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Thread: You Bunch of Broken Freaks!

  1. #1

    Default You Bunch of Broken Freaks!

    I read this today and it resonated a bit:

    "...I do not believe in human perfection, and people who have no quirks, tics, obsessions, the touch of some minor mania, or points on which they turn rabid - I suspect such people of systematic imposture or of totally lacking character."

    None here are anywhere near approaching human perfection in the sense of lacking what's outlined above. Everyone here, like everyone I've yet known in my life, has a hangup or issue or five. For you young lot, your little oddity of today that embarrasses you a bit, or pisses off your roommate, or causes a fight with whoever you screw, the thing that you get teased a bit over by your buddies, that comes up after a half dozen beers with hoots and laughs, yeah, those things, they creep into you with age to the point you embrace and cherish them, guard them, hate over them. Beware. Today's blushed smirk is tomorrow's eccentric WTF.

    A LOT of rabid quirks have boiled and popped, earnestly, today and yesterday. Have you noticed? There's been such ferocity (over the simplest of matters) that I checked the phase of the moon. It's not even gibbous. Barely a half, I think. But there's something in the air that hasn't been since Atari. A bit of frenzy. Energy.

    Me? Sometimes I swear a LOT in posts, like a sailor, for enjoyment. I like to use those words sometimes. I practice them. Characterization. But sometimes I mean them. No apologies. If I cuss you out for real, odds are very good you're reaping something you sewed. Odds are. I don't really believe my cussing at any of you would ever disturb you all that much. If I thought it would, I wouldn't do it. No, you fucking monkeys are damn near impervious to my touch. Of course, I could be wrong.

    I do wonder how much of what I see here - read here - is for real. Some of you come off as if what you see is what you get. No pretending. But others, some of you, I don't know. I can't understand you so I tell myself there's no fucking way you're like this in AR. Lewk's the poster child for this - the murder cheers back to back with God's here so evolution isn't. I can't get my brain around anyone cheering the toothepaste strangle, even without being a Jesus freak in the same brain. You have to default to a judgement of profound ignorance/stupidity if you take it seriously, and Lewk's not stupid. So he has to be faking. Right? Of course, I could be wrong.

    Here I asked if I had to mention a certain someone about certain egregious ideological contradictions. I said no, it's that obvious, so I edited it out. You know who you are. We all know who and what. Move along.

    And Dread, you tipped your hand in our discussion about Detroit. You showed me you're either being extremely intellectually lazy, or only paying half attention to something that concerns me a great deal, or you're a gigantic fucking monster. After all, you're not a troll - you don't say profoundly ugly and stupid things just to get a rise out of people. So I take that position of yours, that vacant brained callous fuck you, as flat and personal disrespect to me. I could be wrong, though!

    If anyone here writes something in argument, taking a hard stand on some issue, and you don't have in the back of your mind, and I recognize why you might not be willing to say it, but if you're not thinking it at least, cautioning yourself that yeah, you could be wrong; if you're not thinking that, then THERE is a quirk/tick/hangup for you. A big ugly fucking flaw that you should recognize now when you're young because its going to harden you into a big asshole or worse, if you ever get power, a gigantic fucking monster. You better doubt and question and double-check your postions, ideologies, faiths, right when you say them, because if you don't, your abilty to grow and learn is crippled. I could be wrong, and I don't like to preach (mostly ), but if you're rolling your eyes right now on this one, think again. Because you could be fucked up and not even know it. Playing with fire, that. Or not, maybe you don't care. And if you don't, then fuck you.

    Anyway.

