Systematic anti-Semitism at TWF?

[Nessus]

Where we apparently blame everything on the armies of Jews (accountants, economists, analysts, "math quants," actuarial experts and bankers), which is fine, as long as we list them by their brainy professions, instead of calling them j00s.

Got it, thanks for the clarity.

Personally, I am absolutely baffled by this response.

Now, granted, I'm not Jewish, so I may be unable to perceive that kind of racism (white privilege hey-oo), but I honestly cannot say I've noticed discussions or attitudes shaped by anti-Semitic feeling. Our Israel thread is mostly to make fun of people frothing about its existence. Granted, I don't personally play too well with 2 of our 3 Jewish luminaries, but that's because of our political differences, and I certainly don't believe theirs are somehow a result of their Jewishness. Nor do I think greed, capitalism or communism are solely Jewish practices/vices/inventions. I sincerely doubt we have members here who do. But maybe I'm just blind? Do we hate on Jews here?

[GGT]

I don't understand Cain's constant use of "j00s" either. I've tried to counter his replies, to no avail. I decided to report a couple of his posts, but the Report Post didn't work as expected.

Seems Cain uses "j00s" as some kind of code to imply...something sarcastic or derogatory only he understands in his mind. When we don't understand that code, it's just more proof, in his mind, that we're stoopid or dense. I'm pretty tired of it, and have told him so, and asked him to get a new "slogan". But he ignores me, or says I'm stoopid and dense, and uses more j000 references. That's just weird.

[CitizenCain]

Personally, I am absolutely baffled by this response.

That was meant to point out the disconnect between GGT incessantly (and ostensibly acceptably "for the serious discussion forum"?) laying blame on the Jews..., oops, I mean the bankers and accountants and economists and financial-sector "math-quants" (and so on) and Rand's statement about pointing it out not being appropriate for the serious discussion forum. Not like "evil, greedy, scheming Jews secretly controlling the world" has ever been largely synonymous with that approximate list of professions or anything.

Not to imply I think there's a general anti-Semitic sentiment on here, but to point out that someone in particular is using the same arguments and rhetoric, even against largely the same group of people, that's used to blame the Jews for secretly controlling the world and robbing the rest of us of our money.

Anyway, since it has apparently been a while since I last explained it to GeeGee, my response to her from that thread...

Granted, I am the only one to ever make the connection between white-collar professions requiring a lot of education and offering high income earnings with Jews (), but I'm far from the only one on here who's commented about your compulsion to blame everything related to the financial sector's woes on armies of educated professionals. Gee, thank God the anti-Semites haven't historically used a perceived Jewish connection to the financial sector to make crazy conspiracy claims about the Jews secretly running the world, or I might be onto something there!

In other words, YOU knock it off already. If you stop making arguments that are interchangeable with crazy, racist conspiracy theories about greedy Jews (or j00s, as I prefer) secretly running the world and controlling our monies, I'll stop pointing out that you're making arguments that are interchangeable with crazy, racist conspiracy theories about greedy Jews (or j00s, as I prefer) secretly running the world and controlling our monies. You'll probably just have to deal with the fact that I'm not about to put a whole bunch of time and effort (--> "lots of words") into a post I'm certain you'll ignore or forget about by the next day, though, and prefer to abbreviate concepts I've spelled out repeatedly to you, to no avail.

For example:

"j00s" ~= stop making "arguments" that are interchangeable with crazy, racist conspiracy theories about greedy Jews secretly running the world and controlling our monies and blaming all our current problems on a long list/grouping of people that's practically interchangeable with "Zionist-Jew pig-dog overlords."

[Aimless]

Nonsense as usual on tWF. As we all know, the vast majority of Jews don't run Goldman Sachs. The answer to your question Nessie is "baiting". It's like when Loki had the bright idea to compare everything and everyone he disliked to blaming rape victims. It's a proud old tradition on this forum that brings depth and colour to our discussions. Why do you hate rape victims?

[Draco]

Looks like satirical humour to me, which I'm ok with.

[GGT]

That was meant to point out the disconnect between GGT incessantly (and ostensibly acceptably "for the serious discussion forum"?) laying blame on the Jews..., oops, I mean the bankers and accountants and economists and financial-sector "math-quants" (and so on) and Rand's statement about pointing it out not being appropriate for the serious discussion forum. Not like "evil, greedy, scheming Jews secretly controlling the world" has ever been largely synonymous with that approximate list of professions or anything.

