Books!

[Timbuk2]

In the middle of We Need To Talk About Kevin.

The movie was utterly disturbing. I imagine the book would be more so.

[Ominous Gamer]

FIIIIIIIIIIIIIIILLLLLLLLLLLLLEEEEEEEEEEEEERRRRRRRR text
even more ffffffffffffiiiiiiiiiiiiiiilllllllllllllleeeeeeeee eeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrr text

Spoiler:

I read all 5 books and I don't know where you get the part about this being a fantasy series. The dragons play a minor role at best, even in book 5. The "others" are mentioned in perhaps 3 chapters total in the 5 books. The only real fantasy angle is the one involving Bran (which reads like a traditional young hero on a magical quest to save the world story; I also found his chapters the most tedious to read precisely because they didn't fit with the rest of the story). This is a book about political intrigue with some magical elements thrown in to spice things up and to differentiate the different storylines.

Spoiler:

3 of the stark kids are skinchangers, half a dozen of the wildlings are. at least 3 characters have been killed by magic. Daenerys is surrounded by it; her baby, Drogo, immunity to fire, etc. at least 3 characters have been brought back from the dead in some fashion. The impossible proportions of some of the characters (that was brought up on the GoT thread). The seasons, then you got greyscale thats come up.

Martin hates labels, but he discusses this with another author in the beginning pages of the first bound volume for the graphic novel. Its an insanely slow build, a transition that most people don't catch on to, allowing him to write a story that most people would have passed by if he was upfront with the fantasy aspect. But its there, the giant elephant thats slowly crowding out everything else.

[Loki]

And I still maintain that the purpose is mainly to differentiate each storyline. Otherwise, it would just be a bunch of do-gooders fighting scheming oppressors, generally with poor results. The fantasy angle trumps the aforementioned one only in the case of Bran. Rickon doesn't get any chapters of his own. I did forget about Stannis. I can't really decide what's really going on there. Is Martin setting us up for a deus ex machina?

[Khendraja'aro]

Uh, magic playing a small role? Did you already forget how the very first book opened? And the actual reason for this honkin' huge wall?

[Loki]

As of book 5, a vast majority of the fighting beyond the wall does not involve magic (other than a few giants and wargs I suppose). Even when there is fighting against magical beings, it's not like the fight is very different than if it was against normal creatures. The creature mentioned in the prologue of the first book makes virtually no appearances until book 6 (at least, according to Martin).

[Khendraja'aro]

The creature mentioned in the prologue of the first book makes virtually no appearances until book 6 (at least, according to Martin).

Aha. "No appearances".
You might want to reread the beginning of book 3 then. And several other parts. Y'know, the parts where a certain companion of Jon Snow got his nickname from.

Not to mention that your premise is wrong. There are quite a lot of fantasy series to the tune of "End of an era, magic is dying out", like The Lord of the Rings, Dragonlance, Shannara or Shadowmarch.

However, there are also series which are based on magic returning. And that, my dear, throws your whole argument right out of the window. You might want to read the alchemist's answer to Tyrion when he asked them why they were able to make such copious amounts of The Substance.

[Aimless]

"Our brains, wired to detect patterns, are always looking for a signal, when instead we should appreciate how noisy the data is."
-- Nate Silver


Kicked off my vacation reading with Nate Silver's The Signal and the Noise, a book about some of the more important challenges associated with forecasting--and decision-making--in vitally important fields ranging from baseball to seismology. I believe it's his first book and it's a little rough around the edges (spineless editor, I suspect), but it's a great read so far.

I'm nearing the halfway mark and each chapter so far has focused on a specific field of research--that is also of direct real-world importance to real people--in order to highlight a few important concepts or ideas that help the reader understand when, how and why forecasting may be difficult as well as recognize when these limitations are the most dangerous wrt their impact on decisions (at all levels from the individual going for a walk without an umbrella to the politician voting for the wrong stimulus bill). To some extent these chapters seem to have the goal of eliciting indignation and outrage from the reader and I expect the second half of the book will concern itself with [Messianic ] Bayesian approaches to mitigating many of the problems described in the first half.

This description may make the book sound a little dull or fussy or irrelevant, but it's actually really fun! The subjects and discussions are diverse but coherent, grounded in reality and presented in a way that is clear and entertaining.

[Aimless]

Review of "The Signal and the Noise" forthcoming, until then here's a review (my first on Goodreads!) of "Zealot":

https://www.goodreads.com/review/show/1005676526

[earthJoker]

So I finally managed it to read Ender's Game. Now I wondered how I should continue the saga. Reading on with the Ender's Series first or the Shadow's series?

