Online Dating
Who is for it? Who is against the concept of trying to meet someone online?
And if you're for it, which site do you think is best?
For some reason some people around me keep talking about it. I am highly skeptical of the concept (or at least my ability to actually make something of it).
http://www.abadcaseofthedates.com/
Most of these were a consequence of online dates. Enough said.
Hope is the denial of reality
Okcupid seems to be pretty easy to use to setup dates and shit. Thats the site the gizmodo blogger used to setup her date with a M:tG World Champion (in NY); I'm betting she regrets writing about that by now. Hear lots of people use it. I wonder if plentyoffish still has a huge user base.
Me? I used MySpace
"In a field where an overlooked bug could cost millions, you want people who will speak their minds, even if they’re sometimes obnoxious about it."
I had a fairly long post, ready to press REPLY, but the whole thing went poof.
From what I hear OKCupid is really just good for hooking up. I suppose places like eHarmony and Match are better if you're actually trying to find something longer term?
I am not an expert.
Long story short, match.com has good testimonials. Whether you're looking for a short term travel companion or a long term mate.
Just be very careful how you answer the profile questions. Things like how many times someone else has been married, their true age, how many cosmetic procedures they've had, what they're willing to lie about, or what they consider "white lies that don't mean anything".
You could treat it like the real world, you know, except for the fact that it's virtual and convenient (and the drinks aren't marked up a few hundred percent). You can screen lots more people online than in real life, but at the end of the day, that's about it. It's not some magic tonic, or whatever, but it is a good way to "meet" people on a busy schedule, and more volume means more sekzing... or better odds of finding that "special person" if you're all hung up on monogamy for some silly reason.
Statistically, people are less likely to lie in an online dating profile than in real life.Originally Posted by GGT
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-- Thomas Jefferson: American Founding Father, clairvoyant and seditious traitor.
Yeah, that numbers game is really the only thing I think it has going for it. As you get older you don't necessarily meet as many new people. Fewer friends of friends to plow through.
A decent number of my friends have been using it. Primarily OKCupid. And while they don't seem to recognize it, I wouldn't say they've had great experiences. Then again, I suspect they were using it more for cruising than they realize.
That said, I've been mostly single for a little while now. So the nonstop mentions of OKCupid encounters of these few friends (plus the recent New Yorker article about online dating) has gotten my attention. My main concern is I don't think I have the personality to meet people like this. I'm not good at being set-up with someone; usually I know how I feel about someone pretty quickly. Whenever I'm set-up, I know within 5 minutes but waste two hours and $20-40 on a date.
Statistically, is there companion data for those more likely to believe a liar on-line than in real life?
Not sure if you're trying kid others or yourself, but there's no way make a judgement in 5 minutes, unless you value physical beauty above all else. Doesn't matter if you're "set-up" or not.
Most people can tell in a few minutes if they have a personality connection with someone else.
Yeah, the question is are their experiences "not great" because the website/user pool is bad, or because dating in general is a "not great" experience? My money's on dating being "not great" in general... it's like that Carlin quote I like (Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.), except instead of thinking or realizing, you're setting out to meet these people. <shudder> Not exactly a formula for success, that.
Eww, why? I mean, why stay? Make up an excuse, piss her off, tell her you're impotent/gay/still in love with your sister. My favorite is "look, I don't think we're really all that compatible, but if you want, I've got a big back seat and be willing to fuck you so this isn't a complete waste of your time..." that works pretty well and I don't really see any way it could possibly go bad, but I guess that's just not your style. Meh.
Well, whatever your style is, it seems like you could do yourself a favor by screening out a lot of those wasted dates and $20 bills by either going to a hooker up front (which I bet you'll find something wrong with too), or by doing the online dating thing and chatting/IMing/whatever before you meet up anywhere, so you can at least filter out the 5-minutes-and-done dates from the much smaller list of people you can tolerate sitting through a meal with.
