Fielding Opinions and Ideas.....

[GGT]

Most of you know the long-standing issues with my ex-husband, regarding his hoarding behavior and being passive-aggressive.

Now that he's flipping his bachelor pad and moving into the house he and his new wife renovated over the last year (five doors down from his bachelor pad, which was right at our kids' bus stop and one block away from our marital home, in case that was lost in the logistics of this Peyton Place saga).....

Now his accumulated crap is showing up like a boomerang at my home. Bit by trunk load, bag after box. He's manipulating enough to appeal to the kids' emotions (this came from your bedroom) or practical sense (this is valuable, if you clean it up). He's even got them thinking they should sort through every piece he brings over here, because Hey, lookie there, jackpot, there's your Passport!


I've already asked him (as nicely as I could) to NOT bring this stuff here, but to move it to his new home and work from there. His new wife has her own voice, and she's apparently said this is HIS shit, and HIS history to deal with. I can understand that, and good for her. But my kids (and I) are caught in the middle. Not sure what to do now.

Should I simply pile all this crap back in my car, drive it over to his "new house" and drop it off? Tell him he's gonna have to weed through this with his sons, regardless of what his new wife says? Should I just take all this crap straight to the Salvation Army (or the dump) or throw it in the dumpster parked in his driveway? Should I call him and say he's going to have to come pick up all the crap he's put in my garage?

I resent being dragged into this, AGAIN, of course. I'm not sure what the boys are feeling, but they already went through the separation and divorce process, and allocated/divided possessions by household.

Any advice?

[Aimless]

Talk to your kids and then tell him in no uncertain terms that he isn't to dump all the unsorted junk at your place. It is your place right? What business does he have dumping everything there? Tell them they can sort through the stuff and whatever they want to keep they keep in their own rooms. Of course you might like some of the stuff, who knows

But in the end this is a hassle for you and may even end up costing you money. Put your foot down or send him a fricking bill.

[Aimless]

Btw, it's a good thing you've asked him not to do this, but he doesn't seem to understand that, if you've said no and his wife has said no then it's his problem and his responsibility to find a good solution. You may need to explain that part to him as well, who knows. Maybe his motives are pure

[GGT]

It's a royal hassle, yeah. As one of the adults in the room, I'm supposed to be able to manage this, not just the actual stuff but the emotions.

My kids haven't said much yet, but "the things in their dad's bachelor pad" were still theirs. The little things that made them feel at home, while they tried to learn what having two homes meant. I'm reluctant to just throw things away. I'm uncomfortable simply sending it all back to their dad, because he's never been very adept at seeing his sons as emotional beings, with their own "baggage". If ya know what I mean?

[Timbuk2]

My advice:

1. Tell Mr ex that you will hold the stuff for one week. One minute past the deadline, it's on the sidewalk. Kids need deadlines ...
2. Get your boys to sort through as much of the stuff as they can be bothered to find what they want/what's theirs.
3. If by the end of the week he hasn't come to collect, onto the sidewalk it all goes.

He cant dump his stuff on you and expect you to deal with it.

[Aimless]

No no no. Onto his sidewalk. Send him a bill for transportation costs.

Or figure out how much of a hassle this is to you and if it's worth the hassle of making a statement. After this he won't have any more possessions to dump in your home after all.

Ask your kids what they want to keep and what they might be okay with either throwing or giving away. It's nice to be able to give things away

[Catgrrl]

I think Timbuk has the right idea. Give him (and the boys) a deadline to retrieve what they want to keep. All else gets donated/thrown away. I'm pretty sure by a legal standpoint as long as you give a deadline then after that it is "Abandoned" property and you can do as you please with it.

EDIT: The angry momma part of me would say to let the boys go through what they want, then dump the rest on his new place (or old one if it is still in his posession). I don't know if that would cause you more problems than it is worth though?

[GGT]

Thanks, Tim. That's actually a good solution!

A solution that also means I have to "make good" on my threats to get the kids to stow/store or use "valuable memorabilia" before it finds its way to the curb! Even if that means a guitar or flute, a special book or coin collection, or whatever else.

