Internet border control

[Aimless]

For just over a week now I've been trying to figure out a way to accomplish a seemingly trivial task, namely to purchase an HP TouchPad. This has so far proven to be beyond my abilities, and not only because of the high demand and the low availability (particularly in Europe). Turns out ordering things from the US is an unbelievable chore for international customers, when it's possible at all.

Most of you are US residents, so perhaps you were not aware of this problem. Do you know what international customers, eg. in Sweden, may have to wrangle with in order to make a simple purchase from an American store (even a virtual one eg. the Kindle bookstore, or Amazon app-store), or to access an American service such as pandora.com?

Here's a selection: mail forwarding services (fails much of the time due to mismatch between billing and shipping addresses as well as an aversion towards mail forwarders on the part of several stores); concierge shopping; virtual American debit card eg. via usunlocked.com (if you're comfortable giving them all the info they need to create a card for you, it's great. I got incredibly nervous after having started the process and aborted it); juggling paypal accounts (slim chance); IP trickery along the lines of Tor or hotspot shield; chaining payment methods using gift-certificates. I may have missed a few.

I find this astonishing. It's not my evil socialist mercantilist govt. that's stopping me. I'm not trying to get something for free. I'm not even trying to get anything cheaper by turning to US stores (rather, I'm just trying to get something that they haven't seen fit to launch abroad). Online shopping is nowhere near as awesome as I expected it would be. I thought it would be easier than this to exchange money for trinkets.

[CitizenCain]

Well, actually it is your evil mercantile government that's stopping you. Or that your evil mercantile government is different from the evil mercantile government in the area you wish to purchase your goods in. FWIW, it's an equally fucktastic nightmare trying to get Euro goods shipped to the Americas, or was last time I tried a few years ago.

Shit, when I did my time over in the UK, I was bringing several Brits stuff from the US, and ended up bringing back an extra suitcase full of British stuff for my US colleagues. And it is quite infuriating - having to fly across an ocean just to be able to give someone money!!! Grrr.

[Ominous Gamer]

From the BestBuy lines I've seen, US residents are having enough trouble picking one up for $99.

[Aimless]

HP will be taking orders directly via their online store for the next batches, US billing address a must. BestBuy offers an option for international orders, even if it's more cumbersome than the usual procedure!

I get it, companies want to protect their markets for various reasons. I can understand the reasoning behind eg. restricting pharmaceuticals. But it's ridiculous when it's about items for which there is only one market. And what could anyone possibly want to import to the US from the UK? Another class society?

[CitizenCain]

HP will be taking orders directly via their online store for the next batches, US billing address a must. BestBuy offers an option for international orders, even if it's more cumbersome than the usual procedure!

So order from Best Buy... or pay someone from here to buy and send you one. *shrug* The big deal is...? I mean, other than this being proof that big government sucks ass and only serves to get in the way and jerk everyone around... ()

I get it, companies want to protect their markets for various reasons. I can understand the reasoning behind eg. restricting pharmaceuticals.

Why's that? I get all my [legal] pharmaceuticals from India, so clearly they're not doing a good job of protecting that market...

But it's ridiculous when it's about items for which there is only one market.

Not sure what's "one market" about a tablet PC, honestly. Seems like something that's got as many markets as anything else.

And what could anyone possibly want to import to the US from the UK? Another class society?

It was all weird "specialty" crap I didn't know much about. Like my boss's boss wanted a particular brand of pan with a new type of no-stick coating that wasn't available on his side of the ocean, for example. I can't judge too much, though, since I came back with like £100 worth of candy and other junk food (for me) that's not available in the US. For such a fat country, American candies and snack foods really suck.

[LittleFuzzy]

HP will be taking orders directly via their online store for the next batches, US billing address a must. BestBuy offers an option for international orders, even if it's more cumbersome than the usual procedure!

I get it, companies want to protect their markets for various reasons. I can understand the reasoning behind eg. restricting pharmaceuticals. But it's ridiculous when it's about items for which there is only one market. And what could anyone possibly want to import to the US from the UK? Another class society?

Unless there is a common market, there are always differences and hence transactional costs for operating. Why bother?

[Loki]

HP will be taking orders directly via their online store for the next batches, US billing address a must. BestBuy offers an option for international orders, even if it's more cumbersome than the usual procedure!

I get it, companies want to protect their markets for various reasons. I can understand the reasoning behind eg. restricting pharmaceuticals. But it's ridiculous when it's about items for which there is only one market. And what could anyone possibly want to import to the US from the UK? Another class society?

What about tariffs? I don't think your government would be too happy with you buying American goods that the government can't tax.

[Hazir]

What about tariffs? I don't think your government would be too happy with you buying American goods that the government can't tax.

I seriously doubt it is about tariffs, this is more about the sales model of bigger companies. I have wondered very often why half of the iTunes store is off limit to me. Also, taxes could be levied as the goods go through customs physically.

[Loki]

I seriously doubt it is about tariffs, this is more about the sales model of bigger companies. I have wondered very often why half of the iTunes store is off limit to me. Also, taxes could be levied as the goods go through customs physically.

That would entail checking all the parcels that enter the country, which isn't really feasible. And people can't exactly be trusted to declare all foreign purchases.

You might have a point about this being a business model of the major corporations. They seem to like fragmenting markets, as it allows them to set prices in each market based on the elasticity of demand there.

[Hazir]

That would entail checking all the parcels that enter the country, which isn't really feasible. And people can't exactly be trusted to declare all foreign purchases.

You might have a point about this being a business model of the major corporations. They seem to like fragmenting markets, as it allows them to set prices in each market based on the elasticity of demand there.

As it happens here in Holland if you buy from outside the EU you have to count on paying VAT on your purchase. Things slip through of course but you appear to forget that a value has to be declared and that major companies unlike Chinese webshops are not inclined to lie about content and value of what they ship.

[CitizenCain]

What about tariffs? I don't think your government would be too happy with you buying American goods that the government can't tax.

Now that you mention it, I once had to smuggle a laptop across the border, on account of the duty on the laptop I'd bought for a friend being more than the cost of the laptop. I tried shipping it up there originally, but it came back back as refused after customs opened it up and went to asses their absurd tariffs and whatnot - good thing I live close enough to drive to the border, and not in Texas or something.

As it happens here in Holland if you buy from outside the EU you have to count on paying VAT on your purchase. Things slip through of course but you appear to forget that a value has to be declared and that major companies unlike Chinese webshops are not inclined to lie about content and value of what they ship.

That's not true. A lot of the imported goods I get, from major companies are "cleverly" miscategorized and declared as being worth small fractions of their actual values.

[Hazir]

Really? That surprises me. I know the practise mostly when I order stuff from China or Hong Kong, everything I buy from there is a present barely worth postage (If you'd believe declarations). Anyway it shows more than anything that it's more about company policy than about real borders.

[CitizenCain]

Yeah, I guess that being honest on the customs declaration costs too many customers. I know I'd switch suppliers real quick if mine started being honest and having tariffs and the like applied at the border.