Or you can just give up, drink half a fifth so you don't care how vapid and stupid they are, and head out to the bar. Which reminds me, it's Friday... or will be the next time I go to work. Sweeeeet.
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-- Thomas Jefferson: American Founding Father, clairvoyant and seditious traitor.
That's actually a pretty reasonable way to look at things.
The caveat being people can make themselves look nice and interesting on the Internet and be not-so-much in real life.
Dread, if you know yourself and your values, it won't matter so much where or how you find a date/lover/mate. By that I mean---if you go by physical looks, join a gym or hang out where "pretty women" hang out. Wherever that is, depending on what you define as beautiful women.
If you like written, descriptive reviews and accolades made by others, then use your academic or journalism connections. If you value articulate and smart women who also write well, there are plenty of places to look on your own, including blogs. If you want a Jewish woman, then go....wherever Jewish woman can be found.
You have to know what you're looking for, first and foremost. I think a lot of people have been convinced by popular culture that they don't really know what they want and that's why they pay for on-line dating sites. Or matchmakers.
Well, crap, since everyone logged off and I'm still here....I'll have some more wine and keep chatting about finding compatible lovers or mates (maybe or maybe not via on-line dating sites). If y'all think my "advice" is stupid, feel free to ignore it entirely. And Cain especially, please don't use it as fodder for another argument.
Hard to explain, but INTIMACY should be something you can define for yourself, and know what its value means to you. That would include things like long-distance relationships that are forced upon you, or might be part of what actually makes the relationship work. Some people don't do well with daily interactions, and find that absence makes the heart grow fonder. If the distant longings, heart-felt letters, or poignant e-mails are what brought you together intimately.....then be prepared to find that's an important part of the relationship. Once the distance is gone, and the letters or e-mails stop, plenty of couples realize they don't know how to be intimate on a daily basis.
Then the soldier decides to voluntarily sign up for another deployment even though a baby is on the way, or the businessman agrees to make more out-of-town trips even though it means living in hotels and eating crappy food, or the woman decides to go for the promotion that means being away from home and hiring a nanny to raise the kids. Those are all intimacy issues, and feeling better with distance, or choosing distance. Finding more "intimacy" by being away, reading or writing letters, talking on the phone until one of you falls asleep....getting inspiration from waiting and building up hopes....getting excited by the thought of a temporary and fleeting moment with each other, almost like a forbidden tryst.
If that's what keeps you going now, it may not work when the deployments are over, the business trips are over, or you're just damn tired of flying on planes, the kids are older and don't need a nanny, but you realize how much of their childhood you missed......and you're both in the kitchen face to face, can't write a letter or send an e-mail, but you also can't talk to each other. Someone will make coffee, the other will go for a run, and both will think about love in absentia that used to work so well. And wonder how to make that love work daily, with the same longing that could last weeks or months.
Years ago, I started chatting with ICQ linked to a webcam site. It was fun, and I "met" a lot of interesting, as well as weird people in the process. I was killing time, rather that actively looking to find someone. In the process, I met Stephen. That was over eleven years ago.
Dread, I agree that you can very often get a good feel for someones personality in 5 minutes. You continue to learn more in five hours, in five days, in five weeks...well, if they make it that far.
I never cared for the process of dating. I never actively sought out partners. Even though I met my partner online, I don't know that I would enjoy using an online dating site.
One of my friends has been in a long term relationship as a result of match.com, or eharmony. I don't like her boyfriend, I don't think he is right for her at all. Meeting him for the first time....he lost me with his 9/11 conspiracy theories....and my friend saying later, "oh, well, we'll never talk about THAT again.
Anyone mind if I keep posting?
After that post above ^ I was thinking of couples I knew who'd celebrated 50 or 60 year wedding anniversaries. Still together, still loving each other, and all by their own choices. We've all known or heard of couples who got divorced in their 60's or 70's, also by their own choices, so what's the difference? I don't really know.
