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Thread: NYC explosion. 29 injured, second device found

  1. #31
    Yeah, I'm sure he's angry about being "called out" for using a term the way it is currently used by those who work with such issues
    "One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."

  2. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    You remind me of the "people" who claim Arabs can't be anti-Semites because they're Semites themselves.
    Jews can be antisemetic so it would be bizarre to say Arabs can't be. But it still doesn't make Islam a race (while ethnic Jews OTOH are).

    If you want to debase our language so that it has no meaning then cry racist at everyone who is a sceptic over a religion then go ahead. Doesn't make you right. Islam is not a race, but feel free to be an ignoramus if you want. If the sign had said "Arabs out" then it would be racist.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    ℬeing upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  3. #33
    "I'm not a dickhead, I'm a cockbag!"
    "One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    Angry much about being called out for trying to use the 'racist' card for basically everything?
    I'll stop calling this racist when people stop attacking people for "looking" Muslim.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  5. #35
    If someone is attacked for their skin etc then that is racist, because they've been attacked for their skin not their religion (which they may or may not incidentally share). If a Sikh or a Christian or an atheist is attacked for "looking" Muslim is that more acceptable because its not because they were Muslim?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    ℬeing upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  6. #36
    It is not as if these people are being attacked over whether or not Jesus or Muhammed is the last true prophet of God or anything, so characterising these attacks as religious rather than racially motivated is disingenuous at best.
    When the sky above us fell
    We descended into hell
    Into kingdom come

  7. #37
    It's not as if anyone was attacked full stop . . .

    Edit: except the victims of the Muslim terrorist attacks in New York, New Jersey and Minnesota of course. So considering the attackers were motivated by their Muslim beliefs characterising them as anything other that religious is bullshit.
    Last edited by RandBlade; 09-21-2016 at 03:18 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    ℬeing upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  8. #38
    "One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."

  9. #39
    I think you'll find the terms Muslim and Arab are used interchangeably by the racist crowd. Furthermore, white Muslims (and even black ones) don't get hassled nearly as much as Middle Eastern-looking people (including ones who aren't actually Muslim).
    Hope is the denial of reality

  10. #40
    In this thread we have had links to 39 people being injured by being shot, stabbed or via bombs from Muslim terrorists in America.

    In this thread we have had a link to someone putting a sign up saying Muslims Out.

    And you think the issue here is violence against Muslims rather than violence by them? Cut the bullshit please.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    ℬeing upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  11. #41
    https://theintercept.com/2016/05/05/...slim-rhetoric/

    And that's just the reported incidents.

    Incidentally, 15,000 Americans get murdered every year. Muslims are no more likely to kill Americans than other groups (and probably less so). Funny how one can always find a misleading statistic to justify their hatred of groups they didn't like already.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  12. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    It's not as if anyone was attacked
    Did you just try to play the "I'm not touching you" routine? Don't you have a kid? You should fucking know better than this.
    "In a field where an overlooked bug could cost millions, you want people who will speak their minds, even if they’re sometimes obnoxious about it."

  13. #43
    Are you kidding I have a two year old and tend to play games like that with her. Her favourite game at the moment is for me to pretend to be a monster/ghost and her to pretend to be scared.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    ℬeing upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  14. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    https://theintercept.com/2016/05/05/...slim-rhetoric/

    And that's just the reported incidents.

    Incidentally, 15,000 Americans get murdered every year. Muslims are no more likely to kill Americans than other groups (and probably less so). Funny how one can always find a misleading statistic to justify their hatred of groups they didn't like already.
    So in 13 months nationwide there's been allegedly 12 murders and 34 assaults allegedly because of anti Muslim feelings.

    In one day in this thread there were 39 assaulted and could have been dozens killed had the Muslim terrorists not been so incompetent.

    While the 12 murders allegedly for anti Islam reasons are completely unacceptable they make up less than 0.1% of annual murders so not sure what point you were making by combining those figures.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    ℬeing upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  15. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    I'll stop calling this racist when people stop attacking people for "looking" Muslim.
    "I will continue to use my favorite political word (racist) until 7 billion people all agree on something." Alllllrighty then

  16. #46
    https://www.documentcloud.org/docume...5-9-16-16.html

    I prefer one busy asshole to a nation full of assholes. One man killing 30 people is better than 30 men killing one person each.
    "One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."

  17. #47
    No, its not.

    So there's been 196 alleged anti-Islam "incidents" in the entire USA in an entire year, which contrasts with 502 anti-Jewish "incidents" in the same timeperiod. Remind me when Jews last killed dozens because that''s what their sky wizard told them to do?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    ℬeing upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  18. #48
    There are about twice as many Jews in the US as there are Muslims and anti-Semitism is much more shameful in the eyes of the general US populace.

