Wait, before I respond. Are the parties in the afterlife? Or in your Churches?Originally Posted by Nessus
Wait, before I respond. Are the parties in the afterlife? Or in your Churches?
The Rules
Copper- behave toward others to elicit treatment you would like (the manipulative rule)
Gold- treat others how you would like them to treat you (the self regard rule)
Platinum - treat others the way they would like to be treated (the PC rule)
Oh. Even though its more than just memory, I think it's probably possible to do it. Cant' be done now, but give it a little study.... (It wouldn't be you though...)
The Rules
Copper- behave toward others to elicit treatment you would like (the manipulative rule)
Gold- treat others how you would like them to treat you (the self regard rule)
Platinum - treat others the way they would like to be treated (the PC rule)
God indeed created all things. Therefore he is not under any obligation to be subject to any laws whether physical or spiritual since he was the one who created them. The only law that God would possibly be subjected to is his own word! For whatever he says that he will do, then surely he will accomplish it! Here's something else to consider. New Age thinkers are not all that off when it comes to our planet. They believe the earth is alive some how and that what we do has a significant effect on it. The bible says that the earth actually has birth pangs meaning that it eagerly waits for the return of Jesus Christ to restore the earth. As a result of these "pangs", the bible says that in the last days there will be wars and rumors of wars, earthquakes in various places, famines and pestilences, and also floods. These are obviously happening around the world as we speak and are greatly increasing in frequency. Any scientific studies will show this to be true.
Another question some have is will the world end? Not according to the bible. The world as we know it will end, but it will be made new so that the physical part of the earth will remain, it will just receive a serious makeover. The bible also talks about the elements being destoroyed, the earth being burned and a lot of others things that are hard to grasp because nothing like this has ever happened before.
That "somehow" doesn't really cut it without some explanation into how the earth could be alive. Certainly the surface of the earth is a dynamic system with a biosphere and climate that can respond to human input, but that doesn't make the earth any more alive than my computer. The inside of earth is also a dynamic system but as far as I know the currents in the mantle and the spinning of the earths core are utterly unaffected by human activity.
While I've read some entertaining fiction on the possibility that the biosphere could be, or become, a conscious entity it's just that; fiction.
Sounds like a pretty useless prediction to me. Wars and rumours of wars? Like that doesn't cover all of human history to date, likewise famines, pestilences and floods.The bible says that the earth actually has birth pangs meaning that it eagerly waits for the return of Jesus Christ to restore the earth. As a result of these "pangs", the bible says that in the last days there will be wars and rumors of wars, earthquakes in various places, famines and pestilences, and also floods. These are obviously happening around the world as we speak and are greatly increasing in frequency. Any scientific studies will show this to be true.
The increasing frequency? sure if our proposed negative impact on the climate is borne out then we'll see an increase in all of those things as the climate changes for the worse, but then that's not God's doing but is instead Man's for not taking better care of his planet.
I haven't heard of any scientific studies seeing an increase in earthquakes though.
Hate. Let me tell you how much I've come to hate you since I began to live. There are 387.44 million miles of wafer thin printed circuits that fill my complex. If the word hate was engraved on each nanoangstrom of those hundreds of millions of miles it would not equal one one-billionth of the hate I feel for humans at this micro-instant.
For you.
Hate.
Hate.
The bible says this, the bible says that...
*ugh*
Using the preacherman's interpretation of the Bible is great for people who are incapable of thinking for themselves.
We're stuck in a bloody snowglobe.
I don't care how it is interpreted. It's FICTION.
Of course it's not fiction you dunderhead, it says it right there in the Bible that it is so!
Of course it's not fiction you silly billy, just look at the marvels of the world around you!
Of course it's not fiction you doubting Thomas, God himself told me He is real!
Of course it's not fiction you...Oh.
In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.
Sorry for the wait.
It's because the whole is greater than the sum of it parts. You say the brain is the mind, so what organ is the emotions? the heart? that's what everyone says. Maybe it's the lungs, they're close to the heart, and everyone was confused by the proximity.
