a brown doctor with a dodgy surname received the best care I could give them. It's the right thing to do for me, but it's hard for me to disregard the fact that these same patients who benefited from my care and everyone else's money--not to mention tolerance and patience--would, if they had been able, tried to stop me from caring for the refugees and undocumented migrants that are in a far greater need for help. That grates against my sense of rightness, even though I do not wish to let the conflict influence my actions.

[Aimless]

Just for the record, I get where you're coming from, and another time, on another forum, in another situation... I would perhaps have said something very similar to some other angry disillusioned person. It's what my mum has taught me, and I tend to agree. Today, however, I'm on an adventure