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Thread: Obama The Filthy Liar

  1. #1
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    Thumbs down Obama The Filthy Liar

    The news today regarding discussion on genocide.

    http://license.icopyright.net/user/v...id%3DD9E7TOBO0

    ************

    The administration stepped in despite a campaign promise by President Barack Obama to brand as genocide the killing of as many as 1.5 million Armenians by Ottoman Turks. The vote by the congressional committee could alienate Turkey, which plays an important role for U.S. interests in the Middle East and Afghanistan.

    ************

    Now here is Obama on his campaign promise.

    http://www.barackobama.com/2008/01/1...importance.php

    ***********

    I also share with Armenian Americans – so many of whom are descended from genocide survivors - a principled commitment to commemorating and ending genocide. That starts with acknowledging the tragic instances of genocide in world history. As a U.S. Senator, I have stood with the Armenian American community in calling for Turkey's acknowledgement of the Armenian Genocide. Two years ago, I criticized the Secretary of State for the firing of U.S. Ambassador to Armenia, John Evans, after he properly used the term "genocide" to describe Turkey's slaughter of thousands of Armenians starting in 1915. I shared with Secretary Rice my firmly held conviction that the Armenian Genocide is not an allegation, a personal opinion, or a point of view, but rather a widely documented fact supported by an overwhelming body of historical evidence. The facts are undeniable. An official policy that calls on diplomats to distort the historical facts is an untenable policy. As a senator, I strongly support passage of the Armenian Genocide Resolution (H.Res.106 and S.Res.106), and as President I will recognize the Armenian Genocide.

    ************

    Pathetic. What a rat. This really doesn't effect me either way but the bold faced lies make the cry of Obama supporters stating he was a "different politician" all the more pathetic. Anyone who considered Obama someone who would bring the "hope & change" that would "transcend" past partisan politics is an idiot and a fool.

  2. #2
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    It's easy to tell when a politician is lying, their lips move.
    .

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    Ok Lewk, so you think it's more important for a politician to keep to a silly promise he made during the elections than to work in the interest of the country he serves? Typically it isn't untill they are elected that people understand that Turkey when it comes to doing things in the Middle East is infinitely more important than the Armenian Diaspora which has no interest at all it seems in what happens on the ground today.
    Greece shows us that there is a kind of politician worse than the ones that break their election promises; the ones that keep their election promises.

  4. #4
    Administrator Dreadnaught's Avatar
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    I think Lewk's point is that Obama promised everything to everyone, no matter how unrealistic.

    More generally, when you promise an ethnic community to officially recognize what it believes to be a genocide, then backtrack, it leaves a pretty bad taste in your mouth.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadnaught View Post
    I think Lewk's point is that Obama promised everything to everyone, no matter how unrealistic.

    More generally, when you promise an ethnic community to officially recognize what it believes to be a genocide, then backtrack, it leaves a pretty bad taste in your mouth.
    Yeah, it's called baiting the voter. All politicians do it; tweaking their message to special interest groups they want to vote for them.

    The bigger mandate though is to work for the good of the nation; it DOES override promises to special interests. Even if Obama wanted to keep his promise to the Armenian diaspora then his sense of duty should forbid him to do it if that means harming the interests of the republic his has sworn (not just promised) to protect.

    I think it's nonsense to talk about broken promises by politicians if keeping their promise means breaking the only real commitment that they signed up to.
    Greece shows us that there is a kind of politician worse than the ones that break their election promises; the ones that keep their election promises.

  6. #6
    Nihilist Nessus's Avatar
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    has sworn (not just promised)
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  7. #7
    Lewk, the dumbass who couldn't find the Armenianish thread Dread already started

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nessus View Post
    Nessus, it is already blatantly clear you don't get social concepts or social behaviour, at least not in the persona you present here on this forum. There is no need to remind us every time of your personality issues.
    Greece shows us that there is a kind of politician worse than the ones that break their election promises; the ones that keep their election promises.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    Lewk, the dumbass who couldn't find the Armenianish thread Dread already started
    To his defense, that thread is more about the issue, this is about politicians breaking promises.
    Greece shows us that there is a kind of politician worse than the ones that break their election promises; the ones that keep their election promises.