[Ominous Gamer]

I think this has come up before. Going straight down is the main storyline, red ones I believe are short stories



order written - Ender's Game, Speaker for the Dead, Xenocide, Children of the Mind, then Ender's Shadow, Shadow of the Hegemon, Shadow Puppets, Shadow of the Giant. Or chronological order of story beginnings, which is Ender's Shadow, Ender's Game, Shadow of the Hegemon, Shadow Puppets, Shadow of the Giant, Speaker for the Dead, Xenocide, Children of the Mind.

[earthJoker]

I tink I read them in order written. The Book of Ender's Game I have has the first chapter of Ender's Shadow at the end. But I don't want to read it, until I got that book. I hate it when I can't read on right away.

[earthJoker]

BTW, if anyone like Nordic books, I can highly recomment Yrsa Sigurdardóttir and Johan Theorin.

[wiggin]

I tink I read them in order written. The Book of Ender's Game I have has the first chapter of Ender's Shadow at the end. But I don't want to read it, until I got that book. I hate it when I can't read on right away.

I'd strongly recommend you read them in the order written - there's a pretty big gap between some of the novels, and it shows. OSC has different things to say with different books, and reading them as he wrote them is (IMO) a superior way to follow the author's intentions. None of the short stories are necessary to understand the novels, and some have spoilers - I'd hold off on those until completing the novels.

One other warning: if you're expecting other Ender/Bean novels to be just like Ender's Game, you will be disappointed. The writing style is unmistakable Card, but he doesn't set out to write carbon copy books. Some of the books in the series are quite polarizing because of this, so be forewarned. They're all good in their own way, but they are by no means consistent in either theme or setting.

[earthJoker]

Good, as I said, I prefer order written. The only reason I wasn't sure, was because of the added chapter of Ender's Shadow at the end of Ender's Game.

I will buy the books one after another, so I don't have to read more than I want. Cards writing style is nice for me, his way of describing things. And his English is not overly complicated.

[Aimless]

My Kindle has been restocked

Beginning the year with Superforecasting, The Soul of an Octopus, Life on the Edge, The Sense of Style and Misbehaving: the Making of Behavioral Economics

[Dreadnaught]

Canticle for Leibowitz.

[Ominous Gamer]

Finished The Shadow Rising for The Wheel of Time. Most enjoyable book so far. For once the ending didn't feel rushed or half assed. Amazing what an author can do when he doesn't use the all powerful bad guy as a crutch. Although I do worry about the story turning into a tit for tat now that Rand is more accepting of his powers and role.

[Lewkowski]

Finished The Shadow Rising for The Wheel of Time. Most enjoyable book so far. For once the ending didn't feel rushed or half assed. Amazing what an author can do when he doesn't use the all powerful bad guy as a crutch. Although I do worry about the story turning into a tit for tat now that Rand is more accepting of his powers and role.

Fires of Heaven was one of the first 'meh' books IMO. I like Lord of Chaos (book 6) but others felt it wasn't great. I'm curious as to what your reaction will be when the city really hits its low points (like book 8). TSR was a fantastic book, it had a very 'scouring of the shire' feel to it.

[wiggin]

Got around to reading The Martian finally. Hmm. I enjoyed it but had some beefs. Minor spoilers to follow?

First, some technical/plotting issues. The situation that got him in the predicament in the first place was pretty far-fetched: First, that the MAV would not have been built to withstand those winds, given the amount of time it was expected to be on the surface, and second, that he'd in any way survive the accident. Then, some of the details wrt his luck in having certain crucial items ready/undamaged at critical time periods - e.g. his life support system surviving all sorts of punishment, him magically having sproutable vegetables on hand, his good luck in having different gases stored with identical valve fittings (which flies in the face of standard lab procedure), etc. It's a little bit too much 'just so' - the author tries hard to make everything believable to at least a first approximation, but some of these coincidences were stretching things. Finally, I highly doubt he could get workable soil in the manner in which he described - we don't know all that much about Martian dirt, but it's almost certainly very challenging to turn into soil, even with some 'starter' soil.

More broadly, I think the writing was, well, clearly written by a first time novelist with little to no editorial help. It shows (I have a similar gripe about 'Wool'). Other than the protagonist, the rest of the characters are just sketches, with one or two identifying features thrown in to make them distinguishable. There's a short love story shoehorned into the plot, and it clearly looks like an afterthought. Etc. It looks like his main story was nicely fleshed out but everything else was filler for plotting purposes. Furthermore, there are a few points that showcase some pretty terrible writing - not in the monologue sections, which are punchy and entertaining, but nearly everywhere else. Definitely could have used some editing.