    You're all a bunch of wierd and annoying fuckers and, this is the mushy part, I'm so glad to know you. Seriously. Its been a pleasure. Mostly.
    The Rules
    Copper- behave toward others to elicit treatment you would like (the manipulative rule)
    Gold- treat others how you would like them to treat you (the self regard rule)
    Platinum - treat others the way they would like to be treated (the PC rule)

  2. #2

  3. #3
    I was being cold-hearted, and I admit that. And sorry if that offended. But in general it's been so cold. So very cold.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by EyeKhan View Post

    I do wonder how much of what I see here - read here - is for real. Some of you come off as if what you see is what you get. No pretending. But others, some of you, I don't know. I can't understand you so I tell myself there's no fucking way you're like this in AR. Lewk's the poster child for this - the murder cheers back to back with God's here so evolution isn't. I can't get my brain around anyone cheering the toothepaste strangle, even without being a Jesus freak in the same brain. You have to default to a judgement of profound ignorance/stupidity if you take it seriously, and Lewk's not stupid. So he has to be faking. Right? Of course, I could be wrong.
    I'm always misunderstood about this issue. It is not justice when someone is killed for stealing toothpaste. And I fully admit the punishment is unequal to the crime. The point is not to do an eye for an eye or "pay your debt to society." My vision of our Criminal Justice System is one that punishes a crime severely so others do not even consider doing the crime. In the long run if people are aware of the disastrous consequences of violating another person's property rights they will not do those crimes. And I personally feel there will be fewer "major" crimes of murder/rape/arson/larger robberies if the relatively "minor" crimes are cracked down on. (Note I don't find any theft minor but I use the term since most people consider shoplifting to a minor crime).

    I am happy that the thief was killed not because I personally wanted a single individual to die but because of the message his death sends to other would be robbers. What I would have preferred to occur was for that man to NEVER have stolen. For society to realize that the rape of other people's property is simply not acceptable and to punish it accordingly so almost no one ever does that type of crime. By posting on forums talking about the death I in my own small way plant the seed in others; the seed that stealing may lead to a brutal death at the hands of the innocent victims. Will it have an impact in society? Hah probably not I'm far too much realist to think posting on a forum will ever change anyone's opinion but I like to imagine that someone somewhere thinks twice about stealing due to fear of hearing these types of stories.

  5. #5
    Based on that theory, Lewk, we wouldn't continue to have property theft, or violent crimes. We already have the highest prison population in the world. And the death penalty. If punishment worked as a deterrent, then it would work.

  6. #6
    Somehow I've got these connections, these daily communications, to all these people I have never met and likely never will. Isn't it amazing? This moment, this arrangement, this community is unique in all of human history. Our sharing and arguing and posturing and hargle bargle hawking is holy shit new and unique. And like everything else we got used to it, incorporated it into our lives, took it for granted and moved along. I'm hoping I don't live to see the day when this civilization we take for granted finally busts open and whithers. Today anyway. Sometimes I want to live to see it, because I"m curious, and the suffering will be worth it. Other times no.
    The Rules
    Copper- behave toward others to elicit treatment you would like (the manipulative rule)
    Gold- treat others how you would like them to treat you (the self regard rule)
    Platinum - treat others the way they would like to be treated (the PC rule)

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    I'm always misunderstood about this issue. It is not justice when someone is killed for stealing toothpaste. And I fully admit the punishment is unequal to the crime. The point is not to do an eye for an eye or "pay your debt to society." My vision of our Criminal Justice System is one that punishes a crime severely so others do not even consider doing the crime. In the long run if people are aware of the disastrous consequences of violating another person's property rights they will not do those crimes. And I personally feel there will be fewer "major" crimes of murder/rape/arson/larger robberies if the relatively "minor" crimes are cracked down on. (Note I don't find any theft minor but I use the term since most people consider shoplifting to a minor crime).

    I am happy that the thief was killed not because I personally wanted a single individual to die but because of the message his death sends to other would be robbers. What I would have preferred to occur was for that man to NEVER have stolen. For society to realize that the rape of other people's property is simply not acceptable and to punish it accordingly so almost no one ever does that type of crime. By posting on forums talking about the death I in my own small way plant the seed in others; the seed that stealing may lead to a brutal death at the hands of the innocent victims. Will it have an impact in society? Hah probably not I'm far too much realist to think posting on a forum will ever change anyone's opinion but I like to imagine that someone somewhere thinks twice about stealing due to fear of hearing these types of stories.
    In a very serious sense, I'm not trying to yank your chain or 1-up you or trap you, but I can not understand how you can rationalize this with Christianity. I only bring it up because I've got a religous background and you take it very seriously. Jesus would not condone this, not even the posting of the story in good cheer, much less the act itself. No possible way.

