Hannan: "We may need to moderate or temper what we are proposing."
Hannan: "We may need to moderate or temper what we are proposing."
When the sky above us fell
We descended into hell
Into kingdom come
More backtracking? Next thing you know he'll be proposing joining the euro.Originally Posted by Steely Glint
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And Farage, who is clearly not going anywhere, is not happy and is kicking up a stink.
Fitch has joined S&P in downgrading the UK's credit rating.
Meanwhile, Corbynites and the Labour mainstream are pretty much in a state of open war.
Can't wait for the season finale.
When the sky above us fell
We descended into hell
Into kingdom come
Honestly, I always had the idea that life outside the EU wouldn't be so nice for the UK, but I never expected the chaos we see this moment. I seriously think you guys need to fix your political system because not only isn't it working but it produces leaders that are by and large amateurs it seems.
The way I look at the February deal now is that it was a trap that has snapped shut last thursday, and Cameron helped building it himself for God's sake. And now that self-important columnist might be your next PM? Out of the pan into the fire.
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It's not like your politic leanings are easy to figure out either, Hazir.
I can understand that; I don t think we really engage in political discussions on this board too often. And then most issues only interest me marginally. I mean, talking about gun control, abortion or other hot topics from the US usually aren t things I really care about. Same sex marriage was personal, so that never lost my interest.It's not like your politic leanings are easy to figure out either, Hazir.
Then we have this whole EU debate which is anything but political as far as I am concerned. Unlike what LF thinks I have a lot of things about how the EU functions that I don't like and that I would like to see reformed yesterday. I feel it's a pretty horrible organisation which churns out compromises that make everybody unhappy. However, as far as I am concerned this the the mechanism we have in Europe to solve the questions that arise between us, and it works a hell of a lot better than all alternatives that we have tried before.
And I wouldn't feel the need to talk about the EU at all if I wouldn't think that mechanism wouldn't be under threath from resurging nationalism with ensuing xenophobia in this continent. I think we would do well to squash that ourselves before we again need the help of forces from outside to extract this continent from yet another bloody war. The fact that the existence of the EU also makes that for every EU citizen the entire continent potentially is at his or her disposal makes it important to me too.
My political leaning in general; centralist, sometimes leaning to the left sometimes leaning to the right. Hardly ever significantly deviating to more extreme positions. Though in some particular issues I can be maximalist. Like with same sex marriage.
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Hazir, I consider myself a centrist (socially liberal, fiscally conservative) but there's no place for that in US politics. We probably have more in common than any political party would like to admit!
But when it comes to the EU.....since it was started as a way to connect European nations, so they'd be less likely to fight/war with their trade partners....the principle is sound, but the process has flaws. I don't know why members think Brussels is to blame, when they send their own elected officials as reps.
A huge problem is how national politics abuse the EU. They get away with it by only confronting people back with the results of their negotiations in Brussels. In The Netherlands (and I think in some Scandinavian countries) they are trying to turn this around by having parliament debate every upcoming EU summit. That means our PM today is in Brussels, knowing what parlament thinks about how our first reaction to the British referendum should be and as it happens he can also reassure his collegues that talk about a referendum in Holland is without base. A big majority of parliament is against such a referendum and a referendum of that kind can only triggered by formal legislation. As it happens previously the council of state was asked an advice about such a referendum and one thing in that advice was interesting. It boils down to; the problem with consultative referenda is that politicians have a tendency to declare them binding and thus enhance the chances of chaos if the outcome is unexpected.Hazir, I consider myself a centrist (socially liberal, fiscally conservative) but there's no place for that in US politics. We probably have more in common than any political party would like to admit!
But when it comes to the EU.....since it was started as a way to connect European nations, so they'd be less likely to fight/war with their trade partners....the principle is sound, but the process has flaws. I don't know why members think Brussels is to blame, when they send their own elected officials as reps.