  10. #10
    Nihilist Nessus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hazir View Post
    Nessus, it is already blatantly clear you don't get social concepts or social behaviour, at least not in the persona you present here on this forum. There is no need to remind us every time of your personality issues.
    Oh my, ad hominem right off the bat. You're a gem, you are.

    I was just amused by your notion that while promises can and routinely are broken, oaths are something sacred and sacrosanct that one should always adhere to. How precisely is this some kind of spergism on my part?
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nessus View Post
    Oh my, ad hominem right off the bat. You're a gem, you are.

    I was just amused by your notion that while promises can and routinely are broken, oaths are something sacred and sacrosanct that one should always adhere to. How precisely is this some kind of spergism on my part?
    Thanks for confirming my suspicion; you are incapable of differentiating.

    To be honest, I am not overly interested in who you are, and god knows I could be totally wrong about you. I mean, I couldn't even be bothered to remember your gender and the specific issues you exposed about that some time ago. Sometimes you irritate me.

    I imagine you to be somebody who's valuable in your field of work but that's about the extent of it; otherwise I imagine you to be a bit of a tool. You do very little to defuse that in your posting behaviour. What comes to mind is your silly adolescent fascination with 'uncle Adolf' which you really should have left behind you by now. One reads one, maybe two biographies of the man to figure out what he was about and how it could happen. Then one moves on to somewhat more main stream hobbies; dressing up like one of his tools (for real or online) is not really much different than grown ups camping out in a field making believe they are really the victorious armies of the South.

    Now, you can do with this exposé whatever you want.
    Greece shows us that there is a kind of politician worse than the ones that break their election promises; the ones that keep their election promises.

  12. #12
    Nihilist Nessus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hazir View Post
    Thanks for confirming my suspicion; you are incapable of differentiating.

    To be honest, I am not overly interested in who you are, and god knows I could be totally wrong about you. I mean, I couldn't even be bothered to remember your gender and the specific issues you exposed about that some time ago. Sometimes you irritate me.

    I imagine you to be somebody who's valuable in your field of work but that's about the extent of it; otherwise I imagine you to be a bit of a tool. You do very little to defuse that in your posting behaviour. What comes to mind is your silly adolescent fascination with 'uncle Adolf' which you really should have left behind you by now. One reads one, maybe two biographies of the man to figure out what he was about and how it could happen. Then one moves on to somewhat more main stream hobbies; dressing up like one of his tools (for real or online) is not really much different than grown ups camping out in a field making believe they are really the victorious armies of the South.

    Now, you can do with this exposé whatever you want.
    So you're upset that my hobby is a specific segment of history? And proceeded from this to make declarations from on-high that I'm socially stunted? Gosh. And of course you did it the neat way by adding the last bit, "do what you want", thus absolving yourself of any responsibility vis a vis this little revelation you've deigned to offer me.
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nessus View Post
    So you're upset that my hobby is a specific segment of history? And proceeded from this to make declarations from on-high that I'm socially stunted? Gosh. And of course you did it the neat way by adding the last bit, "do what you want", thus absolving yourself of any responsibility vis a vis this little revelation you've deigned to offer me.
    No dear, what you are calling a hobby all of a sudden now, is what you exposed as a lifestyle consistently.

    You can have it both ways of course since this is the internet and that could mean that you're just a troll with remarkable consistency, but I am not really willing to spend too much energy on considering who might be the real person behind Nessus every time when you write something in character. I try to keep things easy for myself, and the jury has decided that you're a bit of a tool. And if your not a tool but a consistent troll then you're also not really interesting for me.

    Finally, since you are not paying me for my time, I am under no obligation to keep myself involved in a debate about you. Some minutes ago I was interested, obviously I still am because I am writing this reply, but for all I know I might forget all about it in the shower I am about to take. Untill you irritate me again of course, then I could lash out again. Even though I know it's not going to make much of a difference, but at least it's a nice release. (Hey, you can fit that in your dark ideas about humanity)
    Greece shows us that there is a kind of politician worse than the ones that break their election promises; the ones that keep their election promises.

  14. #14
    Nihilist Nessus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hazir View Post
    No dear, what you are calling a hobby all of a sudden now, is what you exposed as a lifestyle consistently.

    You can have it both ways of course since this is the internet and that could mean that you're just a troll with remarkable consistency, but I am not really willing to spend too much energy on considering who might be the real person behind Nessus every time when you write something in character. I try to keep things easy for myself, and the jury has decided that you're a bit of a tool. And if your not a tool but a consistent troll then you're also not really interesting for me.

