"Dye your hair"

[Lewkowski]

http://www.thelocal.at/20160506/atta...er-to-dye-hair

"The incident happened when the young woman, identified only by her first name Sabina, who lives in the capital Vienna had been waiting for a train on the S6 line at the city's main Westbahnhof station.

The 20-year-old, who was hospitalised after the attack by four men in which she was beaten and robbed, told Heute newspaper: "I felt so helpless."

"I had been standing on the platform waiting for the train when a man came up to me and spoke to me in a foreign language. He then started putting his hands through my hair and made it clear that in his cultural background there were hardly any blonde women. I told him to go away, and for a short while he really did go away."

"But it was only to get his pals and a bit later he came back with three others. They stole my handbag and my cards."

And if that was not enough, she said that the four had then attacked her, bashing her to the ground in a rage before running off.

She said that from what they had said she understood they were from Afghanistan and that as she lay on the floor in agony nobody on the platform had helped.

After being treated at hospital for bruising to her head, shoulder and elbow as well as her spine and hips, she went to police.

And her distress had turned to anger when police had told her that she should change her hair colour and should not have been travelling alone after 8pm on public transport.

She said: "At first I was scared, but now I'm more angry than anything. After the attack they told me that women shouldn't be alone on the streets after 8pm. And they also gave me other advice, telling me I should dye my hair dark and also not dress in such a provocative way. Indirectly that means I was partly to blame for what happened to me. That is a massive insult."
"

It is sad to see Europe going down the shitter thanks to refugee crisis. Its my understanding that Europe has strict gun laws so this poor woman and others like her couldn't even defend themselves when they are assaulted. Sadly it looks the Democrats are going to push their 'lets bring Europe's problems over here and do our part' agenda as well.

[Aimless]

While the information about the police's remarks have not been independently corroborated, I guess I wouldn't be too surprised if they really did say something like that given the girl's Arab heritage and the high prevalence of hateful racist douchebags among cops. Of course, even when cops aren't racist they do shit like making female victims feel responsible for their victimization, eg. by telling them not to dress provocatively or to walk outside alone after dark or engage strange men etc. Cops are dicks, Lewk. Cops are major dicks.

[RandBlade]

Race has nothing to do with it, get your head out of your derriere, she was attacked due to her gender not her race.

[Loki]

If only the same organizations who are showing remarkable outrage at the treatment of German women by asylum seekers weren't the ones blasting feminism and women's rights beforehand.

[Lewkowski]

If only the same organizations who are showing remarkable outrage at the treatment of German women by asylum seekers weren't the ones blasting feminism and women's rights beforehand.

You'll have to define what those terms mean to you before I can respond.

[Loki]

My point is that it's fascist groups (AfD) who are leading the outrage brigade; the same ones who think a woman's role is in the home and who never cared about the rape of German women as long as it was committed by German men (in fact, I doubt they'd even call it rape).

[Lewkowski]

My point is that it's fascist groups (AfD) who are leading the outrage brigade; the same ones who think a woman's role is in the home and who never cared about the rape of German women as long as it was committed by German men (in fact, I doubt they'd even call it rape).

Well I'm not an expert on Germany politics but I smell BS.

[Loki]

Google Pegida and Alternative for Germany.

[Lewkowski]

So a party with about 1/20 for representation? From wikipedia I haven't seen anything that would suggest they are 'pro rape.' While the 'old gender roles' could mean a lot I somehow doubt their view of 'old gender roles' is 'men get to have sex with any woman anytime they want!'

In general I think every major and minor party can agree that being sexually assaulted on the street is not a good thing and governments should do what they can to stop that. Not letting a bunch of refugees who think women are property might help avoid that.

Not specific to Germany but I think you'll find most folks 'on the right' are quite in favor of heavier punishments for rape than the lefties. The left likes to pretend that those who don't automatically believe every self proclaimed rape victim is 100% telling the truth are somehow pro rape. Given ironclad proof that a rape actually occurred most conservatives would have little issue with lifetime imprisonment or execution. Do you think criminal lovers like Khen think the same way?

[Loki]

Please find me an example of these same groups protesting any of the thousands and thousands of rapes that are committed by ethnic Germans every year.

This reminds me of the outrage caused by any black "defiling" a white woman in the south. It was only a problem when it was blacks doing it. The same people thought nothing of husbands raping their wives and opposed making that a crime.

[Lewkowski]

That's liberal fantasy land talk. People are not OK with rape and its blatant character assassination to suggest otherwise. If you look in modern politics it is the left who has been far more soft on crime than the right.