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More dumb experts: https://twitter.com/TheEIU/status/747743093114417152
Hope is the denial of reality
Hannan has always supported EFTA membership. He is setting out what he thinks we should do, just as he has done for years before the vote. The control now is within the electorates hand to elect a government to do what we want it to do, agree a trade agreement (not political union) with the EFTA, or do an "Australian style points system" for instance, or something else altogether. That's our choice now.
A short term recession is a possibility. It always was either way.
How many pieces of silver do you think it is worth to get rid of democracy? Is 30 pieces of silver enough for you?
Grow up
I can highlight tons of racism existing before the vote as well as racism the HuffPo can highlight as existing after the vote. Nothing has changed in that regard. So yes I am on the right side of history. In just the post above yours Hazir is pointing out people have been treated "ghastly for years" yet now we are supposed to believe it's all due to a referendum on do we want sovereignty or not? I don't think so.
We need a popcorn smileyMeanwhile, Corbynites and the Labour mainstream are pretty much in a state of open war.
I just joined Labour to vote in the anticipated leadership election. It's unhealthy for a country to have no effective opposition.We need a popcorn smiley
There's a man goin' 'round, takin' names
And he decides who to free and who to blame
It's a crazed situation where a party leader can lose a vote of no confidence by 172 votes to 40 and then stay on regardless. First post-Brexit PMQs is going to be dominated by Corbyn and his backbenches more than Europe.
I can't understand why he's so determined to hold on to a job he has no interest in actually doing.
When the sky above us fell
We descended into hell
Into kingdom come
Well, he's convinced that he's representing the people whereas these other wankers got into parliament by.. oh.. well..
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Love your logic here. The base of comparison is not what the economy was likely to look like in the near future; it's what the worst case scenario would have been. Fair base of comparison there.
Weren't you the one whining about democracy and respecting the will of voters? Corbyn has the support of 60% of Labour members.
Hope is the denial of reality
The others should ahve the support of about 80% of Labour voters.
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This is a disaster.
I'm interested in the long term. If something is the right thing to do should it be avoided if short term discomfort is more likely?
Absolutely hence my need for a popcorn smiley. It's hilarious isn't it. Sometimes schadenfreude can be great fun. Who could have dreamt that after an EU referendum campaign it would be the Labour Party that is most irreconcilably divided. LOL.Weren't you the one whining about democracy and respecting the will of voters? Corbyn has the support of 60% of Labour members.
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
He's decided he wants the job too now.
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'Genuine footage' from Leave HQ, although this treatment would be more suitable for England's favourite mono-bollocked demagogue.
Last edited by Unheard Of; 06-30-2016 at 10:29 AM. Reason: go fuck yourself
There's a man goin' 'round, takin' names
And he decides who to free and who to blame
And now it's all turning People's front of Judea.
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“An Englishman, a Scotsman and an Irishman walk into a bar … The Englishman wanted to go, so they all had to leave.”
Hope is the denial of reality
On a German website I read an apt explanation of the British relationship with the EU: it's like when you don't like the menu in a restaurant, you set the place on fire then go outside to commit suicide.“An Englishman, a Scotsman and an Irishman walk into a bar … The Englishman wanted to go, so they all had to leave.”
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Augstein is a crazy socialist, but this sentence was funny for once.
"Wer Visionen hat, sollte zum Arzt gehen." - Helmut Schmidt
Meanwhile German papers are openly calling Junker to step back. Comments comparing him to Sepp Blatter
"Wer Visionen hat, sollte zum Arzt gehen." - Helmut Schmidt
I would find it unacceptable if Juncker would be forced out of office by national politicians. That would be an incredible step back for democracy in the EU. You don't have to like Juncker, or even the Spitzenkandidat idea, but fact of the matter is that he's the first President of the Commission who can claim an actual democratic mandate.Meanwhile German papers are openly calling Junker to step back. Comments comparing him to Sepp Blatter
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