    Also, I don't recall from the post way long ago, but did the story ever say why that guy ran out of the store with a tube of toothepaste? It doesn't make any sense for anyone sane to do something like that. I could understand if they were stealing something of more value, something drug related, or even food if they were hungry. But toothepaste? Doesn't the strangeness of that give you pause? I am thinking, what if they guy was crazy? I hear a story like this and it makes me sad. I recognize it as a tiny sign of the sickness of our civilization, a symptom of our decline. And along with that emotion there's this guy cheering it! Do you know freaky and surreal that is?
    The Rules
    Copper- behave toward others to elicit treatment you would like (the manipulative rule)
    Gold- treat others how you would like them to treat you (the self regard rule)
    Platinum - treat others the way they would like to be treated (the PC rule)

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by EyeKhan View Post
    In a very serious sense, I'm not trying to yank your chain or 1-up you or trap you, but I can not understand how you can rationalize this with Christianity. I only bring it up because I've got a religous background and you take it very seriously. Jesus would not condone this, not even the posting of the story in good cheer, much less the act itself. No possible way.

    Also, I don't recall from the post way long ago, but did the story ever say why that guy ran out of the store with a tube of toothepaste? It doesn't make any sense for anyone sane to do something like that. I could understand if they were stealing something of more value, something drug related, or even food if they were hungry. But toothepaste? Doesn't the strangeness of that give you pause? I am thinking, what if they guy was crazy? I hear a story like this and it makes me sad. I recognize it as a tiny sign of the sickness of our civilization, a symptom of our decline. And along with that emotion there's this guy cheering it! Do you know freaky and surreal that is?
    I don't believe in a theocracy. The private practice of a religious faith is seperate from government regulation.

    I do not want it to be illegal to be a follower of Islam. Even though this violates a sacred commandment to have no other gods. I do not want it to be illegal to cheat on your spouse even though this to is a sin.

    By the same token if someone comes to my home and steals my X-Box I should not try to hunt him down and kill him, as a Christian. However I fully want the government to do that because in order to have a free and orderly society, we should be able to keep the fruits of our labor and prevent criminal acts.

    As far as the guy being crazy I don't think so. From I remember toothpaste wasn't the only item he stole and he did have a history of thieving. More then likely he weighed the pros/cons of his actions. The pros was he got to get stuff for free. The cons... well who very few in his mind. Who would have thought someone would chase him down over two blocks to stop maybe 10 bucks worth of product? Now however the equation in would be criminals mind has changed. Since this has been on the news (in a few places) they will pause and think... will this happen to me?

  9. #9
    Lewk, you're assuming the criminal mind works a certain way. If anything, haven't we learned that they don't operate in a logical, consequential frame of mind, weighing pros and cons before they act? Maybe the sociopath does, and calculates what's a felony or not. Even then, do they think about doing X risking life in prison, or Y risking the death penalty?

    And don't forget that many of our "career criminals" started that path as teenagers or young adults. Knowing what we do now about the male pre-frontal lobe and processing information, it's starting to look like our jails and prisons merely make matters worse.....by putting teens into a recidivism cycle while their brains are still forming. Because we don't focus on rehabilitation or intervention as much as punishment.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by GGT View Post
    Based on that theory, Lewk, we wouldn't continue to have property theft, or violent crimes. We already have the highest prison population in the world. And the death penalty. If punishment worked as a deterrent, then it would work.
    It does but not in the way Lewk wants it to. The level of punishment and the level of deterrent is in no way linear. To think one can get rid of crime by a higher punishment is simply naive. The thing is that some people don't care about their lives to such a degree that it would stop them to do things like that. And secondly some simply believe that they wont get caught.
    "Wer Visionen hat, sollte zum Arzt gehen." - Helmut Schmidt

  11. #11
    Don't forget the class of criminal that feel they have no alternative. Sell drugs or sex to feed yourself; if you get caught, at least you still get fed.
    Faith is Hope (see Loki's sig for details)
    If hindsight is 20-20, why is it so often ignored?

