Minor Dilemma: A Rubbish Situation

[Timbuk2]

So.

The dimwitted arseholes who run my local borough council have decided to crack down on litter in recent weeks.

They sent a letter to all council residents a few weeks back saying something along the lines of they will prosecute anyone who leaves black bin bags outside on non-collection days (collection days are tuesdays). I took no further notice and frankly entirely forgot about the letter.

Their crackdown on leaving bin bags out, I guess, is largely due to the urban fox population who, in their neverending quest for scraps, like nothing better than ripping open said bin bags overnight and splaying the contents all over the place. A fairly common occurrence.

Almost every borough I have lived in and visited, both within and without London, provide large plastic wheely bins for people to put their bin bags into during the week, ready for collection day. My borough however, the London Borough of Dimwitted Arseholes, do not provide any such bin, nor any means for one to put one's bin bags short of leaving them in the street on collection day.

We are supposed, I guess, to leave bin bags with rotting food and all the rest of the shit people throw away every day, in our houses stinking up the place until collection day.

Well bollocks to that.

~

So. To the chase.

This monday past, I put my bin bag out at the top of the street where there is a public litter bin. This is one of the usual street bins for people to throw litter away in; sweet wrappers etc. It's not for big bin bags, they wouldn't fit, but people in my street tend to leave bin bags there next to it as the litter bin is emptied most days and the dimwitted arseholes will take your bin bag when they do so. We have no choice but to do this as we have no wheelie bins or anything else, as I described above.

I occasionally stay monday nights at my lady's place, and drive straight there from work. This means I am sometimes not around on tuesday mornings to put any bin bags out ready for the allocated collection. I am certainly not going to leave a bin bag in my house stinking up the place for 8 days till collection the following week.

I leave bin bags there often, as do others in my street.

Really this is making the most of a shitty situation. I don't like foxes splaying litter everywhere, but I'd rather that than leave it indoors.

I get home from work today to find a brown envelope from the London Borough of Dimwitted Arseholes addressed to me.

Inside there is a letter which states:

______________

Dear Mr Blah

On 20/09/2010, at around 13:52, a black bag was left on the public highway which is an offence under section 87 of The Environmental Protection Act 1990.

On this occasion, we are offering you the opportunity to avoid being prosecuted by paying a fixed penalty notice of £75, which is attached to this letter.

Please make sure that in future you put any litter in a bin
______________


What The Fucking Shitty Pissant Little Bollix Is This?!?!

How on earth did they know it was me who left the bag there? There is no CCTV camera on my street. The only thing I can think of is they had an enforcement van with cameras parked up nearby ready for just such an offence, who tracked me coming out of my specific door, walking with the mightily offending bin bag to the end of the street, and placing it next to the public litter bin. Unlikely, but I cannot fathom how else they tracked me.

So. Without resorting to further expletives; my dilemma:


1. Do I pretend it was not me, write a letter saying what the fuck are you on about, I did not leave any such offending bin bag. If you think I did, I want proof, and I have sent a copy of this correspondence to my solicitor.

2. Plead ignorance. Say I had no idea it was an offence, and I really can't remember if I did or did not put a bin bag out on monday. I am therefore refusing to pay the penalty until you provide me with proof that I did, and I have sent a copy of this correspondence to my solicitor.

3. Do I 'fess up, write a letter saying it was me, then say I am refusing to pay as us residents on this street are not given wheelie bins so we have no choice BUT to leave our bin bags out on non-collection days. Prosecuting us under these conditions is entirely unfair and ill-considered, and I have sent a copy of this correspondence to my solicitor.

4. Do I write a letter to the local newspaper about the ridiculousness of these prosecutions, then send a copy of the letter to the London Borough of Dimwitted Arseholes telling them that this is a ridiculous situation and I am refusing to pay?

5. Just pay the fucking £75 without further comment.


Seriously pissed off.

[Nessus]

5) Kill everybody

[Timbuk2]

5) Kill everybody

Sorry, I edited.

Kill everybody will have to be #6.

[Illusions]

Two questions...

1) House or Apartment?
2) What is a "wheelie bin"?

[Timbuk2]

1. Apartment

2. Wheelie bins:



Designed to store a number of bin bags, are robust, pest-proof, convenient, and rubbish trucks have pickup attachments which fit the wheelie bin, as can be seen.

Ubiquitous in the UK.

~

Most councils now have various different colour-coded wheelie bins for different recycled goods too, which is great. Not my feckin council though.

[Nessus]

2) What is a "wheelie bin"?

Garbage can made out of plastic and equipped with wheels.