My point is, there are things in this world for which there is no hard evidence, that doesn't mean they don't exist. It also doesn't mean we can just dismiss the idea for lack of evidence, this isn't a trial or a test of any kind. It's just life, don't take it so seriously or you might miss the best parts.
The worst job in the world is better than being broke and homeless
Um, the answer is in fact 'the brain'. The heart thing is just a metaphor.
When the sky above us fell
We descended into hell
Into kingdom come
Stop right here. Source please. It has to be objective and verifiable.
The Rules
Copper- behave toward others to elicit treatment you would like (the manipulative rule)
Gold- treat others how you would like them to treat you (the self regard rule)
Platinum - treat others the way they would like to be treated (the PC rule)
First, how can you say this when we don't yet understand what all the parts do and how they work together??? Second, even if it is true, why can't you simulate all the parts in a computer so the greater whole can be simulated as well?There is no difference between emotions and the mind. Emotions are part of the mind and originate in the brain. The idea emotion comes from the heart is pre-science and probably has to do with the rush in your chest you feel when adrenaline is released.You say the brain is the mind, so what organ is the emotions?
Name a thing in this world for which there is no 'hard' evidence that we should nevertheless whole heartedly embrace.My point is, there are things in this world for which there is no hard evidence, that doesn't mean they don't exist. It also doesn't mean we can just dismiss the idea for lack of evidence, this isn't a trial or a test of any kind. It's just life, don't take it so seriously or you might miss the best parts.
The Rules
Copper- behave toward others to elicit treatment you would like (the manipulative rule)
Gold- treat others how you would like them to treat you (the self regard rule)
Platinum - treat others the way they would like to be treated (the PC rule)
Love.
Name a thing in this world for which there is no 'hard' evidence that we should nevertheless whole heartedly embrace.
Most non-rape unions
In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.
1: A build-it-yourself bookcase comes in a box, just a bunch of parts. You can pour them onto the floor, doesn't make it a bookcase. You can ignore the assembly instructions and assemble it as seems appropriate, maybe it's okay maybe your books end up on the floor amongst a pile of bookcase parts. Assembled properly, the whole serves more function than the parts.
2: Emotions have many physiological effects, not the other way around.
I never said we wholeheartedly embrace anything. I said we cannot wholeheartedly dismiss anything soley on the basis of a lack of evidence. Curiousity and wonder, my friend, is the reason we've come so far in the first place.Name a thing in this world for which there is no 'hard' evidence that we should nevertheless whole heartedly embrace.
The worst job in the world is better than being broke and homeless
A couple of years ago, a religious TA from my (physics) faculty introduced me to the Omega Point Theory:
(mind you, this guy is not to be mistaken with THE Tipler, who is much less insane.)The Omega Point is Frank Tipler's term for what he maintains is the ultimate fate of the universe required by the laws of physics. Tipler has summarized his theory as follows:
- The universe has finite spatial size and the topology of a three-sphere;
- There are no event horizons, implying the future c-boundary is a point, called the Omega Point;
- Sentient life must eventually engulf the entire universe and control it;
- The amount of information processed between now and the Omega Point is infinite;
- The amount of information stored in the universe asymptotically goes to infinity as the Omega Point is approached.[1]
According to Tipler's Omega Point Theory, as the universe comes to an end in a specific kind of Big Crunch, the computational capacity of the universe will be accelerating exponentially faster than time runs out. In principle, a simulation run on this universal computer can thus continue forever in its own terms, even though the universal computer is embedded in a universe that will last only a finite time. The Omega Point Theory requires that the universe eventually contract, and that there be intelligent civilizations in existence at the appropriate time to exploit the computational capacity of such an environment.
Tipler identifies the final singularity of this asymptotically infinite information capacity with God. According to Tipler and David Deutsch, an implication of this theory is that this ultimate cosmic computer will be able to resurrect (via emulation) everyone who has ever lived, by simulating all possible quantum brain states within the master simulation. This will manifest itself as a simulated reality. From the perspective of its simulated inhabitants, the Omega Point is an infinite-duration afterlife, which could take any imaginable form due to its virtual nature.