Your argument is boiling down to the belief that folks on the right are OK with non-immigration rape of women but are opposed to rape when its from immigrants/refugees etc. /boggle Really?

[Loki]

You're right, Lewk. The "Men's Rights Activists" are all left-wingers.

[Lewkowski]

You're right, Lewk. The "Men's Rights Activists" are all left-wingers.

Men's rights activists aren't 'OK with rape." And while they do believe in some wonky stuff the explicit bias the courts have when it comes to awarding custody IS an issue.

[RandBlade]

It's really weak and dad Loki that you can't just criticise sexual abuse without trying to change the subject.

[Khendraja'aro]

It's really weak and dad Loki that you can't just criticise sexual abuse without trying to change the subject.

What, by pointing out hypocrisy? Basically, those groups say: "Brownies don't get to diddle our women! That's our prerogative!"

[RandBlade]

Let's see a source of Lewk saying its OK to diddle women. I can't remember him ever saying anything like that (even if he does seem to have a real bugbear over false rape accusations).

[Veldan Rath]

How about the hypocrisy of certain feminists that all men are rapists, but then look the other way when it's a case of a minority?

We are being divided up into camps and it's not just by those on the right.

[RandBlade]

It's primarily not by those on the right. Divide and rule is the mantra of the left, we are individuals responsible for our own actions is that of the right.

[Enoch the Red]

Please find me an example of these same groups protesting any of the thousands and thousands of rapes that are committed by ethnic Germans every year.

This reminds me of the outrage caused by any black "defiling" a white woman in the south. It was only a problem when it was blacks doing it. The same people thought nothing of husbands raping their wives and opposed making that a crime.

I think this is a particularly crude line of reasoning. Your position seems to be that if someone isn't protesting something, or you haven't seen them speak out against it, that they either don't care or are supportive of that behavior. By that same token, does it mean that everyone who isn't protesting the rioting and hate speech in Milwaukee are either tacitly or actively supportive of it? There is a baseline level of opposition among general society for crimes that go beyond the pale - things like murder, rape, and assault won't receive much in the way of support from the vast majority of people anywhere. When those crimes are committed by your personal bugaboo you may give it more attention, but that doesn't mean there isn't outrage or disgust for it generally.

It may look like a good way to smear and score easy points against your opponent, but it's dishonest and counter productive.

[Aimless]

Race has nothing to do with it, get your head out of your derriere, she was attacked due to her gender not her race.

Come to think of it, I wouldn't be surprised if she really were assaulted because of her ethnicity because I imagine an Arab girl looking, dressing and acting like a Western girl would be extremely provocative to some backwards asshats.

However, if you read my post with your brain turned on you'll notice that I wasn't talking about the attackers but rather about the police and their alleged advice to the victim. That's the most important part of this story. That's the part that's really news. People get assaulted and robbed all the time, both men and women, regardless of ethnicity and place of residence. But cops in a developed western country--in the most/second-most liveable city in the world--telling a victim of assault that she should re-dye her hair and not go out after 8PM? That's shocking and interesting, if true.

That's liberal fantasy land talk. People are not OK with rape and its blatant character assassination to suggest otherwise. If you look in modern politics it is the left who has been far more soft on crime than the right.

Your argument is boiling down to the belief that folks on the right are OK with non-immigration rape of women but are opposed to rape when its from immigrants/refugees etc. /boggle Really?

Yes, really. See, people say a lot of things when pressed but if you want an accurate picture of their values you have to look at what they say and do and how they act even when they aren't put on the spot as well as examine the details of what they're saying (or not saying) while putting it into a broader context.

Among these right-wing authoritarian racist assballs, there is a tendency to focus almost exclusively on those assault-rapes that are found to be committed by immigrants, esp. refugees/asylum-seekers and esp. people from the Middle East and North Africa. Those are the events that get all the outrage and attention etc, the active engagement, but those rapes constitute a tiny, tiny fraction of all the rapes that occur in Sweden and I imagine the situation is similar in Germany, Austria, Denmark and most other developed Western European nations.

As soon as you start talking about rapes of the variety where someone is very drunk or high or paralyzed with fear etc. these people begin to equivocate. Sexual assault by a partner or a friend/acquaintance isn't something these people actively discuss. Interestingly--and hilariously--these people also seem to believe that immigrants are not only "over-represented" among rapists but also that they account for the vast majority of all rapes in Western countries.

It's kinda like when one of those dumbass Young-Earth Creationists say they support science but what they mean is really, "Science, except for the core theories of biology, physics, geology etc.--but the science of making soda-pop is pretty cool."

