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Thread: Are we responsible?

  1. #1

    Default Are we responsible?

    Well, last week in my AP Lang and Comp class, our teacher told us to write an promt on whether we're responisble for our actions. After we turned out in-class promt in, we had a short discussion and the idea of helping others and taking responsibility came up. While I pointed out that this boiled down quintessentially to the Ayn Rand Altruism VS Egoism. I was surprised at how many of my fellow classmates would help the other no matter what.

    Now I'm 16, and most of the other students are also 17 (i should be a sophomore, very late birthday) and i find it amazing that so many of us apparently are altruistic. I thought it was complete bullshit how they were just lying through their teeth and attempting to hide their true nature. I made a Lord of The Flies reference that was apparently "stupid because it's a work of fiction" and there is no correlation between that book and reality.

    I found myself on one side with another three students stating that as long as we're not senile or disable, we chose to perform said action and we will take the after-effects, good or bad, will originate from our initial decision. We neednot to motherhen individuals, live, experience, and learn. True someone might know better, but if you experience it yourself, you'll grow up. Now i'm not for anarchy or anything. and I find the idea of taking someone else's blame ridiculous, they did it, they should suffer for it. I don't see those people "blaming" their successes on others, why should their failures be blamed? I'll help a friend in need and advice and whatnot, but i'm not going to take a dive. Now i'm not a douche or anything, i just think they did the stupid thing, they should learn from it. If i take the dive for them, they learn nothing. Now am I altruistic because i'm trying to help him in the long run? or am I a douche-bag for not blemishing my image?

    So do you guys think we're actually altruistic by nature like some people claim? or are we all egoists?
    I go with egotism, material goods and supremacy has been our goal for centuries.

    two questions to answer.

  2. #2
    Sounds like a fun class.

    Freud is also about Id and Ego. Milgram experiments might confirm your literary fiction.

    Go back far enough in history, and Narcissus is an interesting parable. Was Mother Teresa doing altruistic work for her ego.....?

  3. #3
    Wow, I'm glad I'm not your friend. I'd give the shirt off my back to help someone I considered my friend.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aimless View Post
    It's not okay to shoot an innocent bank clerk but shooting a felon to death is commendable and do you should receive a reward rather than a punishment

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by ImAnOgre View Post
    Wow, I'm glad I'm not your friend. I'd give the shirt off my back to help someone I considered my friend.
    Is that what he meant? Ogre, on a group project in school, how much of a dive would you take in your grade to help the group?

  5. #5
    Fun class indeed, hopefully i'll get an A in the class and a 5 on the AP Exam. I honestly took the class for college credit and he .5 GPA bump. But I love that class and I have 8th period (everyday) which is awesome.

    Ok, let's say my friend got caught cheating off me on a test and I didn't let him do it, but i didn't stop him either. I'm not going to say i let him, I chose to do nothing about it and i sure as hell won't take the blame. Or maybe if my friend gets into a fight, i'm not a pussy, but i'm not going to get involved in the fight if he did something wrong first.

    Now if he had family problems, needs money or w/e, i will help him. If confoundng variables are the source, then i'll gadly help him/her.

    and Ogre, i have a lot of "friends", most of them are aquantances, the 10 or so true friends I have would never do anything stupid and that is why i respect them and feel comfortable with them. I'm not going to lie, I was an idiot on Atari, i can't justify my behavior their because i abhor people like that, but summer+broken leg= ????troll???


    EDIT: when i mean take a dive, i mean like...the examples i mentioned. we are given the liberty to choose our groups if we're assigned a project and i tend to group myself with intellent people. Additionally, i'm in all APs and Honors, less iidiots there, but hey, even a plastic bag was thought to be idiot proof until someone put it on their head.

    EDIT 2: well i guess our definition of "friend" is different. I'm not an elitist, but I chose to be friends with intelligent students or students who aren't involved in the wrong things. Some may call me "weak" or whatever for not drinking or smoking at 16 even once. but the people I hang out with, a game of Risk or Monopoly is much more interesting than getting waste and just doing things you never would have dared.
    Last edited by Young Mage; 02-24-2010 at 02:41 PM.

  6. #6
    Well, at 16 it's hard to have True Friends in my definition of the phrase. And I didn't understand what you meant by take a dive.

    But a true friendship isn't something that can happen in a short amount of time. By the age of 16, I'm betting most haven't had the life experiences that really bring out someone's character.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aimless View Post
    It's not okay to shoot an innocent bank clerk but shooting a felon to death is commendable and do you should receive a reward rather than a punishment

  7. #7
    Why not? My best friend (BFF ) and I go back to 9th grade, and we've celebrated a few 29th birthdays now.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Young Mage View Post
    the 10 or so true friends I have would never do anything stupid
    yes they will and so will you but maybe you'll be friends anyway

    re. the op, you're not being an altruist. you've just constructed this explanation (that you're somehow doing it for their own good) because you're uncomfortable. it's kinda like OG saying we should let kids suffer so they learn character.
    "One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Young Mage View Post
    Well, last week in my AP Lang and Comp class, our teacher told us to write an promt on whether we're responisble for our actions. After we turned out in-class promt in, we had a short discussion and the idea of helping others and taking responsibility came up. While I pointed out that this boiled down quintessentially to the Ayn Rand Altruism VS Egoism. I was surprised at how many of my fellow classmates would help the other no matter what.

    So do you guys think we're actually altruistic by nature like some people claim? or are we all egoists?[/B] I go with egotism, material goods and supremacy has been our goal for centuries.

    two questions to answer.
    Most of people are not altruist when it is about money. This is why people refused the public option in healthcare, where those who are healthy pay some money to help those who are sick and in need of healthcare.

  10. #10
    Meh, I've had my fair share of problems and they'll probably get worse.

    Dive: to take the blame for an action i didn't commit

    Exactly, me and three other students said we're all egoists at heart, there is always something we are not willing to just give up for others. For me, it's my "rep", my name, or my honor, whatever you want to call it. I will not jeopardize the way people see me for a friend. If he was a true friend, he wouldn't ask me to jeopardize it.

    and by the way, i've only known those people for about three years, I moved around a lot.

    The explanation i constructed was my representation of how those people felt. Their whole point was that even everyone was altruistic deep down, which is bullshit imo.

  11. #11
    My experience is that if you get to stay away from "leech people" who uses you for their selfish purposes, you will be able to be generous and your assistence will cause a greater effect.

    I have realized that what I seed is what I harvest. So create something positive around, and you will receive something positive in time. If people knew this, people would do good, not because of principles and values, but because of just convenience.

  12. #12
    A] But this isn't altruistic, you're avoiding and segregating a whole "race" of people. Altruism occurs when benevolent actions are performed regardless of the consequences or impact done.

    Meh, most of us aren't patient.

  13. #13
    Edit: NVM. Read the OP wrong.

  14. #14
    Blind altruism is just as dumb as blind greed.

  15. #15
    Defeating the purpose of altruism then.

  16. #16
    Blind altruism is altruism without a given direction.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Young Mage View Post
    Defeating the purpose of altruism then.
    I disagree. Or maybe agree. I'm not sure. I do know that "blind" altruism isn't altruism, aye? "Blind" altruism is just stupidity.

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