I think I also need to tell Mr. Ex that he can't bring anything else over here...since his process of cleaning and flipping looks to take another few weeks, maybe even months. Hell, he moved out ten years ago, so why should my home be his repository? I'll tell ya why. Because he's brought his own sentimental things over here, like the oil paintings he made during his youth, his high school letter jacket, those kinds of things. He'd say shit like, "Here, sons, this is my letter jacket and baseball glove. Keep it in my dad's Army trunk. See---that's your family name on there. This is your history."

[GGT]

Oh yeah, and much of this "important family history" is now contaminated with black mold and all sorts of creepy crawlies. Even beloved books he insisted keeping in the divorce, but kept in his basement, and they're now ruined. That made me cry, actually.

I'm stuck between current ex-hell and future savings for my kids. I was there once, as a teen between two divorced parents cleaning out a family household, and many things I'd call precious were either trashed, sold, or given away. Same things happen when parents died. It may all just be "stuff" in the end, but until it's blown away by a tornado, burnt away in a fire, flooded by a typhoon or hurricane, ruined by the black mold of entropy or neglect....I still feel a responsibility to preserve some family things. Even if I'm not considered part of that family any longer, my kids are.

Should I rent a storage unit and bill the ex for holding his family's things?

[Aimless]

You should probably inform him of this plan first.

[Hazir]

Good luck on billing him. If this stuff is moldy why not simply throw it away? I think what's more important is why this man after 10 years still manages to upset you so much. I don't know the story line but to me it seems he floats up like a bloated corpse through your postings way too often for it to be healthy. Your children may need some memories from their childhood, but that doesn't include moldy rubbish.

Otherwise Timbuks approach seems just fine to me; you show your children (who do matter) that your not just the evil ex-wife where their father is concerned, and you show him that his memories are not relevant to you.

My way of dealing with exes is not letting them back into my life in any other capacity than they had when we were lovers. It works like a charm; I hardly ever see them back to rip open old wounds, as the encounters never are pleasant nor civilised for them. That tends to keep them at a safe distance.

[termite]

Have a bonfire, boys love bonfires - anything not burned at the end of it, they really wanted to keep.

Fuck the ex-husband, he is a monumental fuckwit.

[Ominous Gamer]

My advice:

1. Tell Mr ex that you will hold the stuff for one week. One minute past the deadline, it's on the sidewalk. Kids need deadlines ...
2. Get your boys to sort through as much of the stuff as they can be bothered to find what they want/what's theirs.
3. If by the end of the week he hasn't come to collect, onto the sidewalk it all goes.

He cant dump his stuff on you and expect you to deal with it.

Dumping it on the sidewalk could result in city fines. I would find a storage place thats cheap, or running a promo. I know the one around here does the first month for $1. Throw all the shit in there, sorting for the kids stuff and whatnot as you go through it. If he doesn't pay the rent, its his problem.

[Catgrrl]

If it's moldy it's best to throw it away. Seen too many episodes of Hoarders, whole houses are completely unlivable because of mold spores. *shudder*

It's a health risk to keep any of it, and costly to remove mold from some materials. It also gives you an "out" if he starts anything with you about it. Tell him to get his mold-infested things out. You don't want that stuff creeping into your house, causing you hundreds to thousands in damages if it sits there too long and contaminates your stuff. Yuck!

Trust me, as someone who fell ill after having to clean out a moldy mini-refrigerator when my brother's dumb roommate left it unplugged over Christmas break years ago (and didn't leave the door open so there was water left in it for weeks). Breathing in mold sucks; it feels like the flu. I was out of commission nearly a week, felt like death. You don't want that to deal with!

[GGT]

Yeah, the whole black mold thing has been a thorn for years. I went to my lawyer with pictures, and he tried to get me arrested for trespassing. I tried to have the "authorities" help me keep the kids safe from that, and they told me to go back to my lawyers. It's been a looong fricking decade.

My sister has offered to come help me deal with this shit next weekend, and that's very sweet, but it won't address the root problem. I think I may need to gather my gumption and tell Mr. Ex to retrieve everything still in my garage one week from now, or it will be placed on his front porch. The porch with his new wife, that is, not his old bachelor pad. I don't think telling my kids they have one week to filter through this crap is healthy.