The less housebroken members of the European right have a proclivity for harrassing and threatening women, esp. any woman with a public presence who even comes close to fitting the label of "feminist" and esp. if they express anything that even comes close to approval of migration. Unsurprisingly, they frequently use sexual threats, eg. that they will sexually assault the woman in question. Others who are more well-behaved simply express the hope that the person or his/her female relatives--usually daughters--will be raped. In addition to this there's a lot of misogynistic name-calling--cunt, whore, bitch etc--that belies less than awesome views of women. Just like with American cops, the behaviour of these "few bad apples" (in reality many) is countenanced and encouraged by their audience, in the form of approving comments and likes/retweets as well as by tacit acceptance.

In Sweden and in some other countries we now have groups of men roaming around our cities with the goal of keeping "their" women safe from immigrants. Ironically, many of these guardian angels have themselves been arrested for violent assault against women, including sexual assault. And, knowing what we know about how often sexual assault gets reported--let alone successfully prosecuted--more should be guilty of similar misdeeds.

How about the hypocrisy of certain feminists that all men are rapists, but then look the other way when it's a case of a minority?

A vanishingly small fraction of modern feminists literally believe that all men are rapists and I don't believe those feminists make exceptions for immigrant men. A much larger portion of modern feminists do believe that all men are active or passive participants in a broader sexist culture/system that, in various ways, encourages and perpetuates rape and other forms of aggression against women. That doesn't translate to hating all men except immigrant men and I believe your characterization lacks necessary nuance.

It's primarily not by those on the right. Divide and rule is the mantra of the left, we are individuals responsible for our own actions is that of the right.

That must have happened while I slept because last night I checked to make sure and the Swedish right had some other interesting mantras based on the notion that immigrants and esp. brown/black immigrants and esp. Muslim brown/black immigrants were bad--because they were child-molesters and rapists and genetically predisposed to having low-IQ--and should be isolated in various ways, treated as second-class citizens and deported if possible. They also seem to have some weird ideas about there being a war on white Westerners, a war on men, a war on Christians, a war on "free thinkers" etc. The enemy is the politically correct leftist feminist traitorous "establishment" and mainstream media.

You don't define "the right" all on your own, RB, nor do you have any authority to define "the left". There's a larger world outside your butt, you should check it out sometime.

[Aimless]

Your position seems to be that if someone isn't protesting something, or you haven't seen them speak out against it, that they either don't care or are supportive of that behavior. By that same token, does it mean that everyone who isn't protesting the rioting and hate speech in Milwaukee are either tacitly or actively supportive of it?

There is a baseline level of opposition among general society for crimes that go beyond the pale - things like murder, rape, and assault won't receive much in the way of support from the vast majority of people anywhere. When those crimes are committed by your personal bugaboo you may give it more attention, but that doesn't mean there isn't outrage or disgust for it generally.

This is the exact same standard many Muslims living in the west are held to while a certain person on this forum goes even further when it comes to "liberals".

That said, the hypothetical scenario you bring up isn't a good illustration. If people in Milwaukee don't take to the streets to protest the riots etc. there may be good reasons for it, eg. safety, work, family, health etc.

Now if those same people do take to the streets to protest something else that is not much worse than the riots--and may, quantitatively, be less significant--then questioning their views would be justified. Why is the baseline disapproval not enough to make many people care actively and vocally but special disapproval of immigrants sufficient to make them go absolutely bonkers? Why is that baseline disapproval not enough to dissuade many of these people from perpetuating the kind of distasteful and harmful discourse and attitudes that make women more likely to get raped and less likely to get justice when they are raped?

This "baseline disapproval" would seem to be about as meaningful as the "baseline disapproval" for bad cops, ie. not very meaningful at all.

[RandBlade]

Come to think of it, I wouldn't be surprised if she really were assaulted because of her ethnicity because I imagine an Arab girl looking, dressing and acting like a Western girl would be extremely provocative to some backwards asshats.

Yet you wish us to do nothing but pander to these backwards asshats and their evil ideology and religion. You've never proposed a single method of how we are supposed to tackle such backwards asshattery, instead you just wish to change the conversation ASAP to the Police or anything else.

However, if you read my post with your brain turned on you'll notice that I wasn't talking about the attackers but rather about the police and their alleged advice to the victim. That's the most important part of this story. That's the part that's really news. People get assaulted and robbed all the time, both men and women, regardless of ethnicity and place of residence. But cops in a developed western country--in the most/second-most liveable city in the world--telling a victim of assault that she should re-dye her hair and not go out after 8PM? That's shocking and interesting, if true.

