Brexit Begins

[Hazir]

RandBlade believes in the Anglosphere and British leadership in it. He's deeply dishonest when it comes to the EU.

[gogobongopop]

Twitter Link

[Aimless]

It's nice to see that you finally recognise that sovereignty exists on a spectrum.

I appreciate it's early days but I expect you and other Brexit voters to scrutinise the CPTPP incredibly closely. It seems to be run by a commission for which the details of membership and selection are hard to find. If it doesn't comprise of people democratically elected by us, I imagine you would be very uneasy in the way it operated.

There will be resistance but overall they will be desperate to get in at any cost. More likely to see UK joining CPTPP in the coming half decade than seeing a UK-US FTA. Joining CPTPP might become more difficult if the US becomes interested again, I dunno.

[Khendraja'aro]

It's not as if GB hasn't been there before.

Perfidious Albion

[Hazir]

There will be resistance but overall they will be desperate to get in at any cost. More likely to see UK joining CPTPP in the coming half decade than seeing a UK-US FTA. Joining CPTPP might become more difficult if the US becomes interested again, I dunno.

I don't see that happening before Ireland is reunited.

[Aimless]

I don't see that happening before Ireland is reunited.

You mean no CPTPP so long as Irish border issues remain unsolved?

[Hazir]

You mean no CPTPP so long as Irish border issues remain unsolved?

No, I meant no FTA with the USA. If Randblade's preferred candidate for the Presidency gets elected in the USA there will not even be talks. If he doesn't win, a snowball in hell has a better chance of survival than the agreement of getting through Congress.

But if push come to shove we (on the EU side) shouldn't forget that this can only end in humiliation for the Brits. Even if their parliament decides to adopt the UKIM, that doesn't mean we will feel bound by it in any way. Just like we aren't bound by the Swiss constitutional amendment that supposedly should limit FOM into Switzerland.

I would be very much in favor of sanctions on members of the British establishment that make use of this 'power'. It think we should also make clear that if nations in the UK decide they no longer want to be under a regime that is wrecking the rule of law they are welcome to join the EU.

[Aimless]

Yes, that is also why I suggested it was much less likely to happen than CPTPP membership.

In other news, lmao at this panto:

https://mobile.twitter.com/Peston/st...67431492636675

[RandBlade]

Boris is my kind of Conservative. Much happier with him than May whom I couldn't stand.

[Aimless]

Indeed, because you are not a principled conservative.

[gogobongopop]

Boris is my kind of Conservative. Much happier with him than May whom I couldn't stand.

A liar. Understood.

Do you support the withdrawal agreement btw? If you do then surely you have to give May massive credit as she did 99% of it. If you don't, like many "true" Brexiteers, then surely you can't support Johnson, who said it was great and ran with it.

[Khendraja'aro]

A liar. Understood.

Do you support the withdrawal agreement btw? If you do then surely you have to give May massive credit as she did 99% of it. If you don't, like many "true" Brexiteers, then surely you can't support Johnson, who said it was great and ran with it.

Please, that would require him not to be a hypocrite.

For him it's "Britannia waive the rules".

That we also might just do that is not something he considers. Hey, Rand, found a replacement for EURATOM yet? Say goodbye to scintigraphy!

[RandBlade]

Indeed, because you are not a principled conservative.

Never been a soft-c conservative no. I'm a liberal Conservative or a Libertarian.

A liar. Understood.

Do you support the withdrawal agreement btw? If you do then surely you have to give May massive credit as she did 99% of it. If you don't, like many "true" Brexiteers, then surely you can't support Johnson, who said it was great and ran with it.

I vehemently opposed May's Withdrawal Agreement. I said we'd be better off going to No Deal or Remaining than May's awful Brexit.

Boris didn't run with May's Agreement, he changed the worst parts of it so that it was much better.

[Aimless]

Never been a soft-c conservative no. I'm a liberal Conservative or a Libertarian.

Tre point, of course, is that you're not principled, in that you don't have principles.

[Aimless]

I vehemently opposed May's Withdrawal Agreement. I said we'd be better off going to No Deal or Remaining than May's awful Brexit.

