Egypt is having a revolution today.

[Draco]

This does feel sort of like 1989 in Eastern Europe

Yeah but are the bulk of the people unified on what they want? Do they want to properly step into the 21st century, and progress with the rest of the world? Or step back several centuries in order to maintain an even firmer grip on some so called 'identity', yet at the same time take advantage of Western technology..

I saw on the news during the peak of the Egypt protests, this obviously religious man, in Cairo probably, was shouting how an Islamic state should be created and onlookers were nodding.

[Hazir]

Yeah but are the bulk of the people unified on what they want? Do they want to properly step into the 21st century, and progress with the rest of the world? Or step back several centuries in order to maintain an even firmer grip on some so called 'identity', yet at the same time take advantage of Western technology..

I saw on the news during the peak of the Egypt protests, this obviously religious man, in Cairo probably, was shouting how an Islamic state should be created and onlookers were nodding.

Egypt wouldn't be my main concern when it comes to that as the transfer is going rather orderly and there is a center of power to push it along in a direction that may actually turn Egypt into a functioning democracy under the rule of law AND respecting human rights.

It's more about those countries where the system could collapse alltogether (those that resist hardest) and where then it's all up for grabs for extremists.

The problem about extremists is, by the way, that from the point of view of the poorly educated these people may be nasty in the way they operate, their ultimate goal is a strict observance of Islam (as they see it). That makes it hard to oppose them while not being made irrelevant as an apostate. Of course, an important reason for that is what I have pointed out over and over again; by oppressing every other opposition into extinction, your last opponent standing is that one that drapes himself in the colours of religion.

[Draco]

The problem about extremists is, by the way, that from the point of view of the poorly educated these people may be nasty in the way they operate, their ultimate goal is a strict observance of Islam (as they see it). That makes it hard to oppose them while not being made irrelevant as an apostate. Of course, an important reason for that is what I have pointed out over and over again; by oppressing every other opposition into extinction, your last opponent standing is that one that drapes himself in the colours of religion.

And those uneducated people would rather go with something that they're more familiar with (their religion with an undertone of fundamentalism) than something completely foreign.

[Hazir]

And those uneducated people would rather go with something that they're more familiar with (their religion with an undertone of fundamentalism) than something completely foreign.

If you mean by foreign unknown, then you are right.

[Aimless]

You know Hazir it would be nice to see those ideas of yours in an article

[LittleFuzzy]

It is hard to see though how the Iranian Regime could survive without the support of the IRG. The memo also says that the govenrment should also keep a check on their Basjri (sp) thugs.

It would have trouble if faced with a full-blown uprising without the IRG on board, but if the IRG is simply going to be neutral *and even now I have a really hard time seeing them intervening to protect protesters* then the regime can go quite a long time on inertia, with the militia and other headcrackers crushing the smaller-scale stuff.

[Hazir]

Rumour has it Khadaffi is on the run.

[coinich]

That would be nice.

[Hazir]

They may have been speaking too early; his son Saif is talking on state TV right now.

Talking about Tunesia and Egypt; he talks about how the government was prepared for the present situation. He gives a fairly accurate description of the situation so far. A, now of course there are 'foreign elements' and 'separatists' at work.

He admits that the army made mistakes dealing with the riots; people were killed. The protesters were under the influence of drugs in Bengazi. The mass media from other countries are exagerating the numbers.

He calls the deaths of Libyan citizens a tragedy and people have the right to be angry about this.

Separatists and Islamists are abusing the present situation; they attacked the army and
stole heavy arms.

He calls upon the people to resist a plot against Libya in which arab and african mercenaries are employed. He calls them to fight the Islamists and separatists.

Now he is telling Libyans that Libya is different than Tunesia or Egypt, he's telling people this fight will lead to the end of the country and it will deprive people of oil as a source of wealth. Basically the same 'the dictatorship is good for you speech'. A bit like what we saw just before Mubarrak had to leave.

And now a non-veiled threath of civil war in Libya, with the ensuing hunger and poverty. Especially the eastern provinces will be hungry (the part of the country where they effectively no longer have the power).

He calls a People's assemblee to change the legal system and put down a Constitution which will give more freedoms to all the people.

So the choice is; the dictatorship reforming itself or damnation.

In the latter case of course US and EU fleets will come and wipe out whatever islamic emirates the separatists will try to establish.

[coinich]

Yeah, I was wondering where you got resignation from. Interesting that an Army unit is reported to have rebelled however.

[Hazir]

Yeah, I was wondering where you got resignation from. Interesting that an Army unit is reported to have rebelled however.

PressTV and al-Arabiya were disseminating the reports of a flight. I think it's pretty much a given that the east of the country no longer is under the control of the regime. Saif had some silly story about some 100 thugs overrunning the armed forces there, but it seems a whole lot more likely the armed forces in the east decided to turn coats.

[coinich]

"9:40 pm Mohamed, a doctor from Al Jalaa hospital in Benghazi, confirmed to Al Jazeera that members of the military had sided with the protesters.

We are still receiving serious injuries, I can confirm 13 deaths in our hospital. However, the good news is that people are cheering and celebrating outside after receiving news that the army is siding with the people ... but there is still a brigade that is against the demonstrators. For the past three days demonstrators have been shot at by this brigade, called Al-Sibyl brigade."

Al-Jazeera's Libya blog. Interesting stuff, but a bit unreliable I think. That being said, sounds like certain tribes and clans have been called into the revolutionary side of this as well. I'm starting to think Khadaffi's gonna get kicked out.

[Hazir]

Mayhem is the only word to describe the situation in Libya at the moment. There are soldiers with machine guns shooting at the protesters and there are reports of planes actually bombing Tripoli. Also several aircraft of the Libyan airforce have defected to Malta.

The UK foreign minister claims that Khadafi is on his way to Venezuela, something that Venezuela vehemently denies.

[earthJoker]

I really really hope that all those people's death will lead to something. This is really shocking.