Not to imply I think there's a general anti-Semitic sentiment on here, but to point out that someone in particular is using the same arguments and rhetoric, even against largely the same group of people, that's used to blame the Jews for secretly controlling the world and robbing the rest of us of our money.

Anyway, since it has apparently been a while since I last explained it to GeeGee, my response to her from that thread...

Man, that's a strange way to explain your trolling. You're the only one making a connection to finance-related professionals, Jews, and conspiracy theorists.

While you incessantly lay blame on the "evil, greedy, scheming government controlling the world", and robbing you of hard earned money at gun-point. Riiight.

[Loki]

Personally, I am absolutely baffled by this response.

Now, granted, I'm not Jewish, so I may be unable to perceive that kind of racism (white privilege hey-oo), but I honestly cannot say I've noticed discussions or attitudes shaped by anti-Semitic feeling. Our Israel thread is mostly to make fun of people frothing about its existence. Granted, I don't personally play too well with 2 of our 3 Jewish luminaries, but that's because of our political differences, and I certainly don't believe theirs are somehow a result of their Jewishness. Nor do I think greed, capitalism or communism are solely Jewish practices/vices/inventions. I sincerely doubt we have members here who do. But maybe I'm just blind? Do we hate on Jews here?

He's clearly attacking GGT for making the exact arguments against bankers as were historically made against Jews...Not saying I think GGT thinks that way (that would require far too much coherence), but the line of reasoning is awfully similar.

[Nessus]

He's clearly attacking GGT for making the exact arguments against bankers as were historically made against Jews...Not saying I think GGT thinks that way (that would require far too much coherence), but the line of reasoning is awfully similar.

No one is born a banker, but anyone born of a Jewish mother is a Jew. Is there no moral difference in condemning those who make a choice and those who do not? Can we say one is a criminal based on their circumstance of birth alone?

[Loki]

No one is born a banker, but anyone born of a Jewish mother is a Jew. Is there no moral difference in condemning those who make a choice and those who do not? Can we say one is a criminal based on their circumstance of birth alone?

The point is that historically, attacks against "global bankers" were the "polite" way of attacking Jews.

[Aimless]

Yes yes but it's perfectly clear that GGT is attacking bankers and not Jews. If naughty bankers are all Jews then fine but she's knocking the naughtiness and not the Jewishness.

[Nessus]

The point is that historically, attacks against "global bankers" were the "polite" way of attacking Jews.

And historically that was in the context of a broader narrative that no longer exists today. At least, not on TWF, in Iran you might have a point.

[GGT]

He's clearly attacking GGT for making the exact arguments against bankers as were historically made against Jews...Not saying I think GGT thinks that way (that would require far too much coherence), but the line of reasoning is awfully similar.

Wow, you want it both ways, huh. I make a coherent argument against today's financial institutions, something that "historically" used to be anti-semitic, but since I'm not being anti-semitic, my line of reasoning isn't coherent? Where do you come up with this shit?

Yes yes but it's perfectly clear that GGT is attacking bankers and not Jews. If naughty bankers are all Jews then fine but she's knocking the naughtiness and not the Jewishness.

Exactly. Glad I'm not misunderstood by everyone.

[Dreadnaught]

I think the point is attacking Jews collectively was as baseless and misinformed as is attacking bankers collectively.

[Aimless]

Aimless's law clearly states that you should never ascribe to cleverness that which you can ascribe to malice and, let's face it, blaming Jews collectively was probably more baseless than blaming bankers collectively. Not to mention more dangerous, more disgusting, and, well, more of everything bad. I'm surprised you're embracing this oblique Godwin. Oh right, that's the relevant law here

[Dreadnaught]

It's Godwin-esque, except for the whole parallel between the archetypal money-grubbing International Jew and the archetypal money-grubbing international banker.

I'm not saying GGT is an anti-Semite at all. But her rambling attacks on bankers make it easy to just slip in the word "Jew" and see how vapid the attacks can be.

[Nessus]

It's Godwin-esque, except for the whole parallel between the archetypal money-grubbing International Jew and the archetypal money-grubbing international banker.

I'm not saying GGT is an anti-Semite at all. But her rambling attacks on bankers make it easy to just slip in the word "Jew" and see how vapid the attacks can be.

And if one were to replace them with "homosexual", they'd be Serious Talking Points among the GOP hopefuls. The whole charade doesn't illustrate anything save for Kain's attitude towards the Holocaust.