    Finally, since you are not paying me for my time, I am under no obligation to keep myself involved in a debate about you. Some minutes ago I was interested, obviously I still am because I am writing this reply, but for all I know I might forget all about it in the shower I am about to take. Untill you irritate me again of course, then I could lash out again. Even though I know it's not going to make much of a difference, but at least it's a nice release. (Hey, you can fit that in your dark ideas about humanity)
    I'm not sure this post contained any actual information. I don't much care about your posts and you don't care about mine, fair enough, we knew that long ago, and we even acknowledged that! I don't really see why you felt the need to try and lambaste me, release as you say I suppose, but certainly it served little purpose. I do find it funny that in this exchange you find it is I who is socially retarded.
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nessus View Post
    I'm not sure this post contained any actual information. I don't much care about your posts and you don't care about mine, fair enough, we knew that long ago, and we even acknowledged that! I don't really see why you felt the need to try and lambaste me, release as you say I suppose, but certainly it served little purpose. I do find it funny that in this exchange you find it is I who is socially retarded.
    Recap:

    Hazir; makes a statement that normal people can understand
    Nessus; doesn't get it
    Hazir; is annoyed a bit and tells Nessus to shut up
    Nessus; shows more explicitly not to get it
    Hazir; explains a bit and actually covers his ass because he thinks Nessus might just be another troll
    Nessus; again doesn't get it
    Hazir; doubts if he should answer at all, but does the futile act because he's bored on a saturday afternoon
    Nessus; takes a stab at calling Hazir socially inept.



    I apologise to all other people in this forum who stumbled accross this exchange.
    Greece shows us that there is a kind of politician worse than the ones that break their election promises; the ones that keep their election promises.

  16. #16
    Nihilist Nessus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hazir View Post
    Recap:

    Hazir; makes a statement that normal people can understand
    Nessus; doesn't get it
    Hazir; is annoyed a bit and tells Nessus to shut up
    Nessus; shows more explicitly not to get it
    Hazir; explains a bit and actually covers his ass because he thinks Nessus might just be another troll
    Nessus; again doesn't get it
    Hazir; doubts if he should answer at all, but does the futile act because he's bored on a saturday afternoon
    Nessus; takes a stab at calling Hazir socially inept.



    I apologise to all other people in this forum who stumbled accross this exchange.
    Your summary of the situation seems funny, too Well done

    You never did explain the difference between a promise and an oath to us spergies, either
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  17. #17
    Administrator Dreadnaught's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hazir View Post
    Yeah, it's called baiting the voter. All politicians do it; tweaking their message to special interest groups they want to vote for them.

    The bigger mandate though is to work for the good of the nation; it DOES override promises to special interests. Even if Obama wanted to keep his promise to the Armenian diaspora then his sense of duty should forbid him to do it if that means harming the interests of the republic his has sworn (not just promised) to protect.

    I think it's nonsense to talk about broken promises by politicians if keeping their promise means breaking the only real commitment that they signed up to.
    That would be a fair point if he campaigned on a history of strong leadership. But Obama promised everything to every special interest. That's been a flaw that's been highlighted quite a bit, even when he was a candidate. Even his general promises have a meglomaniacal bent. I mean, this is the guy who said, "This was the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal."

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbbIQFcEhcQ#t=1m00s

    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    Lewk, the dumbass who couldn't find the Armenianish thread Dread already started
    That seems unnecessary...as has been pointed out, this is about the White House intervention and less the actual issue.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Being View Post
    It's easy to tell when a politician is lying, their lips move.
    But Obama was different!

    I recall arguing with people about Obama who would insist that Obama was a different kind of politician. This guy is nothing special his words are just words. One of my friends was talking about a major speech Obama did (in 2009 I believe) and I said I didn't watch it because why should I believe anything he says? He got kind of miffed about it and said, "well if you aren't even going to listen to him you are never going to be convinced."

    It stunned me that an otherwise intelligent person could not understand that Obama will say anything to get what he wants accomplished. That words are meaningless once someone has proved to be a liar and actions/behavior are the only possible thing that can redeem. Never words.