Gah, I hope that sounds like a good plan. I'd hate for my kids to "miss" something in that mess they'd forgotten about.

[Dreadnaught]

Yeah, the whole black mold thing has been a thorn for years. I went to my lawyer with pictures, and he tried to get me arrested for trespassing.

Because...he thought you were a mold-transmitting zombie?

I think I may need to gather my gumption and tell Mr. Ex to retrieve everything still in my garage one week from now, or it will be placed on his front porch. The porch with his new wife, that is, not his old bachelor pad. I don't think telling my kids they have one week to filter through this crap is healthy.

Gah, I hope that sounds like a good plan. I'd hate for my kids to "miss" something in that mess they'd forgotten about.

One week? Why not this weekend or it's done? If you let this go for a week, then he sounds like the kind of guy who will say "I'll do it next week" and then he'll say it will be the week after...until soon months or years will go by.

If he's just dumping stuff on your lawn, either it's staying or it's going. Give your kids an afternoon to look through it and be done with it. Your kids are old enough to scavenge and prioritize properly. It's not easy, but a year from now they wil barely remember/care.

But for your sake, this needs to just get done or it's clearly going to loom over you and make you feel like the lesser party in this every day that pile sits on your property.

[Bitter Jeweler]

Wow, GGT, this story is unbelievable! I'm sorry you are having to deal with this.

[GGT]

Thanks, Bitter. Thanks to everyone....it really is something that's been going on for ten years, but now it's come to a head. I've never felt comfortable "being the bitch" and he knows that, and often exploited that. I always believed that no matter how fucked up their dad was, it was wrong to stand in the way of their visits, or let my negative opinion of their father affect their relationship. So I pretty much bent over backward, even sending mattresses and blankets to his house so the kids would have a nice place to sleep.

It's just been a long ten years of every Tuesday and Thursday, and every other weekend, and every other holiday. The kids sort of got used to it, because their dad was just down the street, and coming Home was easy. Now that he's remarried and flipping the hovel bachelor house, there's all this crap to deal with.



Dread, I'd appreciate it if you didn't try to make light of the black mold, or what I went through to protect my children.

[Draco]

Family problems always suck big time! I don't know how sensitive the position you're in is, but I'd dump everything that he left at your house (well everything that you and your kids don't wanna lose). It's bad enough that he's using the kids too. I'm sure they've gone through enough and having to be reminded of it all is not nice, and unbelievably bastard-like of your ex.

[Lebanese Dragon]

First off I don't know how old your kids are (take this advice with that in mind)... if they're 18+ (which i doubt) and are willing to take responsibility for the items, going through them, keeping what they like, selling or giving away what they don't. That's up to them. Just establish whatever storage rules you want for them.

If this stuff really is just "junk", or the vast majority is stuff you know that you or your kids won't use then I think you can make a decision and tell your kids to stop accepting such "gifts."

If they insist tell them you can go through the stuff at HIS place, and then they can call you with what they want to bring home to your place. If they don't listen, I'd just keep taking the stuff back over to your husband's place, and TELL him you own this stuff, and you can give it to the kids if you want, but they're not allowed to store it at my place.

It does make you look like the bad guy here.. But, Talk to the kids, tell them what you want to happen (and why), then talk to him. If it doesn't go that way, it's your house, so send it back/sell it/donate/junk it whatever. I think you can settle this with civility, I believe in you!

More or less I would call and tell him that I want the stuff gone through at his place because it's making a mess in my yard/house and the kids are too call you about what all they can store at your place before bringing it over. If he says he won't do that, then you can tell him you'd hate to get authorities involved but what he is doing is ridiculous.

[Dreadnaught]

Dread, I'd appreciate it if you didn't try to make light of the black mold, or what I went through to protect my children.

I wasn't. I was trying to figure out why someone's lawyer would call the police to kick them out.

But seriously, I know it's hard but if I were you I would tell everyone they have 48 hours to take what they want or everything will be thrown out. Your kids won't remember it in a few years.