[Dreadnaught]

Totally irrelevant. Unless gay people also have been accused of controlling the banks and media.

[Aimless]

"Liberals"

"The government"

ooh I like this

[Nessus]

Totally irrelevant. Unless gay people also have been accused of controlling the banks and media.

Well, I'm not sad to say mister Falwell is currently dead, but a large segment of the US population seems to think God controls, among other things, the economy, whereupon killing faggots makes about as much sense as "liberals" "persecuting" bankers. Both sides have a theory on how the world operates, and they're working on those principles.

[Steely Glint]

But her rambling attacks on bankers make it easy to just slip in the word "Jew" and see how vapid the attacks can be.

Well, I think a major difference there is the fact that bankers, by definition, actually do control the banks. Where as the Jews, as far as I know, do not.

[Steely Glint]

Dreadnaught, Loki, Wiggin: If the Jews did control the banks, you'd tell us, right? We've known you long enough.

[Dreadnaught]

Well, I'm not sad to say mister Falwell is currently dead, but a large segment of the US population seems to think God controls, among other things, the economy, whereupon killing faggots makes about as much sense as "liberals" "persecuting" bankers. Both sides have a theory on how the world operates, and they're working on those principles.

So? We're talking about a particular comparison that was made, not the backwards beliefs of religious fundamentalists.

Well, I think a major difference there is the fact that bankers, by definition, actually do control the banks. Where as the Jews, as far as I know, do not.

Dreadnaught, Loki, Wiggin: If the Jews did control the banks, you'd tell us, right? We've known you long enough.

GGT isn't saying the bankers control the banks, she's saying the bankers control the world.

I can't comment on whether Jews control the banks, but I have heard they control the media. And that several forumers are secret Jews.

[Nessus]

So? We're talking about a particular comparison that was made, not the backwards beliefs of religious fundamentalists.

So why is it okay to co-opt the Holocaust in defence of Ayn Rand? If the lesson was, "substituting 'jew' for 'banker' makes this claim asinine", surely the same holds for substituting 'homosexual' instead.

[GGT]

It's Godwin-esque, except for the whole parallel between the archetypal money-grubbing International Jew and the archetypal money-grubbing international banker.

I'm not saying GGT is an anti-Semite at all. But her rambling attacks on bankers make it easy to just slip in the word "Jew" and see how vapid the attacks can be.

Well, I think a major difference there is the fact that bankers, by definition, actually do control the banks. Where as the Jews, as far as I know, do not.

I reject the characterization that I "ramble" on my attacks toward Big Banks. As Steely says, banks are controlled primarily by bankers. Duh! Our banks are bigger than ever, don't have any internal or moral incentive to re-capitalize their balance sheets, but will gladly impose their failures upon the general public and the tax payers who bailed them out of their incompetency in the first place.

I applaud minx's new terminology. Oblique Godwin.

[Dreadnaught]

Misdirection much, people?

The point is you suggest bankers use nefarious means to influence the purchasing power of non-bankers and by proxy influence the world.

Cain is making the point as offensively as possible, but it's not hard to see what he's saying.

[Nessus]

Misdirection much, people?

The point is you suggest bankers use nefarious means to influence the purchasing power of non-bankers and by proxy influence the world.

Cain is making the point as offensively as possible, but it's not hard to see what he's saying.

How many people were born bankers, again?

[Dreadnaught]

All of them. Because they are Zionists.

Folks seem to have a lot of trouble leaving the literal world and understanding low-level satire.

[Nessus]

All of them. Because they are Zionists.

Folks seem to have a lot of trouble leaving the literal world and understanding low-level satire.

Nothing wrong with being a Zionist, poor Eichmann was a Zionist.

Kane's response quoted in the OP (original post) of this thread was a response to a moderator, a leader of the community, telling him he might be somewhat out of line.

Do you think there's a difference between a Bolshevist and a Jew? Is it possible to be against one but not the other?

[GGT]

Cain is making the point as offensively as possible, but it's not hard to see what he's saying.

Great logic there, Mister Moderator. Good luck keeping that constant standard. In other words, don't try to warn me (in bolded moderator orange font) that I'm out of line by telling Lewk to read his own damn Bible before he posts. Unless you're prepared to defend your double standards.

[Aimless]

Dread, I think you just accidentally did a Wal-Mart