[Ominous Gamer]

My city gave those bins out free to everyone, started a few years back.
I would pick #3 and #4, but wouldn't fess up. If they want to prosecute you could turn this into a thing, or at least plea it down to something stupid (can you do that over there?). Courts do that a lot around here, if you push a ticket back to a court date they will offer a deal of half off the fine and no points on your license instead of taking it all the way to a judge.

[Illusions]

Garbage can made out of plastic and equipped with wheels.

I was honestly hoping that this was a colloquialism for what we call a dumpster here in the US, as those "wheelie bins" that Timbuk2 is upset that his council isn't providing are typically bought by homeowners over here and cost around $20 - $30 or less and can last numerous years. They're ubiquitous here too as we also have small mammals that wish to get at whatever left over morsels may be in our trash. I'm honestly surprised that Timbuk is upset that these things weren't bought for him and his apartment complex.

[Nessus]

I was honestly hoping that this was a colloquialism for what we call a dumpster here in the US, as those "wheelie bins" that Timbuk2 is upset that his council isn't providing are typically bought by homeowners over here and cost around $20 - $30 or less and can last numerous years. They're ubiquitous here too as we also have small mammals that wish to get at whatever left over morsels may be in our trash. I'm honestly surprised that Timbuk is upset that these things weren't bought for him and his apartment complex.

The ghost of Stalin, bringing his socialist desires for garbage cans for us dirty Euros. Thank the Almighty Lord you guys won the Cold War, huh!

[Timbuk2]

I was honestly hoping that this was a colloquialism for what we call a dumpster here in the US, as those "wheelie bins" that Timbuk2 is upset that his council isn't providing are typically bought by homeowners over here and cost around $20 - $30

Your national compatriot, Ominous up there, begs to disagree.

I am more upset that we have no adequate means with which to dispose of our rubbish, rather than the specifics of wheelie-bin provision or not. Wheelie-bins are certainly the norm here which is why I brought them up.

[Nessus]

Your national compatriot, Ominous up there, begs to disagree.

I am more upset that we have no adequate means with which to dispose of our rubbish, rather than the specifics of wheelie-bin provision or not. Wheelie-bins are certainly the norm here which is why I brought them up.

Your norm is horrible, awful, socialist and thus an abomination before the Almighty Lord God. Shame

(I'm really sorry I don't have any good suggestions for you though, looks like your county's looking to fuck you sideways two times. If you reckon the press can help change the situation with the bin supply, go for that, but I honestly don't think you can get out of the 75 squid fine )

[Illusions]

The ghost of Stalin, bringing his socialist desires for garbage cans for us dirty Euros. Thank the Almighty Lord you guys won the Cold War, huh!

It seems like it has made Timbuk in this case unable to act on his own, which is the part I'm more astonished by, not the government provided bins. The point being is that it seems he expects the government to know what he needs and provide it, where-as in our case we tell the government what we need, and if they don't provide it, we go and get it for ourselves, instead of sitting back and wondering why the world is so cruel and binless...

Your national compatriot, Ominous up there, begs to disagree.

Ominous lives in Florida, home of the elderly, theme-parks, acres of swamp and marsh, and hurricane/flood damage.

Edit: You should also possibly speak with the super of the building as I'm surprised they don't provide anything themselves as well.

[Ominous Gamer]

We used to have our own trash cans, but those were for home residents. Apartments mainly kept to dumpsters that either daily grounds keepers collected for, or the residents used when they needed.

When the city moved to automated trash collecting trucks (like your picture but the arm comes out of the side, no human touches the trash bin) the city gave out free bins so the trucks wouldn't have any issues. The bins were even delivered to our driveway for us. Since all the cans in your picture are exactly same, I figured that was the same concept.

[Nessus]

It seems like it has made Timbuk in this case unable to act on his own, which is the part I'm more astonished by, not the government provided bins. The point being is that it seems he expects the government to know what he needs and provide it, where-as in our case we tell the government what we need, and if they don't provide it, we go and get it for ourselves, instead of sitting back and wondering why the world is so cruel and binless...

Looking forward to you going Galt!

[Timbuk2]

Am writing a letter and plan to engage a solicitor.

Will ask for proof that they know it was me.

Will then go on to say that there is no choice but for us to leave bin bags outside. The only alternative is to have them pile up indoors, which, the penalty notice coming from their environmental health department, I am sure would agree that retaining bin bags indoors until collection day constitutes a very real health hazard.

Given that we have no choice, their heavy-handed approach in dishing out fixed penalty notices is entirely inappropriate, especially as there has been non no public consultation on this matter. Take me to court, bitches.

Ball is then in their court.

Am in no mood to bend over.

[littlelolligagged]

Ours are provided by whichever garbage company you choose to pay to take away your crap. If you change companies they will take theirs away (normally) and you'll get a new one from the next company. The ones you can buy at the store are total shit compared to the ones provided by the garbage people.