Boris didn't run with May's Agreement, he changed the worst parts of it so that it was much better.

lmao at this, why are you so insistent on clowning yourself

[gogobongopop]

Never been a soft-c conservative no. I'm a liberal Conservative or a Libertarian.
I vehemently opposed May's Withdrawal Agreement. I said we'd be better off going to No Deal or Remaining than May's awful Brexit.

Boris didn't run with May's Agreement, he changed the worst parts of it so that it was much better.

He changed about 1% of it. If I remember it was about the thing he told NI he would never, ever do.

So why are you so supportive of a man running with such an awful deal for us?

I'd say making "awful" "much better" ends up as distinctly average. Don't you want better than that?

[RandBlade]

Tre point, of course, is that you're not principled, in that you don't have principles.

I absolutely have principles and I stick by them. They may be different to your principles, but that makes sense what with them being mine.

[RandBlade]

He changed about 1% of it. If I remember it was about the thing he told NI he would never, ever do.

So why are you so supportive of a man running with such an awful deal for us?

I'd say making "awful" "much better" ends up as distinctly average. Don't you want better than that?

He changed the bit of it we objected to. We objected to the backstop, he abolished it. The rest that wasn't being objected to there was no reason to change.

[gogobongopop]

Yeah, so about 1% of it. The rest of it you're clearly in favour of then. It sounds like you should give May some credit seeing as she's the one that did all the actual work.

Oh and people were objecting to a lot more of it than just the backstop. True, patriotic Brexiteers despise May's deal. The one that Johnson is now championing.

[Aimless]

I absolutely have principles and I stick by them. They may be different to your principles, but that makes sense what with them being mine.

Given your willingness to have your govt violate an agreement it negotiated, signed and sold to the public, your enthusiasm for obstructing parliament, and your willingness to tolerate or even defend racism, corruption, incompetence and lies on the part of your leader... I'm gonna say nah. And, as you no doubt realize on some level, nobody is taken in by your Trumpian "alternative facts" spiel

[RandBlade]

Considering that the ability of Parliament to overwrite international agreements is a principle I have long supported, why does the Government doing that and my willingness to see it happen show I have no principles? That is my principles in action.

[Hazir]

I absolutely have principles and I stick by them. They may be different to your principles, but that makes sense what with them being mine.

Your only principle is that you will shy back from no dishonesty at all. You are a hypocrite and a liar. Which explains your admiration for de Pfeffel.

[Aimless]

Considering that the ability of Parliament to overwrite international agreements is a principle I have long supported, why does the Government doing that and my willingness to see it happen show I have no principles? That is my principles in action.

If you want to appear principled, it's a good idea to not basically say that your guiding principle is to screw all principles.

[Hazir]

If you want to appear principled, it's a good idea to not basically say that your guiding principle is to screw all principles.

What he is supporting may ultimately give the EU the right to even disapply WTO, and other multilateral agreements in its dealings with the UK.

[RandBlade]

If you want to appear principled, it's a good idea to not basically say that your guiding principle is to screw all principles.

My #1 principle is democracy. If the public want a change of path the elected government must be able to do that. That is a principle.

[Aimless]

My #1 principle is democracy. If the public want a change of path the elected government must be able to do that. That is a principle.

And if the public wishes to subject a minority group to genocide?

[RandBlade]

And if the public wishes to subject a minority group to genocide?

I would not be OK with that.

[Aimless]

What he is supporting may ultimately give the EU the right to even disapply WTO, and other multilateral agreements in its dealings with the UK.

It is a genuinely interesting question. It might overall be good to escalate an eventual conflict in that (limited and specific but punitive) manner.

[Aimless]

I would not be OK with that.

Why not, if it is a democratic decision and your cargo-cult conception of democracy is your "#1 principle"?

[Hazir]

Why not, if it is a democratic decision and your cargo-cult conception of democracy is your "#1 principle"?

Especially if there is a unilateral right to redraw portions of international treaties that don't coincide with the will of the people. Randy has no idea what can of worms his idol has opened. I think we can safely say that De Pfeffel is catching up with Trump. Maybe even surpassed him, because I can't recall Trump actually doing something as brazen as this.