[Ominous Gamer]

Your kids won't remember it in a few years.

yeah...this is bullshit.

[GGT]

The not remembering this phase is BS, that's part of the problem here. Mr. Ex is a hoarder, and both boys are still in the "save my Legos" stage of their own "collections". After the marital home was split up, half of their things ended up at his house. Their dad encouraged them to save stuff (like the frames from flooded artwork, to save for their own artwork). Now there's junk mixed with things like comic book collections, photos mixed with baby boots. Plus mildew, black mold and occasional mouse droppings.

edit

I'd really like to do one of those "hoarder interventions" with him. Call him and say he's got a couple of days to get ready, because it's all coming back to his new house, where he and the kids (plus his wife, I suppose) can go through it all. If it's something salvageable and important, it either stays there or he can get them a storage unit? This comes at a time when I'm trying to downsize and get rid of things, preparing to sell this house and move in the year or so.

[Dreadnaught]

I get that. I was like that too. But my parents had to break that out of me at some point. Growing up my dad was more of a collector and my mom was more of a thrower-outers. Over time I've become more like her.

But if your kids are above the ages of 10, you're letting his way of life become their way of life.

Still curious about your lawyer to be honest, but obviously you don't have to talk about that.

[GGT]

About way of life or learned lifestyle---they're only now realizing how divorced family life is more than which house they're visiting or consider Home, or where they keep their "stuff". Until now, it's been relatively easy because of proximity and their young ages, where everything was split/shared fairly evenly. Even holidays. That's changing because they're older, their dad has remarried and 'moved', and I'm planning on moving, too. <<Hard to believe, but Mr. Ex is still using his parents house 700 miles away (now just his dad with Alzheimer's) as a storage unit for his "stuff" from birth to age 30. >>

The lawyer thing was because his bachelor pad had reached unhealthy, condemnable levels, but he still expected visitation rights there. I refused and had to put my foot down using third party intervention. Long story.

[Lebanese Dragon]

If you're afraid of scarring the kids. I think I calling him is the best option, and telling him from now on you want all stuff to be gone through at his house, and for him to call with what the kids liked and want to bring over. If it's not done this way, the stuff will be returned and authorities contacted.

If kids have problems (or dad tries to create problems) I really think you can explain in a nice way that it's fine if the kids have the stuff you just want to store it at their dads (say you don't want to clutter the house right now). You don't have to get them into and "in-depth" reasons. Make the explanation vague, but be assertive that that's what you want.

Good luck tell me how it goes in the near future.

[GGT]

Yes, I'm afraid of scarring these kids any more than they have been. Also trying to protect myself from any more of this BS. Complicated.

Mr. Ex came by for the Thursday "visitation" pick-up, and I took a few minutes to talk to him before the kids were present. His response to me is between the paragraph marks.

No more stuff coming here (but it's their stuff), we already did this ten years ago (but they live with you), I'll be bringing things back to your new house (but they don't live with me), you can sort through it with them (but I don't have the room, since I'm selling the other house), or you can store it for them (but it's their stuff), I'm also in the process of moving and cleaning out (then I'll just throw it all away), you can throw it away if you want (but you're they're mom and they live with you), fine by me if you throw it away before sorting it with the kids (you're being unreasonable and....

the rest isn't really postable

[Hazir]

For Pete's sake, drive it all to the city dump and buy your children an xbox with a kinect controller, see if they even bother to ever ask you about the junk he saddled you with.

[GGT]

That's Uncle-speak, not parent talk.

[Lebanese Dragon]

If you want also be blunt with your ex... We both know you like to hoard, and this isn't about giving gifts to the kids as it is dumping stuff at my place. You even said it yourself "you don't have enough space at your place".

I'm giving you an option that we can both accept or you can just keep all your stuff. Let the kids go through it, I'd be happy to allow some of the stuff they like to come here, as long as it's okayed by me first. The rest you'll either have to store at your place or get rid of. That's not being unreasonable....


Good luck GGT, it would be sad if he has to throw it all away, and the kids do like some of the stuff, i really think the above solution is fair.