And I'm too old now to ever celebrate a 50 or 60 year anniversary with someone who shares that kind of love and commitment. That kind of continuity and history, that kind of depth, patience, or wisdom that only time can nurture. Shortly before my uncle died (who had one of the best marital relationships I'd ever seen) he told me that love didn't work in time as we're accustomed. That I should never give up hope for finding a truly compatible mate, even as I aged.
Then he had to get off the phone, start a load of laundry, make some breakfast, and help his beloved wife put on her hose (always a comedy with lots of laughing) and dress her for the day, before he took the train to work. She had Parkinson's Disease, see. He was present at every doctor's appointment and specialist referral. He was her caretaker and wheelchair pusher when they went to Scotland to trace family roots. He helped dress and feed her, did the grocery shopping and vacuuming, and never once complained. He was her husband, they were married, HE LOVED HER.
Later, she became his caretaker when his kidneys failed, after his open heart surgery. Then, he needed dialysis three times a week, then an A/V shunt. First shunt got infected, so he needed another. Living in a Nursing Home for a while. Everything seemed to fail for my dear Uncle, and all at the same time. Coumadin left him looking like he'd been in an alley fight, all bruised and bleeding. And his wife of 50 + years, in her Parkinson's state, trying to take care of him. While he was still determined to take care of her, any way he could. They needed quite a lot of assistance from others.
Picture that, just for a moment.
They weren't trying to get away from each other. They were trying very hard to help each other, even in their own debilitated states. But there was NO WAY for them to do that on their own, let alone for just each other. They admitted they needed help, and availed professional assistance at a private nursing/rehab facility. During our short visit, they mentioned how lucky they were, and how badly they felt for others who couldn't get the same high quality care they'd received.
My uncle was the kind of guy who cared about the doorman at his office building, and knew if there was a wife or children behind every door opened...and he wasn'
t just a great tipper but an interested friend.
I wish we had more of that sentiment these days. I'm not sure where that kind of love and commitment went. Or why people presume that kind of communitarianism is bad. Where did everyone's heart and compassion go?
Saks?
Oh, wait, no: Tiffany's.
Meh.
After I split up with my fiancée four years ago I went on an online dating binge for quite a while.
Used the big sites; Match and DatingDirect; and used a couple of smaller UK-based sites, Singles365 and Guardian Soulmates (yes yes, from the Guardian)
Out of a couple of dozen dates, I only came across two that I liked. One of whom didn't like me in return so no second date, and the other with whom I went on three more dates before she decided she wasn't interested.
Overall, for me, it was a strange and ungratifying experience, and I felt not a little bit whorish pimping myself out and trying to make myself appear attractive online. Dates could be slightly excruciating. Often you simply had nothing in common and nothing to talk about, and this is in spite of the fact that you seemed to get along online prior to meeting up.
~
If you do want to get yourself out there and meeting people Dread, I would highly recommend social organisations.
I came across CitySocialising.com in London a few years back, at the same time I was online dating.
These are not dating sites. They are geared toward organising events and meet-ups to which anyone can sign up and attend, from evenings at pubs and bars and clubs, gigs, city walks and tours, meals at restaurants, sporting events, tennis, jogging, you name it.
Because, as you rightly say earlier on in the thread, friends do eventually hook up and enter coupledom, become more insular, your circle of 'social' friends who go out and mingle becomes smaller, and you have far fewer opportunities for dating. People who are single find themselves wanting to expand their circle.
Sites like CitySocialising have grown massively in the last few years for that very reason. I met the founder of the site a few times at events, and she was making a fortune due to its success. It has spread from London to all other major UK cities.
Single thirty somethings by far form the majority of people who attend; people who find themselves wanting to go out, whose friends have all settled down, who are no longer in their twenties but still want the twenties level of social interaction. Lots of people too, who have moved to the city from elsewhere and don't really know anybody.
And of course, because you meet an awful lot of people, you will meet someone to whom you are attracted.