    1 man killing 30 people is better than 30 people killing one person each because my chances of meeting a potential murderer is much higher with 30 potential murderers roaming around than it is with just one potential murderer roaming around. This is esp. true if those 30 believe they have the tacit or explicit support of their friends and neighbours.

    It's funny how you keep saying "alleged" when talking about Islamophobic hate-crimes (eg. involving physical violence and vandalism) and Islamophobic behavior (yelling at Muslims to get out, shouting down Muslims in town hall meetings, putting up signs telling Myslims to get out) while neglecting to do the same when talking about anti-Semitic ones.

    It's also interesting that you dismiss the murders for being a tiny fraction of all murders while neglecting to dismiss the injuries despite them being only a tiny fraction of all injuries. Maybe I should book an appt. with an optician because I'm seeing double standards everywhere lately.
    "One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."

  19. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    No, its not.

    So there's been 196 alleged anti-Islam "incidents" in the entire USA in an entire year, which contrasts with 502 anti-Jewish "incidents" in the same timeperiod. Remind me when Jews last killed dozens because that''s what their sky wizard told them to do?
    http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/terrorism/wrjp255a.html Search for "Jewish".

    So how did we go from "Muslims don't get targeted for being Muslims" to "there were only 192 reported incidents"?
    Hope is the denial of reality

  20. #50
    Alleged incidents.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    ℬeing upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  21. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/terrorism/wrjp255a.html Search for "Jewish".

    So how did we go from "Muslims don't get targeted for being Muslims" to "there were only 192 reported incidents"?
    Er, so twice since April 14th 1865, and the last reported Jewish terror attack was over 30 years ago? Those are hardly compelling numbers.
    Last edited by Enoch the Red; 09-22-2016 at 02:47 AM.

  22. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Aimless View Post
    There are about twice as many Jews in the US as there are Muslims and anti-Semitism is much more shameful in the eyes of the general US populace.
    Twice as many Jews but 2.5x as many alleged "incidents". So antisemitism is still the bigger problem yet I don't hear you harping on about the bigger problem. Why is that?
    1 man killing 30 people is better than 30 people killing one person each because my chances of meeting a potential murderer is much higher with 30 potential murderers roaming around than it is with just one potential murderer roaming around. This is esp. true if those 30 believe they have the tacit or explicit support of their friends and neighbours.
    That is a terrible logic fail it doesn't work like that. Well it does but if you meet one of the 30 you are far more likely to survive especially since non spree killers are far more likely to kill a loved one or acquaintance than a stranger. Whereas the followers of a sky wizard are more likely to have supporters than those who snap and kill their wife for instance.
    It's funny how you keep saying "alleged" when talking about Islamophobic hate-crimes (eg. involving physical violence and vandalism) and Islamophobic behavior (yelling at Muslims to get out, shouting down Muslims in town hall meetings, putting up signs telling Myslims to get out) while neglecting to do the same when talking about anti-Semitic ones.
    Not really since I'd already used the word earlier in the sentence I found it repetitive and redundant to repeat it. I did repeat the quotation marks around "incidents".
    It's also interesting that you dismiss the murders for being a tiny fraction of all murders while neglecting to dismiss the injuries despite them being only a tiny fraction of all injuries. Maybe I should book an appt. with an optician because I'm seeing double standards everywhere lately.
    I didn't dismiss them I said they were quote "completely unacceptable" but asked what Loki's point was since it was him not me that introduced the figure of overall numbers for comparison.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    ℬeing upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  23. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    Twice as many Jews but 2.5x as many alleged "incidents". So antisemitism is still the bigger problem yet I don't hear you harping on about the bigger problem. Why is that?
    I figure American Jews are more likely to report such incidents than are American Muslims, but most importantly I'm more interested in those expressions of Islamophobia that don't amount to physical assault.

    That is a terrible logic fail it doesn't work like that. Well it does but if you meet one of the 30 you are far more likely to survive especially since non spree killers are far more likely to kill a loved one or acquaintance than a stranger.
    If I'm hit by a Russian nuke I'm more likely to die than if I come across a Muslim fundy with a thirst for blood.

    Whereas the followers of a sky wizard are more likely to have supporters than those who snap and kill their wife for instance.
    In the US, the number of people who act as if it's okay for Muslims to harrass and ostracize or otherwise mistreat non-Muslims is smaller than the number of people who are similarly tolerant of non-Muslims' animosity towards Muslims.