Yes it is shocking pandering to propose they blame the victim rather than the aggressors and their hateful, medieval ideology you wish us to do absolutely zero to tackle.

The less housebroken members of the European right have a proclivity for harrassing and threatening women, esp. any woman with a public presence who even comes close to fitting the label of "feminist" and esp. if they express anything that even comes close to approval of migration. Unsurprisingly, they frequently use sexual threats, eg. that they will sexually assault the woman in question. Others who are more well-behaved simply express the hope that the person or his/her female relatives--usually daughters--will be raped. In addition to this there's a lot of misogynistic name-calling--cunt, whore, bitch etc--that belies less than awesome views of women. Just like with American cops, the behaviour of these "few bad apples" (in reality many) is countenanced and encouraged by their audience, in the form of approving comments and likes/retweets as well as by tacit acceptance.

The left are far worse than the right for such every day misogyny.

That must have happened while I slept because last night I checked to make sure and the Swedish right had some other interesting mantras based on the notion that immigrants and esp. brown/black immigrants and esp. Muslim brown/black immigrants were bad--because they were child-molesters and rapists and genetically predisposed to having low-IQ--and should be isolated in various ways, treated as second-class citizens and deported if possible. They also seem to have some weird ideas about there being a war on white Westerners, a war on men, a war on Christians, a war on "free thinkers" etc. The enemy is the politically correct leftist feminist traitorous "establishment" and mainstream media.

You don't define "the right" all on your own, RB, nor do you have any authority to define "the left". There's a larger world outside your butt, you should check it out sometime.

Nor do you get to define the left or right yourself, yet for some reason you referred to the right repeatedly. Funny that

[Enoch the Red]

This is the exact same standard many Muslims living in the west are held to while a certain person on this forum goes even further when it comes to "liberals".

Yes? Is it somehow distasteful to apply this as a standard for yourself if Lewkowski does not also? Is that any kind of basis for a moral code? Or are we to content ourselves with a race to the bottom?

That said, the hypothetical scenario you bring up isn't a good illustration. If people in Milwaukee don't take to the streets to protest the riots etc. there may be good reasons for it, eg. safety, work, family, health etc.

You are not in Milwaukee. You have not so much as made a forum posts condemning the violence. Ergo you support the riots. Is that a fair and just way to treat anyone, even those we disagree with?

Now if those same people do take to the streets to protest something else that is not much worse than the riots--and may, quantitatively, be less significant--then questioning their views would be justified. Why is the baseline disapproval not enough to make many people care actively and vocally but special disapproval of immigrants sufficient to make them go absolutely bonkers? Why is that baseline disapproval not enough to dissuade many of these people from perpetuating the kind of distasteful and harmful discourse and attitudes that make women more likely to get raped and less likely to get justice when they are raped?

This "baseline disapproval" would seem to be about as meaningful as the "baseline disapproval" for bad cops, ie. not very meaningful at all.

I can't say for sure as I don't subscribe to their beliefs and don't feel comfortable speaking for them, but I can think of a number of possible reasons that don't involve supporting rape, including the acceptance that while evil is inevitable in a society, allowing in people that they believe are dangerous is courting disaster. That in their mind while it may not be possible to prevent every rape or sexual assault, that these particular assaults could have been.

It also advances a narrative that they subscribe to, which doesn't hurt either. I hardly think that behavior is something that can be laid exclusively at the feet of the right or left.

[Aimless]

The left are far worse than the right for such every day misogyny.

Jesus. That's just actually stupid. Honest to god dumb. It is one of the dumbest things you've said this year. You literally don't seem to have a clue. I'm sorry but that's just double facepalm material.

Nor do you get to define the left or right yourself, yet for some reason you referred to the right repeatedly. Funny that

The difference is that your bogus definitions are strict and exclusive--without justification--whereas I'm perfectly aware that the term "the right" encompasses a wide range of views and behaviours, among them xenophobia, racism and fascism. And, lately, misogyny. I used the term a handful of times and in all but one instance I used a qualifier, eg. "right-wing" with its specific connotations, or "less housebroken" to denote those who are especially fucked up. I used it as an unqualified term once, in response to your particularly stupidly phrased claim about "the left". So the only funny thing is that you, once again, don't seem to get it.

[Aimless]

Yes? Is it somehow distasteful to apply this as a standard for yourself if Lewkowski does not also? Is that any kind of basis for a moral code? Or are we to content ourselves with a race to the bottom?

Why not? We might learn something when we get there.

You are not in Milwaukee. You have not so much as made a forum posts condemning the violence. Ergo you support the riots. Is that a fair and just way to treat anyone, even those we disagree with?