With Online dating, you have no idea if you will be attracted to the person until you actually meet them. No idea at all. Whereas through social meetup organisations like CitySocialising, the interaction is immediate, not online. And because it is not dating, there is no pressure, just lots of conversation and fun times.
I made some good friends through CitySocialising with whom I remain in contact though I am no longer a member. And I did have many, many dates through it. Four girls I went on to have a relationship with, and I met my current lady through it too, at a Six-Nations Rugby event at a pub in Covent Garden. 18 months later we are happily living together.
So based on my experience, if I encounter anyone considering online dating, I steer them toward CitySocialising or equivalent instead. Much more fun, much more gratifying, much better way to meet people of both sexes.
It's usually even faster than that. You may not recognize it, but you already decided how much you like the other person in the first few seconds.
Most of those have to be made up. Surely there are not that many crazy people out there? Please?
Last edited by Khendraja'aro; 09-16-2011 at 11:16 AM.
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
There's also www.meetup.com I was surprised at how many social type events were in my city alone (although the website is from America).
As for dating websites, I've tried it and have gotten absolutely nothing out of them. Never met anyone even half decent. The words "morals and values" seem to deter a lot of guys my age. As if there's something "wrong" with having self respect and not wanting a quick fling, then trying to base a relationship off that.
Uh, I hate to break it to you, but there's a difference between what you mean to say, what you're writing and what others actually see when they read your posts.
As such, the terms "morals and values" most probably put this kind of picture into most people's minds:
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
Right, because it's code for "won't put out and will expect you to come to my church and hear about how enjoying life is incompatible with morality and self-respect [and other assorted lies most people outgrow in high school]."
That's not just going to deter guys your age, or just guys online, FYI. Deters people of all ages in all venues.
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-- Thomas Jefferson: American Founding Father, clairvoyant and seditious traitor.
I don't think there's any disconnect between those, but it's probably not received the way he might wish. It's a lonely way to live, believe me, I know
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
Re. the OP, some of my friends tried online dating a few years back and those that were looking for relationships are still together with the guys and gals they met that way. Those that were looking for fornication and flings had plenty of those as well but all of them are also in relationships now
The approach Tim described seems like a very good idea, even if it may often be hard for people to make the transition from hanging out to being in a relationship or just boinking in such a friendly context.
Have you tried speed-dating, Dread?
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
I know a few of my guy friends have used different dating sites in the past, not sure which ones though. (It's the sort of thing they only discuss with me after a night of drinking, which I haven't had in a long time) A few of them have gone on dates, usually not lasting more than 2 or 3.
The odd result of one such meeting: my guy friend met a girl on a dating site, and though they didn't really hit it off romance-wise, she became a part of our group of friends. She started dating another of my guy friends (original guy's close pal), and now they are married. Everybody's happy about it as far as I can tell.
Can't really tell, though there seems to be an element of truth in most of them. They sure are amusing to read when you have nothing better to do.
Hope is the denial of reality
What in particular do you mean with "morals and values"?
I know I didn't expand on my comment, but see below.
I find ZERO enjoyment out of having sex with a stranger or someone I don't value. ZERO enjoyment out of waiting for Friday/Saturday night to drink as much alcohol as I can, to the point where I either can't walk properly, or end up breaking down and crying about my life. So where does it end? When you're 40+ and wondering how you wasted your life with drunken nights and some quick f*'s?
Which is a sad indication of the state people are in. Having a moral code (based on reason btw, not religion) and your own value system is looked down upon, but drinking yourself silly and not remembering who you f*ed the night before is such a desirable trait.That's not just going to deter guys your age, or just guys online, FYI. Deters people of all ages in all venues.
Thanks for asking. This is what I mean:
Having a moral code and value system that's based on reason, based on your own independent thinking, not on what your generation deems to be "fun" not on what your religion deems to be "moral", but what your independent will has to say about it.
