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Thread: Voter Photo ID -- Is It Really Terrible?

  1. #61
    Senior Member RandBlade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by earthJoker View Post
    As I said, your register once where you live, each time you move. But you need to do that anyway so it is not related with voting. As I see it you have to renew it each year and in the US AFAIK for each voting. As I see it, this is a big difference.
    Why do you have to register where you live?

    We renew our registration annually. The process is quite simple though, if no details have changed especially you can renew on an automated phone system.

  2. #62
    Senior Member RandBlade's Avatar
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    Your quote isn't in your link, but from Googling it:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electio...United_States)
    Election Day is a civic holiday in some states, including Delaware, Hawaii, Kentucky, Montana, New Jersey, New York, Ohio, and West Virginia. Some other states require that workers be permitted to take time off from employment without loss of pay. California Elections Code Section 14000 provides that employees otherwise unable to vote must be allowed two hours off with pay, at the beginning or end of a shift.
    So in other words: Not a national holiday.

  3. #63
    All Worship Ragnarök Loki's Avatar
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    Blame the rest of the nation.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  4. #64
    Local talking head LittleFuzzy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    "California Elections Code Section 14000 provides that employees otherwise unable to vote must be allowed two hours off with pay, at the beginning or end of a shift."

    More reasons why the vote is on a Tuesday:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electio...tates)#History
    A mandate to provide 2 hours off, if employees cannot otherwise manage to vote, in no way, shape, or form resembles a federal holiday. This was you, with the usual self-centered insularity of the New Yorker which you often display, thinking that conditions in New York *where the state did declare a civil work holiday* must naturally be universal.
    Last night as I lay in bed, looking up at the stars, I thought, “Where the hell is my ceiling?"

  5. #65
    Resiste et Mords! Steely Glint's Avatar
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    My God, the New York really is just like London.
    If you tolerate this, then your children will be next.

  6. #66
    Senior Member RandBlade's Avatar
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    And for the avoidance of doubt, London is just one city and not our entire country.

  7. #67
    All Worship Ragnarök Loki's Avatar
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    That's a lie. England is a city in London.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  8. #68
    Resiste et Mords! Steely Glint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    I don't see why a small nominal charge (say $10 or $20 tops) to cover reasonable out of pocket expenses shouldn't be levied.
    I don't see that as any different to the charge the last government was going to put on the ID cards they were going to make everyone have.
    If you tolerate this, then your children will be next.

  9. #69
    Resiste et Mords! Steely Glint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    And for the avoidance of doubt, London is just one city and not our entire country.
    I don't think Londoners got that memo. A man was on PM saying exactly the opposite of that the other day "London is England". No. It isn't.
    Last edited by Steely Glint; 10-11-2011 at 10:13 PM.
    If you tolerate this, then your children will be next.

  10. #70
    Senior Member RandBlade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Glint View Post
    I don't see that as any different to the charge the last government was going to put on the ID cards they were going to make everyone have.
    Very different.

    For one thing you don't have to carry your birth certificate with you 24/7 then pay to get it replaced if its lost.
    For another you don't need it at all, just if you want it and you don't have it you can pay for a replacement.

  11. #71
    Resiste et Mords! Steely Glint's Avatar
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    You do need it if you want to vote, apparently, which a very fundamental right. If you're going to be saying to people "you need to have this in order to be able to vote" then you have no business charging for it as well. That is no different from directly charging people for voting.
    If you tolerate this, then your children will be next.

  12. #72
    Senior Member RandBlade's Avatar
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    You don't need your birth certificate to vote, you need it to get ID which you need to vote.

    Just because something is a fundamental right does not mean that there might not be administrative costs associated with it. Should I expect the state to provide a taxi to take me to and from the polling booth?

  13. #73
    Resiste et Mords! Steely Glint's Avatar
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    You don't need your birth certificate to vote, you need it to get ID which you need to vote.
    There should be some form of freely available acceptable identification if identification is going to be a prerequisite for voting.

    Should I expect the state to provide a taxi to take me to and from the polling booth?
    If you are required by the state to arrive at the polling booth in a Taxi then, yes, they should pay for it.
    If you tolerate this, then your children will be next.

  14. #74
    Senior Member RandBlade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Glint View Post
    There should be some form of freely available acceptable identification if identification is going to be a prerequisite for voting.
    Why?
    If you are required by the state to arrive at the polling booth in a Taxi then, yes, they should pay for it.
    How does the state or you expect me to get to the polling booth, which for some could be many miles from where they live?

  15. #75
    Resiste et Mords! Steely Glint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    Why?
    Because otherwise you're effectively charging people for voting.

    How does the state or you expect me to get to the polling booth, which for some could be many miles from where they live?
    Walk. Get a lift with a friend. Vote by post. Nominate someone to vote for you by proxy. etc.
    If you tolerate this, then your children will be next.

