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  1. #1
    While Bush was President, yes they seemed to.

    How much attention did groups like MoveOn.org get?

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    While Bush was President, yes they seemed to.

    How much attention did groups like MoveOn.org get?
    They didn't have a gun on the global economy's temple, but that's an unfair comparison all around. Maybe you could high-light some social progressive stuff gung-ho Dem representatives absolutely hammered through under the reign of Bush the Lesser, I'm sure there's some but me and my memory, oi vei!
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by LittleFuzzy View Post
    Uh. . . I didn't say all Dems were that way, I said some. And the Dems didn't manage to grab control of Congress at all until the last two years of his presidency. I can think of a major SP initiative they pushed under Obama *though the final form, based as it was on some compromise with the GOP and a massive amount of internal compromise in the Democratic party, didn't satisfy anyone.*
    Yeah, but that was my point! Some Dems are leftist even by my (according to Kain insane) metrics, but what kind of power do they actually hold? The Teaper freshmen had a pretty good showing this year, but insofar as I can remember (and this is where I trip!), there hasn't been such a success for the "social progressives" in the US. There was some health-care reform but not enough (neither side of the aisle is happy), they let faggots be faggots in the military (this is a progressive yay, I admit), but there's still a big if on the faggot marriage thing...What am I missing? And let's not forget that the Teapers are not a minority within the GOP wanting to slash the welfare net, they're just the vocal front!
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Nessus View Post
    Yeah, but that was my point! Some Dems are leftist even by my (according to Kain insane) metrics, but what kind of power do they actually hold? The Teaper freshmen had a pretty good showing this year, but insofar as I can remember (and this is where I trip!), there hasn't been such a success for the "social progressives" in the US. There was some health-care reform but not enough (neither side of the aisle is happy), they let faggots be faggots in the military (this is a progressive yay, I admit), but there's still a big if on the faggot marriage thing...What am I missing? And let's not forget that the Teapers are not a minority within the GOP wanting to slash the welfare net, they're just the vocal front!
    I'm confused. Health reform, even if it wasn't all that they might have wanted, did get passed. What actual legislative success have "the Teaper freshmen" enjoyed? The only real challenge they made was trying to prevent the debt limit from being raised. And they didn't get many concessions before they caved. Gingrich's "New Republicans" got a lot further with that ploy back in 1995.

    Oh wait, I forgot, you have a massively overblown view of the Tea Party's presence and power, in Congress and with the public, and nothing I say has ever made the least dent in that delusion.
    Last night as I lay in bed, looking up at the stars, I thought, “Where the hell is my ceiling?"

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by LittleFuzzy View Post
    Oh wait, I forgot, you have a massively overblown view of the Tea Party's presence and power, in Congress and with the public, and nothing I say has ever made the least dent in that delusion.
    You sly dog you, you didn't forget, you just wanted to make fun of me in front of an audience. Fair enough, consider my protests withdrawn.
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Nessus View Post
    You sly dog you, you didn't forget, you just wanted to make fun of me in front of an audience. Fair enough, consider my protests withdrawn.
    I did forget. I added the last line in an edit right after I posted, when I was rereading the quote and my response to make certain everything made sense. Rereading that last line you'd written triggered the recollection that you and I have been down this road of discussion before.
    Last night as I lay in bed, looking up at the stars, I thought, “Where the hell is my ceiling?"

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by LittleFuzzy View Post
    I did forget. I added the last line in an edit right after I posted, when I was rereading the quote and my response to make certain everything made sense. Rereading that last line you'd written triggered the recollection that you and I have been down this road of discussion before.
    I'm glad you remember, because I have no recollection, and if neither of us remembers it didn't happen and the collective human experience gained nothing...
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by LittleFuzzy View Post
    Oh wait, I forgot, you have a massively overblown view of the Tea Party's presence and power, in Congress and with the public, and nothing I say has ever made the least dent in that delusion.
    I do to. I guess mainly because of stuff like: "the TEA party debate" where all the important republican candidates show up to woo those votes their way. I'd love my illusion to be dented. Not really a strong illusion anyway. Fishing wires.

    Is it just cosmetic and rhetorical pandering while ignoring them on the legislative stage just to get the votes? I think it's likely that when TEA party supported candidate wins the office, there's going to be just as sour faces as the die hard Obama supporters have now. Washington seems to me to be this oiltanker like mammoth with the turning circle of Mars. Every candidate every election runs on change, and they always largely fail to deliver. Too many interests, stakes too high for radical change.
    I could have had class. I could have been a contender.
    I could have been somebody. Instead of a bum
    Which is what I am

    I aim at the stars
    But sometimes I hit London

  9. #9
    Stingy DM Veldan Rath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
    Washington seems to me to be this oiltanker like mammoth with the turning circle of Mars.
    I really like this description.

    The imagery makes me giggle.

    And kinda points outlines the boondoogle that is the massive federal government over here. (yeah, cheap shot, mea culpa)
    Brevior saltare cum deformibus viris est vita

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