Having confidence in yourself, a high self-esteem, self respect, placing the advancement of your own life as the highest of values; not drunken nights where you escape reality and have "fun." By fun, I mean: where you work Monday-Friday, wait for the weekend to have "fun", where you drink so much to the point where you either: sit there with a blank look, staring into space not thinking, like some animal OR have a random fling with a stranger, OR you just prattle around in some drunken chaos, along with everyone else, senselessly and purposelly, escaping the burden of having to think.
Having a moral code and value system that you stick to for your entire life, building a strong character of yourself, knowing what to do when confronted with some dilemma and not betraying your reasoning mind by acting on the whim/emotions of the moment. Deciding to have sex with another person because you value them as a person, because you're in a relationship with them, because you love them for who they are, because you admire their qualities, personality traits etc. Not because you've downed a few glasses of alcohol, and some random person happens to look attractive so like some animal you jump on them, or not because you're attracted to them because of their appearance, or their wealth, or their social standing, but because you have self respect, because you value your own life and you value the other person.
Who here can say that developing a relationship with someone whom you love/value/admire, and then celebrating that union through a sexual act, is NOT as satisfying/fullfilling as having a random encounter with a stranger, or a friend, or anyone else whom you don't value? You can't say yes to both.
Anyone who wants to drink themselves into a stupor, or use drugs (such as marijuana, exstacy, and all that crap) for the whole purpose of having "fun", to escape reality, is not a rational person who values their life. I understand that the likes of alcohol and certain drugs have their benefits (which I'll get into later), but not to the point where you're doing it to escape reality, which sadly is what many people do.
I understand that you can still value your life, that you can still want to advance it, and that you still want to go out for the odd night of where you have a few glasses of alcohol, and I don't see anything wrong with that, so long as you're not making a habit out of it, so long as it's not being done to escape reality, to escape the responsibility of having to think.
I get it, I have a few drinks every now and then, but within reason. I've only ever been drunk twice in my life: the first time was when I was 19 and at a friends house one drink lead to another (for the record, I've held this anti-drunk view since I was a teenager), after that night I was very "worried" or just concerned what being drunk could do to you. Not that I did anything "stupid" (although I did wake up with some scars on my arm), but through out the whole night I thought to myself "I know I'm drunk, but I'm gonna act silly anyway, I feel like I can stop it but I won't" and I don't like not being able to control myself. The second time was last year, and the honest reason was because I was feeling down at the time, and I knew that drinking straight vodka would just make me forget all my troubles. Again I didn't do anything "stupid", but what worried me was that I ended up having a horrible pain in my stomach (which subsided after some food) and after the "high" that comes, I ended up feeling so low because of that realisation that yes I have to come back to reality. My friends (who get drunk on a weekly basis) thought it was "fun" since they know I'm not the type to get drunk, but looking back I regret it, because I went against something that I had held onto for some time.
Having these experiences showed me just how important it is for a person to maintain a moral code and value system, to stick by it for your life, to create that strong character, someone who'll know what to do in any given situation, who won't seek out alcohol or drugs to escape from their problems, but will face them head on, will resolve them and come out stronger because of them. Isn't it more worth while to develop yourself as a person of integrity, to stay true to it throughout your life, so that one day you can look back and be proud of it? What's there to be proud of of drunken weekends, experimenting with drugs, random flings, and the likes? What does that all amount to?
The only people I expect to have an issue with my views are those who have no semblance of a moral code or value system, and to be honest, I don't care for your opinions since I know that I'm not wrong, that I'm not going about my life in the "wrong" way. I find greater satisfaction in advancing/developing my mind, than catering to my emotions, or what feels to be fun at the time.
I like this quote by William Penn: What is wrong is wrong, even if everyone is doing it. Right is still right, even if no one else is doing it.
I have other points to include, such as comparing myself to other people I know, who have taken the route of alcohol and drugs, but I have to go to work.
Draco... how do you have fun? you know, fun; full fledged, holy shit the stories we will tell our kids, don't be a square, who has bail, fun?
"In a field where an overlooked bug could cost millions, you want people who will speak their minds, even if they’re sometimes obnoxious about it."
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