    I didn't dismiss them I said they were quote "completely unacceptable" but asked what Loki's point was since it was him not me that introduced the figure of overall numbers for comparison.
    I guess he's trying to say that Muslims are not much more likely to kill Americans than any other people are. Although to be fair they are like a millon times more likely to kill Americans while shouting "Allahu akbar" than pretty much any other group.
    "One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."

  24. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Aimless View Post
    I figure American Jews are more likely to report such incidents than are American Muslims, but most importantly I'm more interested in those expressions of Islamophobia that don't amount to physical assault.
    You figure that based on what evidence? And why are you interested in those expressions?
    If I'm hit by a Russian nuke I'm more likely to die than if I come across a Muslim fundy with a thirst for blood.
    But if Russian nukes have killed the same number of your compatriots as Muslim fundies then you're as likely to die from either unless there's another variable. Though I can't seem to recall anyone being killed recently by Russian nukes and if there had been I suspect I would recall it.
    In the US, the number of people who act as if it's okay for Muslims to harrass and ostracize or otherwise mistreat non-Muslims is smaller than the number of people who are similarly tolerant of non-Muslims' animosity towards Muslims.
    Only because non-Muslims are the majority and it is a non-Muslim nation. In Saudi Arabia the opposite is the case. But you weren't talking about nationwide, you were talking about the perpetuators "friends and family" so that is moot. Though Muslims are more likely to harass and mistreat Muslims than non-Muslims are.
    I guess he's trying to say that Muslims are not much more likely to kill Americans than any other people are. Although to be fair they are like a millon times more likely to kill Americans while shouting "Allahu akbar" than pretty much any other group.
    While Muslims are not much more likely to be killed by Americans than any other people are either. Still missing your point.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    ℬeing upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  25. #55
    192 alleged "incidents" against Muslims including 12 deaths.

    How favourable or unfavourably does that compare to:
    Over half a million women in the USA at risk or living with Female Genital Mutiliation: https://www.theguardian.com/society/...ected-us-women
    Approximately 27 "honour killings" a year in the USA: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/meimei...b_5826286.html
    Let alone the women coerced every day of the year to be treated as second class citizens and compelled to wear degrading garments if not enter forced marriages.

    Deliberately picked left wing sources there. But don't worry about any of that, somebody may have said mean words about your sky wizard's followers at some point.

    EDIT: Forced marriage figures were harder to find but here, 1500 alleged forced marriages a year: http://www.tahirih.org/wp-content/up...ted-States.pdf

    But don't worry about people being forced into marriages like that because somebody putting a sign in a shop is much more serious and a nasty sign is much more harassing and a much bigger mistreatment than being forced to enter a marriage. Let's discuss that to death instead.
    Last edited by RandBlade; 09-22-2016 at 12:44 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    ℬeing upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  26. #56
    Right, so Muslims are a threat to Americans because some of them mistreat other Muslims. Got it. Therefore, any kind of hostility against all Muslims, whether by the public or the police, is fully justified.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  27. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    Done that, not only has nobody died from a Jewish attack in my entire lifetime on that list, every incidence after 1986 the word Jewish was mentioned in relation to victims of the attacks and not the attackers. Kind of demonstrates my point more than yours.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    ℬeing upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  28. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    Right, so Muslims are a threat to Americans because some of them mistreat other Muslims. Got it. Therefore, any kind of hostility against all Muslims, whether by the public or the police, is fully justified.
    No there are jerks all over the place. We should be tackling the criminal ones. Free speech means you have a right to be a jerk, you don't have a right to be a criminal. Their evil oppressive religious cohorts are a far bigger threat to the Muslims in America than any of the jerks you've listed are. If we start by tackling the real problems of forcing women to wear oppressive garments, forced marriage, forced female genital mutiliation, "honour killings" etc ... without forgetting the repeated and regular terrorist incidents like those that started this thread then maybe once we've done that we might have time to discuss signs.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    ℬeing upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  29. #59
    The point being that different groups have violent minorities within them at different time periods?
    Hope is the denial of reality

  30. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    The point being that different groups have violent minorities within them at different time periods?
    The question was "Remind me when Jews last killed dozens" and from your provided source there's never been a single terrorist attack by Jews in America that has killed a dozen people like I'd asked. At least not for finding the word Jewish which in the past 30 years only comes up when referencing victims.

    That despite the fact that as Minx so gleefully pointed out before there being significantly more Jews in America than Muslims.

    So no, that is not the point. The Jews are really victims and not attackers.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    ℬeing upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

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