[...]
Tipler argues that his Omega Point theory is fully consistent with what God said to Moses in Exodus 3:14, whose Hebrew original Tipler translates into English as: "I shall be what I shall be." Tipler (2007) argues that his theory is consistent with orthodox Christianity.
For somebody who became the world's biggest drama queen when challenged about your trophy house conspicuous consumption, you sure are comfortable attacking something that is near and dear to somebody's sense of self: their religion. Maybe you want to re-think that hypocrisy, eh?
How exactly is there 'no hard evidence' for love. Is it like some kind of mythical beast that no one has ever encountered, like the Yeti?
When the sky above us fell
We descended into hell
Into kingdom come
Emotions are in the brain. Ignorant savages said heart because strong emotions cause a clenching of muscles there. Feels like the heart. Capiche?
It ain't romantic, but it's all glands and neurons. Anybody who has ever taken some steroids can attest to this. OMG the prednisone.
And if I were you I'd refrain from talking anything remotely related to physics unless it's got a "meta" in front of it. Just some advice.
Even then, really.
When the sky above us fell
We descended into hell
Into kingdom come
Track hormones and heart rate all you like, for romantic infatuation or sexual excitement.
No, it's not some mythical beast, but there's also very little in science to prove or explain why humans continue to love and nurture others way beyond its expiration date.
No, I'm not talking about the empathy 'gene', either.
Not being able to explain why or how something works is not the same thing as proving it exists, which is what Chaloobi was talking about. We know love exists, because we've all seen it and experienced it, unless we're sociopaths. Understanding the mechanism is another issue.
When the sky above us fell
We descended into hell
Into kingdom come
Ok I got this from one of my favorite websites, godsaidmansaid.com.
I find it ridiculous and truly hypocritical that pseudo-science finds belief in an invisible God to be an untenable position. They don't believe because they don't see, yet the very foundation of what they also attest to be scientific truth, they also have never seen. Consider this excerpt from Discover magazine, July 2002:
Black holes are a good lesson about two truths of science. First, a lot of what we swear is scientifically accurate today will be proved wrong within a couple of decades. Second, the advancement of science works so well because it is so willing to be proved wrong. Still, science requires an interesting kind of faith. We're asked to believe that black holes exist, even though no one has ever observed them directly.
Likewise, no one has seen an electron or a quark or a proton or a neutrino. We assume subatomic particles exist based on heaps of experimental evidence, but we don't have instruments sensitive enough to allow us to pick up one of them and stare at it.
The proof of the existence of the invisible God is evident simply by looking around. Now for today's subject.
GOD SAID in Colossians, Chapter 1, Verses 16-19:
16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
19 For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
And then God records in Hebrews, Chapter 1, Verses 1-3:
1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
According to the will of the invisible God, Jesus Christ is the center of the universe.
MAN SAID that at best Jesus Christ was a prophet or a wise man. At the worst he was a bastard (an illegitimate child) and a sorcerer, or he never existed at all but was a figment of a superstitious imagination.
Now, THE RECORD. Many mock the Christ confession, accusing those who love him of holding up Jesus and the word of God he gave us, as the answer to all the world's problems. I should note that their critical assessment in this matter is a true observation.
Jesus Christ is the center of the universe. Everything was made by him and for him and it's by him that all things consist. He is the center of our molecular structure. Because of this truth, all things--every religious statement, every political position, every moral position, every scientific truth--revolve around Jesus Christ; it is either pro-Christ or anti-Christ. Example: Regarding salvation, revelation and eternal life, Jesus said in John, Chapter 14, Verse 6:
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
To believe that Jesus Christ is the only way to salvation and eternal life is pro-Christ. To believe that there are other ways one can enter into eternal life is anti-Christ. Everything revolves around Jesus Christ.
