Quote Originally Posted by Hazir View Post
And why does any of this matter? Did you really think you were going to make me see the light by repeating the same things other people aren't getting tired of saying?
Did you ever think you were gonna convince Randblade. Why would I pretend you or Aimless are less wrong just because you're stubborn goats?

The events of 7 october were never supposed to happen; a first world, nuclear power was the victim of a genocidal war crime.
Both sides have been dedicated to fucking around and finding out. The only reason 10/7 was "never supposed to happen" was a ridiculous false sense of superiority and control. One which you seem to be echoing. . .

That has caused a lot of people to jump over the nature of what happened on 7 october back to their comfort zone of blaming the stronger side in the ensuing hot conflict. Israel, being the stronger side is told to show constraint in its reaction. Accusations of war crimes and genocide are thrown around like there's no tomorrow. We (some of us) are telling Israel (and by default ourselves) that even genocides and war crimes aren't reason to strike back indiscriminately. That sure sounds like the high ground doesn't it?
Really? You're talking to me right now. Is that what I've been doing in this thread?

So, unlike you and many others, I do not believe this is a new round in an old conflict. I also do not believe that the old rules still apply. I don't even know what the new rules are. I have a strong suspicion that the system of international law that has been built up over the period since WWII won't be a significant part of it.

You don't have to believe this, but then I suggest you to have a closer look at to whom that entire system belongs anyway and who are the people who want to see it destroyed.
That system wasn't built and maintained for the benefit of groups like the Palestinians. It was built and maintained because it maintains a more stable status quo and the stability enhances prosperity more than the alternative would. That's been the case even for Israel albeit not quite as strongly as elsewhere. But Israel is never going to not be surrounded, no matter how much ethnic cleansing it tries to do. And while this most certainly is a new round in an old conflict, I have already considered, in this thread, how that doesn't mean the methods can't or won't change. I can't see how it would work out to Israel's betterment if it does change in these directions though. If they do go that far in the direction they've seemed to be pushing in Gaza, they will not be able to stop themselves from pursuing the same path in the West Bank as well. They've already demonstrated an inability to recognize their limitations there. And quite possibly a revanchist move in Lebanon as well. And they don't have the strength to actually do all that, nor will they remain a sufficiently united society in seeking such long enough to accomplish it even if they did have the strength. They might start it but won't finish it which would buy them the worst of both directions of travel.

What has surprised me most in all this is how little effort Israel has seemed to put in to recovering the hostages. I would have thought it would be the first objective sought but their course actually seems to be directed at making recovery (either by physical force or negotiated) more difficult until after it becomes too late.