  16. #76
    SEÑOR Member Aimless's Avatar
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    RB, if we can require time off or declare public holidays to facilitate voting then it feels like waiving the fees required to register and to obtain ID should be seen as, well, small potatoes.
    “Humanity's greatest advances are not in its discoveries, but in how those discoveries are applied to reduce inequity.”
    — Bill Gates

  17. #77
    Administrator Dreadnaught's Avatar
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    I agree, it probably isn't a big deal expenditure-wise. And would at least mitigate the issue of people who just don't seem to have ID. Though I don't think it should impede the passage of simple voter ID improvements, considering how much in our society depends on some sort of photo ID.

  18. #78
    SEÑOR Member Aimless's Avatar
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    Exactly. Just toss this in with the healthcare package you're giving everyone
    “Humanity's greatest advances are not in its discoveries, but in how those discoveries are applied to reduce inequity.”
    — Bill Gates

  19. #79
    Senior Member earthJoker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    Why do you have to register where you live?
    Mostly because of taxes. Otherwise everyone would pay their taxes in the cheapest municipality.
    "Wer Visionen hat, sollte zum Arzt gehen." - Helmut Schmidt

  20. #80
    Senior Member GGT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadnaught View Post
    I agree, it probably isn't a big deal expenditure-wise. And would at least mitigate the issue of people who just don't seem to have ID. Though I don't think it should impede the passage of simple voter ID improvements, considering how much in our society depends on some sort of photo ID.
    I don't know about you, but I only need photo ID if a cop pulls me over in my car, or if I fly on a plane. If your impression is that American society depends on photo ID so much, it's either your NYC culture or your particular job requirements.

  21. #81
    Senior Member GGT's Avatar
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    Oh yes, and as an extension related to this "debate"....it sounds familiar to requiring a National ID.

  22. #82
    Administrator Dreadnaught's Avatar
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    Umm, GGT, it's not like I am some alien. You need photo ID to drive, not just when you are pulled over. And if you ever buy a drink.

    Not to mention flying, entering government buildings and doing tons of other stuff. Which is why it's so strange that our government requires photo ID to physically enter the premises but not to vote-in that government.

  23. #83
    Senior Member earthJoker's Avatar
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    May I ask how much it costs to get an ID in the US?
    "Wer Visionen hat, sollte zum Arzt gehen." - Helmut Schmidt

  24. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadnaught View Post
    And if you ever buy a drink.
    entering government buildings
    both of these claims are bullshit.

    Yes, its up to the supplier to verify that the purchaser is over the minimum age but requesting ID is not required. Publix's sign even state this, if you're under 35, you have to supply ID, to protect their asses.

    I have also never had to present ID when entering a government building. I do it all the time for the county building, and I just did it the other day for the courts.
    The county government building doesn't even have a metal detector or any sort of entrance protection. The court building had a metal detector, but no request for ID.

    Quote Originally Posted by earthJoker View Post
    May I ask how much it costs to get an ID in the US?
    You would need the supplemental paperwork, such as a birth certificate, which varies greatly from state to state, then you would need the ID, those prices also vary (see second post for how states are handling this).
    "In a field where an overlooked bug could cost millions, you want people who will speak their minds, even if they’re sometimes obnoxious about it."

  25. #85
    Senior Member earthJoker's Avatar
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    The only real number I saw was $28 but that's for voters ID. My question is more what is the range (cheapest state to most expensive state) for an normal photo ID and how long is it valid.
    "Wer Visionen hat, sollte zum Arzt gehen." - Helmut Schmidt

  26. #86
    valid dates also vary. I get quite a few partons from Arizona cause their IDs last for (almost) fucking forever. Mine lasts 6 years.
    "In a field where an overlooked bug could cost millions, you want people who will speak their minds, even if they’re sometimes obnoxious about it."

  27. #87
    Senior Member earthJoker's Avatar
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    6 years sounds reasonable to me.
    "Wer Visionen hat, sollte zum Arzt gehen." - Helmut Schmidt

  28. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by earthJoker View Post
    6 years sounds reasonable to me.
    which means having to purchase one for possibly every 2 out of 3 presidental elections.

    not to mention the high mobility rate of the poor, with states requiring a local ID for services.
    "In a field where an overlooked bug could cost millions, you want people who will speak their minds, even if they’re sometimes obnoxious about it."

  29. #89
    Senior Member RandBlade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GGT View Post
    I don't know about you, but I only need photo ID if a cop pulls me over in my car, or if I fly on a plane. If your impression is that American society depends on photo ID so much, it's either your NYC culture or your particular job requirements.
    You need photo ID on you to drive?

    I don't need anything on me to drive.

  30. #90
    Senior Member Flixy's Avatar
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    Driving without a driver's license is illegal, and we all know people who break the law should be thrown in jail.
    Keep on keepin' the beat alive!

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