I solemnly swear that I do not support the rioting itself. Tah-dah. I'm going to get back to opposing police misconduct now.

I can't say for sure as I don't subscribe to their beliefs and don't feel comfortable speaking for them, but I can think of a number of possible reasons that don't involve supporting rape, including the acceptance that while evil is inevitable in a society, allowing in people that they believe are dangerous is courting disaster. That in their mind while it may not be possible to prevent every rape or sexual assault, that these particular assaults could have been.

And that's the bizarre thing, this focus on a tiny fraction of all preventable horrors with proposed solutions that come at a far greater human cost for innocent refugees while having negligible impact on the incidence of rape in a society. The most charitable interpretation is that their priorities and how they determine the right thing to do are both, well, odd. The overwhelming majority of rapes in Western countries are not committed by refugees or asylum seekers or Muslims or brown people. So how many innocent suffering brownies is it okay to shaft in order to prevent one brownie-rape of a white woman within our borders?

[Aimless]

And btw, while it may not be possible to prevent every murder, many murders and accidental deaths could probably prevented with a total ban on firearms. Not all. Just a large number of specific incidents. Many more could be prevented by turning into a totalitarian police-state with CCTVs, drones and Robocops everywhere. You up for it?

[Enoch the Red]

And btw, while it may not be possible to prevent every murder, many murders and accidental deaths could probably prevented with a total ban on firearms. Not all. Just a large number of specific incidents. Many more could be prevented by turning into a totalitarian police-state with CCTVs, drones and Robocops everywhere. You up for it?

I think you misunderstood me being willing and able to ascribe a more reasonable position to my ideological opponents than, "They disagree with me therefore they must support rape and rapists," with support of their positions. Of course I don't support a totalitarian police state, or a blanket ban on firearms. I accept the risks that go along with being a part of a free society. That means supporting more freedom for everyone, including immigrants and refugees. While it certainly feels nice to dehumanize those you disagree with, framing them as two dimensional shadow people that are the embodiment of everything wrong with the world, you are only doing yourself a disservice by doing so. It doesn't work when Lewk does it, and it won't work when you do it.

And that's the bizarre thing, this focus on a tiny fraction of all preventable horrors with proposed solutions that come at a far greater human cost for innocent refugees while having negligible impact on the incidence of rape in a society. The most charitable interpretation is that their priorities and how they determine the right thing to do are both, well, odd. The overwhelming majority of rapes in Western countries are not committed by refugees or asylum seekers or Muslims or brown people. So how many innocent suffering brownies is it okay to shaft in order to prevent one brownie-rape of a white woman within our borders?

I never said it wasn't bizarre, or wrong headed, or something I agreed with. Quite the contrary. Yet it can be all those things and still not be a tacit support of rape.

[RandBlade]

Jesus. That's just actually stupid. Honest to god dumb. It is one of the dumbest things you've said this year. You literally don't seem to have a clue. I'm sorry but that's just double facepalm material.

There's a reason that on the right we've had two female Prime Ministers in this country while the left has never had even a single female leader. The left, here at least, is incredibly misogynistic.

The difference is that your bogus definitions are strict and exclusive--without justification--whereas I'm perfectly aware that the term "the right" encompasses a wide range of views and behaviours, among them xenophobia, racism and fascism. And, lately, misogyny. I used the term a handful of times and in all but one instance I used a qualifier, eg. "right-wing" with its specific connotations, or "less housebroken" to denote those who are especially fucked up. I used it as an unqualified term once, in response to your particularly stupidly phrased claim about "the left". So the only funny thing is that you, once again, don't seem to get it.

Whether you say right or right-wing is the same thing, if you think that "right-wing" has specific connotations then that says more about you than it does someone who actually is right-wing like me.

[Lewkowski]

And btw, while it may not be possible to prevent every murder, many murders and accidental deaths could probably prevented with a total ban on firearms. Not all. Just a large number of specific incidents. Many more could be prevented by turning into a totalitarian police-state with CCTVs, drones and Robocops everywhere. You up for it?

No but Clinton probably is...

[Lewkowski]

Jesus. That's just actually stupid. Honest to god dumb. It is one of the dumbest things you've said this year. You literally don't seem to have a clue. I'm sorry but that's just double facepalm material.

Do you want me to give examples of where the left does this? The vitriol that the left has for outspoken female conservative speakers pales before the the vitriol the right has for outspoken female liberals. When it comes to race... oh man even 'mainstream' liberals bring out the knives for Clarence Thomas far far more frequently than they do for folks like Alito. Gee I wonder why?