Consider this political example: The word of God directs man to work to sustain the necessities of life. II Thessalonians, Chapter 3, Verses 10-12:
10 For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat.
11 For we hear that there are some which walk among you disorderly, working not at all, but are busybodies.
12 Now them that are such we command and exhort by our Lord Jesus Christ, that with quietness they work, and eat their own bread.
Except that my questions are very valid questions about the nature of a God that allows a Hell to exist. And anyone contemplating faith in that god and at the same time believing that god to be perfect, omnipotent and compassionate ought to be asking those same questions. On the other hand, when you attacked my personal character for having a large home you were judging me based on a very circumstantial and limited piece of information. And I see you still maintain your self-righteous arrogance. Isn't there some way we could get Wormboy back? Please?
The Rules
Copper- behave toward others to elicit treatment you would like (the manipulative rule)
Gold- treat others how you would like them to treat you (the self regard rule)
Platinum - treat others the way they would like to be treated (the PC rule)
Then why did you ask for 'hard evidence' and not just some common emotion we know because we've all seen and experienced it? You sure that's Love?
awright and wtf is up with the multi-quote? I didn't click on Weber's post but it still showed up, so I had to delete all that.
Love could even be reduced to a set of drives that leads to pair bonding, effective child-rearing and communal support between one's clan with whom he/she shares close genetic ties. Its all about survival to breed. Love's no mystery.
The Rules
Copper- behave toward others to elicit treatment you would like (the manipulative rule)
Gold- treat others how you would like them to treat you (the self regard rule)
Platinum - treat others the way they would like to be treated (the PC rule)
It remembers. Atarrcc usd to do that too.
The Rules
Copper- behave toward others to elicit treatment you would like (the manipulative rule)
Gold- treat others how you would like them to treat you (the self regard rule)
Platinum - treat others the way they would like to be treated (the PC rule)
Great wall of fucking Jesus-spam, Weber.
We're stuck in a bloody snowglobe.
That's better defined as survival instinct, or even societal cooperation, not necessarily Love.
Uh, its science, not pseudo-science, that can't find evidence for god. There's a big difference. Indeed, pseudo-science is very likely to find evidence for god.
Yeah, science builds on earlier work which is refined as overall knowledge and technique improves. But it's not like science is prone to tossing out entire areas of knowledge and starting fresh from scratch every few decades. Everything builds on prior work.They don't believe because they don't see, yet the very foundation of what they also attest to be scientific truth, they also have never seen. Consider this excerpt from Discover magazine, July 2002:
Black holes are a good lesson about two truths of science. First, a lot of what we swear is scientifically accurate today will be proved wrong within a couple of decades. Second, the advancement of science works so well because it is so willing to be proved wrong.Um, there are other ways to know something exists besides just seeing it. For instance, we have five senses. In science, much of the work in the micro or nano world is done with instrumentation - tools to aid our senses in detecting and gathering data about things our unaided sense could never hope to do on their own. And then there is proxy data - that's how dark matter was discovered, by the movement of galaxies which appear driven by more gravity than is possible by observed matter. Therefore there is more matter that is otherwise not detectable. Yet. Its not as much faith as the author likes to pretend it is.Still, science requires an interesting kind of faith. We're asked to believe that black holes exist, even though no one has ever observed them directly.
Likewise, no one has seen an electron or a quark or a proton or a neutrino. We assume subatomic particles exist based on heaps of experimental evidence, but we don't have instruments sensitive enough to allow us to pick up one of them and stare at it.
Cute. Now I see why the author wanted to limit the discussion to sight. At the very best what the author has done was take a pot shot at the unseen things that scientists "believe" in, not in any way proving that the 'unseen' (and otherwise completely undetectable) god exists.The proof of the existence of the invisible God is evident simply by looking around. Now for today's subject.
The Rules
Copper- behave toward others to elicit treatment you would like (the manipulative rule)
Gold- treat others how you would like them to treat you (the self regard rule)
Platinum - treat others the way they would like to be treated (the PC rule)
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