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by earthJoker View Post
    It does but not in the way Lewk wants it to. The level of punishment and the level of deterrent is in no way linear. To think one can get rid of crime by a higher punishment is simply naive.
    Agreed. But it's appealing to certain people, because it's black and white and straight forward. It's interesting (and confusing) to see where Libertarians draw the line with laws, in that sense. Less Laws = more freedom Then property rights present a complex and subjective set of variables. Example EPA --- don't have environmental protection laws for the common good, but if a factory pollutes drinking water upstream, sue them for damages after the fact. Presumption that the justice system works that way after the fact, and the simple threat of a law suit will keep that factory in line before the fact?



    The thing is that some people don't care about their lives to such a degree that it would stop them to do things like that. And secondly some simply believe that they wont get caught.
    That's why poverty and desperation is so insidious and dangerous. It can make a kid give up early. It can affect their forming conscience and morality of right and wrong. If they start out young feeling like a trapped victim, with not much future, then what the fuck....carpe diem....damn the torpedoes.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Being View Post
    Don't forget the class of criminal that feel they have no alternative. Sell drugs or sex to feed yourself; if you get caught, at least you still get fed.
    The libertarian in me wants to say live and let live, if you want to sell your body or sell drugs, and it's not illegal....go for it. The humanist in me wants to say those may not be "victimless crimes" at all, and should have some legal lines drawn....to protect the vulnerable or the desperate.

    The only work-around I can find is age of consent, to protect minors. But that isn't so clear-cut either.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by GGT View Post
    The libertarian in me wants to say live and let live, if you want to sell your body or sell drugs, and it's not illegal....go for it. The humanist in me wants to say those may not be "victimless crimes" at all, and should have some legal lines drawn....to protect the vulnerable or the desperate.

    The only work-around I can find is age of consent, to protect minors. But that isn't so clear-cut either.
    But my point is that punishment in this case is considered by the perpetrator to be more of a paid vacation than a punishment.
    Faith is Hope (see Loki's sig for details)
    If hindsight is 20-20, why is it so often ignored?

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by EyeKhan View Post
    If anyone here writes something in argument, taking a hard stand on some issue, and you don't have in the back of your mind, and I recognize why you might not be willing to say it, but if you're not thinking it at least, cautioning yourself that yeah, you could be wrong; if you're not thinking that, then THERE is a quirk/tick/hangup for you. A big ugly fucking flaw that you should recognize now when you're young because its going to harden you into a big asshole or worse, if you ever get power, a gigantic fucking monster. You better doubt and question and double-check your postions, ideologies, faiths, right when you say them, because if you don't, your abilty to grow and learn is crippled. I could be wrong, and I don't like to preach (mostly ), but if you're rolling your eyes right now on this one, think again. Because you could be fucked up and not even know it. Playing with fire, that. Or not, maybe you don't care. And if you don't, then fuck you.
    The fact that you're seriously making this argument suggests that you didn't read your own post.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Being View Post
    But my point is that punishment in this case is considered by the perpetrator to be more of a paid vacation than a punishment.
    I know what you meant.

    Still, the hungry homeless person knows jail serves three square meals a day, has hot showers, toilets, and beds with sheets. But the trade-off is being caged like an animal, and maybe being sexually violated. They wouldn't call it a paid vacation in that sense. Some trade-off, huh.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by GGT View Post
    ...and maybe being sexually violated...
    Like I said, a paid vacation. You know what kinky stuff like that costs on the outside?
    Faith is Hope (see Loki's sig for details)
    If hindsight is 20-20, why is it so often ignored?

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Being View Post
    Like I said, a paid vacation. You know what kinky stuff like that costs on the outside?
    That's not funny, even though you meant it that way.