[Nessus]

Ours are provided by whichever garbage company you choose to pay to take away your crap. If you change companies they will take theirs away (normally) and you'll get a new one from the next company. The ones you can buy at the store are total shit compared to the ones provided by the garbage people.

Why are you not seeking your own solutions and just wallowing in your filth, inside the government-provided bins? Americans should be quick-witted, seeking their own solutions where the gummint cannot find any Are you some sort of decrepit communist?

[Timbuk2]

Edit: You should also possibly speak with the super of the building as I'm surprised they don't provide anything themselves as well.

I don't live in a complex. It is an old pre-1900 apartment conversion above another, with my own doorway leading to the street. So no super, just me, myself and I

[Illusions]

Looking forward to you going Galt!

I'm not understanding this as part of what I said was that he should have petitioned his local government to provide the solution they offer, and was not astonished that the government provides bins, but that Timbuk was unable to take action on his own until his hand was forced, in this case by a £75 fine...

[Nessus]

I'm not understanding this as part of what I said was that he should have petitioned his local government to provide the solution they offer, and was not astonished that the government provides bins, but that Timbuk was unable to take action on his own until his hand was forced, in this case by a £75 fine...

Yeah, it's really god-awful how us socialist Euros don't spend 2 hours a night writing to our Congressmen-equivalents Such complacency and turgidity!

[Illusions]

Yeah, it's really god-awful how us socialist Euros don't spend 2 hours a night writing to our Congressmen-equivalents Such complacency and turgidity!

I assume they have phones in Europe. If a house in my town needs a recycling bin replaced they call the town, and either go pick one up at where-ever the town keeps them, or they have it delivered.

[Nessus]

I assume they have phones in Europe. If a house in my town needs a recycling bin replaced they call the town, and either go pick one up at where-ever the town keeps them, or they have it delivered.

But Tim-buck just explained how his community will not, so he would have to correspond with his Congressman. And he hasn't, because of his robust socialism! Tut tut.

[Timbuk2]

Sigh. Just got off the phone to the lady.

I apparently had correspondence addressed to me in my rubbish. So that's how they know it was me.

Teach me not to be more careful about shredding all correspondence.

[littlelolligagged]

Why are you not seeking your own solutions and just wallowing in your filth, inside the government-provided bins? Americans should be quick-witted, seeking their own solutions where the gummint cannot find any Are you some sort of decrepit communist?

Not decrepit.

[Illusions]

But Tim-buck just explained how his community will not, so he would have to correspond with his Congressman. And he hasn't, because of his robust socialism! Tut tut.

So which is the smarter solution then, doing what Timbuk did and incuring a £75 fine, or purchasing a bin for less than that amount, and then taking it up with his town? I don't really understand how you can suggest that self-reliance is a negative, yet sitting around waiting and expecting someone to do something that they have failed to do so far is the more civilized and intelligent approach.

[Nessus]

So which is the smarter solution then, doing what Timbuk did and incuring a £75 fine, or purchasing a bin for less than that amount, and then taking it up with his town? I don't really understand how you can suggest that self-reliance is a negative, yet sitting around waiting and expecting someone to do something that they have failed to do so far is the more civilized and intelligent approach.

Look I'm really sorry but I've been trolling you like there's no tomorrow and I just don't get why you're trying to act as the sensible party here when the opposition is obvious non-sense.

[Illusions]

Look I'm really sorry but I've been trolling you like there's no tomorrow and I just don't get why you're trying to act as the sensible party here when the opposition is obvious non-sense.

Oh......I hadn't realized and just thought it was hyperbole...

[Timbuk2]

Yay, my solicitor has given some guidance and says certainly dispute the penalty notice.

Letter is penned, and my solicitors office is referenced in.

[wiggin]

I don't know about other municipalities, Illusions, but where I grew up the bins were rather more expensive than 75 quid and provided by the city starting some 15-20 years ago (beforehand the city provided round metal bins with lids IIRC, but I was quite young). The reason for this was twofold - first, to ensure everyone used the pest-proof (or nearly pest-proof) bins, and second, to ensure that the bins fit well into the garbage disposal trucks/systems they used and made the collectors' jobs easier.

Thus, an individual response is likely more expensive and certainly less efficient than a municipality-driven one in this circumstance. Obviously being proactive in addressing the issue and trying to convince the municipality of the value in procuring such bins is a good idea, but that doesn't address whether it makes sense for everyone to go out and buy their own stuff.

I personally hate cities (including my current one) that have a 'leave your trash on the sidewalk' day for pickup - I've found it's pretty common on the East Coast. The entire city smells, it probably attracts rodents, looks awful, and is generally an inefficient system. Alleys and bins exist for a reason.

[Ominous Gamer]

before I head to google, whats a solicitor in this sense?