  19. #19
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    When it comes to politics, there is the concept of "political feasibility" which involves the political cost of different alternatives.
    Politicians will always choose the option that has more benefit and less political cost.
    In the case of Armenians the political cost for US would be to lose an ally in a strategic area.
    It simply makes the promise not politically feasible.
    US wars started in a time when war had less political cost than peace, and where US budget was less important than the desire of showing off with US power.
    War and its deficit was more politically feasible back then.
    It is not a lie. It is that the promise came when he was not president and it had no political cost for him back then.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hazir View Post
    You can have it both ways of course since this is the internet and that could mean that you're just a troll with remarkable consistency
    Nessie's consistency with that particular fetish has actually been rather less than overwhelming, and came out of nowhere one day. After a bit of observation, it was fairly clear she was trying to bait people, having taken lessons from Kane's behavior.
    Last night as I lay in bed, looking up at the stars, I thought, “Where the hell is my ceiling?"

  21. #21
    Nihilist Nessus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LittleFuzzy View Post
    Nessie's consistency with that particular fetish has actually been rather less than overwhelming, and came out of nowhere one day. After a bit of observation, it was fairly clear she was trying to bait people, having taken lessons from Kane's behavior.
    My relationship with Nazism is more complicated than that, but not as Hazzy paints it, either.
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  22. #22
    Local talking head LittleFuzzy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nessus View Post
    My relationship with Nazism is more complicated than that, but not as Hazzy paints it, either.
    Hazir paints it the way you presented it.
    Last night as I lay in bed, looking up at the stars, I thought, “Where the hell is my ceiling?"

  23. #23
    Nihilist Nessus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LittleFuzzy View Post
    Hazir paints it the way you presented it.
    In his interpretation, and evidently yours. But none of us are objective, and none of us are able to ever know another human being.
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  24. #24
    All Worship Ragnarök Loki's Avatar
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    Your views on just about every other topic suggest that you're a nihilist and a socialist, not anything resembling a Nazi.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  25. #25
    Nihilist Nessus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    Your views on just about every other topic suggest that you're a nihilist and a socialist, not anything resembling a Nazi.
    Which is why I said it was complicated!

    edit: And for the record, dr. Goebbels and to some degree even Hitler were socialist
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  26. #26
    All Worship Ragnarök Loki's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nessus View Post
    Which is why I said it was complicated!

    edit: And for the record, dr. Goebbels and to some degree even Hitler were socialist
    They were socialist in 1933. They weren't by 1941 (not to any large extent anyway). And your supposed Nazism is inconsistent with you constantly attacking people who think that some people are superior to others (i.e. Lewk's view of criminals). Frankly, when it comes to views on social policy, you are not that much different to Minx (not terribly surprising, seeing that you both live in "socialist paradises").
    Hope is the denial of reality

  27. #27
    Nihilist Nessus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    They were socialist in 1933. They weren't by 1941 (not to any large extent anyway). And your supposed Nazism is inconsistent with you constantly attacking people who think that some people are superior to others (i.e. Lewk's view of criminals). Frankly, when it comes to views on social policy, you are not that much different to Minx.
    I suppose. I think, I don't remember off-hand, that dr. Goebbels kept organizing the Winter-relief throughout the war, which'd make him somewhat socialist even under great stress, but that's neither here or there
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  28. #28
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    Lets see...

    Socialism is command and control type of economy. Sounds kinda like what Germany was doing. Lets see also the concept of health being a national issue as opposed to an individual choice... yup sounds like what Germany was doing.

    When they have the word socialist in the name of the party its a pretty sure bet that they are socialist.

  29. #29
    Nihilist Nessus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    Lets see...

    Socialism is command and control type of economy. Sounds kinda like what Germany was doing. Lets see also the concept of health being a national issue as opposed to an individual choice... yup sounds like what Germany was doing.

    When they have the word socialist in the name of the party its a pretty sure bet that they are socialist.
    If only you could realize that this kind of reasoning does not invite a bijection
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  30. #30
    All Worship Ragnarök Loki's Avatar
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    The goal of socialism is to create equality. The end goal of Nazism was to promote some people over others (even if you exclude the "undesirables"), take away economic rights from both workers and employers, while providing a minimal standard of living to the former. None of those objectives are socialist. You can make a weak case for the last one, but that's been done before socialism and even most non-Ron Pauls would accept it today.
    Hope is the denial of reality

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