  19. #19
    Uh, this is the broken freaks thread isn't it?
    Faith is Hope (see Loki's sig for details)
    If hindsight is 20-20, why is it so often ignored?

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Being View Post
    Uh, this is the broken freaks thread isn't it?
    Some things just aren't funny to me in simple text, forum-wise. Limitations. Sorry, this isn't like a twisted SNL short.

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    The fact that you're seriously making this argument suggests that you didn't read your own post.
    I doubt and second guess most things I do and say. I don't always say it.
    The Rules
    Copper- behave toward others to elicit treatment you would like (the manipulative rule)
    Gold- treat others how you would like them to treat you (the self regard rule)
    Platinum - treat others the way they would like to be treated (the PC rule)

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    I don't believe in a theocracy. The private practice of a religious faith is seperate from government regulation.

    I do not want it to be illegal to be afollower of Islam. Even though this violates a sacred commandment to have no other gods. I do not want it to be illegal to cheat on your spouse even though this to is a sin.

    By the same token if someone comes to my home and steals my X-Box I should not try to hunt him down and kill him, as a Christian. However I fully want the government to do that because in order to have a free and orderly society, we should be able to keep the fruits of our labor and prevent criminal acts.
    Jesus instructed us to follow his lead, personally, and to spread the word. Your opposition to theocracy is very much in line with that, but wanting the government to hunt down and kill the x-box thief while at the same time being unwilling to do it yourself due to your Christian faith is a little schizophrenic. And what about voting? If you elect a government with the desire for it to do unchristian things on your behalf, come on. You think that's going to pass muster in your Judgement?
    The Rules
    Copper- behave toward others to elicit treatment you would like (the manipulative rule)
    Gold- treat others how you would like them to treat you (the self regard rule)
    Platinum - treat others the way they would like to be treated (the PC rule)

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by EyeKhan View Post
    I doubt and second guess most things I do and say. I don't always say it.
    Unfortunately, you do so on the basis of extremely ideological and uninformed beliefs, which means the outcome doesn't change.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    Unfortunately, you do so on the basis of extremely ideological and uninformed beliefs, which means the outcome doesn't change.
    If you ever make it out of your academic litter box you will discover how uninformed you are (but I could be wrong).
    Last edited by Being; 11-15-2010 at 02:58 AM.
    Faith is Hope (see Loki's sig for details)
    If hindsight is 20-20, why is it so often ignored?

  25. #25
    I don't understand this thread. What was that OP all about?

  26. #26
    If you're not a freak, you're not human...or some such.
    Faith is Hope (see Loki's sig for details)
    If hindsight is 20-20, why is it so often ignored?

  27. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Being View Post
    If you're not a freak, you're not human...or some such.
    Was the OP some missive he kept on a personal file or something? I don't recall reading that in this forum. If it was a post, it would just be bumped. But I could be wrong about that.

  28. #28
    Quotable Lem,

    "I confess that he made me uneasy, because I do not believe in human perfection, and people who have no quirks, tics, obsessions, the touch of some minor mania, or points on which they turn rabid — I suspect such people of systematic imposture (we judge others by ourselves) or of totally lacking character. Certainly, much depends on the side from which we get to know a man. If, as usually happened to me, I first became acquainted with someone through his work — which in my profession is extremely abstract — and therefore, as it were, from the most spiritual side, the impact of meeting that entirely physical organism, which I had pictured instinctively as a kind of Platonic emanation, was always a shock."

    — from His Master's Voice, by Stanislaw Lem.
    Faith is Hope (see Loki's sig for details)
    If hindsight is 20-20, why is it so often ignored?

  29. #29
    Oh! So Choobie quoted Lem and went on a little rant about forumites? Lem's shock is Choobie's fuck you?

    I still don't get it. He hasn't met anyone here as an entirely physical organism to say the spiritual side makes us a bunch of broken freaks, from how he imagined us.

  30. #30
    I might be wrong, but I think I Can meant being a freak is (and I hate this word) normal.
    Faith is Hope (see Loki's sig for details)
    If hindsight is 20-20, why is it so often ignored?

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