Overall? 3.5/5. I enjoyed the emphasis on MacGyvering solutions in a hostile environment and the attempt to use some quantitative rigor to support the thought experiment (especially re: orbital mechanics and the like). Even so, a flawed effort. I'll have to see how the movie looks.

[Flixy]

Haven't read it, but the gas fittings being the same might be done so exactly to allow emergency repairs and mcgyvering, you are on another planet after all.

I finished The Yiddish policemen's union, which was a pretty good noir ish detective story set in an alternate timeline where Jews were allowed to settle in Alaska (apparently a real plan - the guy who blocked it in real life was killed in a car crash in this story). Pretty good book, though some of the conspiracy stuff is pretty far fetched but it fits in the story.

[wiggin]

I thought about that - and in fact the author makes precisely such a claim - but there is a reason for the CGA fitting system. Different gases have distinctly different compatibilities with eg metals and plastics, requiring careful choice of regulators and hoses for simple safety. I'm pretty sure NASA wouldn't mess with that, but I could always be wrong.

[Ominous Gamer]

Disappointed in the ending of book 5 for The Wheel of Time. A 5 paragraph middle school NCLBA writing exam telegraphs less than Robert Jordan did in The Fires of Heaven. He did a better job at Moiraine's possible demise, only hinting at it once I think several hundred pages before hand, but after that point it felt like he was writing to fill a quota. Asmodean's ending felt like it was thrown in as an afterthought as a hook for the next book.

I do worry about the story turning into a tit for tat now

Exactly what happened here. Jordan is constantly keeping the scales balanced.

[Aimless]

Yeah but what you don't find out until later is the identity of his killer and that revelation is as shocking as it is satisfying

Spoiler:

Bela

[Ominous Gamer]

will...not...click...

I hope its revealed as masterfully as Nynaeve figuring out who Moghedien was. Nothing like laying everything out like that and still making the reader feel like an idiot cause there wasn't a pause to reflect on it all.

[Lewkowski]

Yeah but what you don't find out until later is the identity of his killer and that revelation is as shocking as it is satisfying

Spoiler:

Bela

Spoiler:

Only if you believe in predetermination, in that case Bela is responsible for all of the murders.

[Ominous Gamer]

Jumped right into Lord of Chaos. Totally forgot how bad emo Perrin was, or that he was completely left out of the last book.

But whats up with the Jordan's love for the prologue? It takes up 10% of this book. Was he making up for not including one in the last book?

[wiggin]

Prologues were released early as teasers for loyal fans, so he tried to make them meaty.

[Lewkowski]

Jumped right into Lord of Chaos. Totally forgot how bad emo Perrin was, or that he was completely left out of the last book.

But whats up with the Jordan's love for the prologue? It takes up 10% of this book. Was he making up for not including one in the last book?

You are complaining about emo Perrin in book six. /giggle

[wiggin]

I read Leviathan Wakes the other day. For a Hugo nominee I was expecting more. It was pretty standard fare with a moderately telegraphed resolution. I thought the gimmick with different character voices was interesting, but wasn't all that compelling at the end of the day. Some of the secondary characters was mere sketches or seemed to act uncharacteristically at times. The writing quality overall was just okay - there were a few scenes that could have been awesome if they'd written them right (e.g.

Spoiler:

The bit where Miller goes in to Fred demanding to know if he can storm a space station without realizing who he is - that could have been comedy gold but it just ended up being mildly amusing.

There were some bits I liked. The world building was adequate, though I would have liked some more details on just how everything worked (especially the politics and economics). At times it seemed like they were making it up as they went along rather than having a good handle on how their world worked. The technology was broadly believable, albeit with some magic thrown in ('Epstein drive' to solve all of our problems). I thought the weapons/battle technology was actually pretty well thought out - I especially liked their sensitivity to the fact that extraterrestrial habitats are highly vulnerable, and only saved from rapid destruction in a conflict by common sense of the combatants - most other similar stories I've read rely on magic (energy shields or the like).

I will probably try reading the next book in the series just because it was mindless fun to read, but I'm not too invested. I quick watched the free pilot of the TV series and while I enjoyed the reasonable level of fidelity to the book and some of the 'feel' of the imagined world, I doubt I'm exercised enough to pay to watch the rest. Anyone seen/read more and want to tell me if I'm missing out?

[Steely Glint]

I watched the TV series, and felt the setting had a great deal of promise, but that the plot itself was utterly by the numbers: 'corporation doing something farcically dangerous because corporations are eeeevvvvvill'. If they were a real evil corporation, they'd be using a loophole in employment law to get out of paying workers for mandatory overtime or something, not digging up alien space gunk.

Will still watch the second series though.