I don't see anything that's been torn down.
You realize that the EU Parliament didn't exactly view Davis' statements with favour? There also won't be a "Ceta+++".
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
You realize that we're talking about TWO separate contracts here? And you will not get to phase 2 if you don't fully commit to what you rpomised in phase 1. Bloody idiots, the lot of you.
Did none of you ever think for five meters of gravelly road about this, how that sounds?
"Oh, we'll pay!"
One day later:
"We'll pay only if we feel like it."
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
No, Randblade does not get that any relationship is based on trust. He does not understand that if you agree to something in principle the last thing you should say is that you may not honor your commitment. What he thinks of as 'logical' is actually seeding distrust and the UK will pay for this during the phase 2 negotiations through the inclusion of all sorts of guillotine stipulations in the final deal which will make sure that the whole deal collapses if the UK renages on even minor issues.
Congratulations America
Literally can't understand what you're saying here.
Being fired makes it a little difficult to deliver on your plan. That doesn't make it a lie.
That's an interesting perspective. I never bought into this whole "project fear" thing on the remain campaign.
My view was that leave was all about fear. Fear of:
- Immigrants bombing us
- Immigrants raping our girls
- Benefits tourism
- "open borders"
- The country being full
- EU regulation strangling our businesses
- EU regulation closing our businesses
- An EU super army
- An EU super state
- The faceless bureaucrats out to cripple the UK for their own benefit
- Losing more and more sovereignty to corrupt and unelected
- The loss of "british values"
- Spending £350m pounds a week that could have been spent on the NHS
- The EU stopping us from trading with other nations
- The EURO
- Turkey
- Refugees
- etc
The remain campaign was complacent and was completely outshone by the strategy of the leave campaign. I believe this was because the leave campaign tapped in brilliantly the our most powerful emotion - fear.
Clegg and Cameron themselves actually tried to sell the benefits. I remember watching them talking about the principles of the EU; the fundamentals on which they are based; the idea that by working together we achieve more, sustainably. I remember them saying that, like any organisation, the EU isn't perfect, but to simply walk away was the worst possible option. They really connected with me at this point.
I saw nothing positive from the leave campaign other than hypothetical rhetoric that I simply didn't believe - like putting my faith in God. I saw no evidence or data to substantiate their claims. I saw no experts come their rescue. So yeah, I'm still relentlessly negative and will continue to be regardless of the outcome - because I believe in the principles of the EU. Even if, by some miracle, we do end up with better living standards, I'll still feel negative because I believe that the EU is a remarkable institution that delivers wonderful things. Knowing that we're not at the table, having a lead role in that really depresses me.
Davis's comments are not really correct when you consider the agreement in its entirety and put it into context. For all intents and purposes, the agreement is binding and violation will make phase 2 negotiations impossible. This is also why they will be translated into law asap. Brexiters have also tried to push incorrect interpretations of the agreement. Put into a broader context, these comments show Britain to be an untrustworthy negotiating partner.
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
Well, the discussion is becoming moot it seems, as the lack or trust in the UK as a negotiating partner is eroding so fast that the EU appearantly is upping the ante by demanding a legally binding form for the joint statement. So that was real smart of Davis to think that he could talk down the commitment for home use, still acting as if people in power in the EU don't read British papers.
It would not surprise me at all if 'sufficient progress' regressed from 'achieved' to 'conditionally achieved' on the basis of Davis' stupidity.
source
Congratulations America
Oh, erm, RB used that term in earlier conversation, implying certain people had a birthright to EU citizenship. I picked up on that and have been using that term several times since. Looks like I may have used it incorrectly that last time. Still, the point applies to be children, who's birthright it was, which is now being stripped away.
No I did not! I said they had a right to and I quote "British and Irish citizenship". Again there is NO SUCH THING as EU citizenship in isolation. Citizenship still to date belongs to the nation state which appears on your passport and if your nation happens to be part of the EU then that conveys EU citizenship on top of your actual citizenship. Find me anyone with "nationality: European Union" on their passport please.
I asked if you would deny people their birthright of Irish citizenship. Not EU citizenship which does not exist in a vacuum.
I find it refreshing by the way that attempts to appease the Breximaniacs aren't part of EU politics any longer.
But I do wonder why remoaners still try to convince Breximaniacs like Rand. Given the propensity of the latter type to move the goal posts as often as they feel like moving them I wonder why remoaners feel they need to 'play by the rules'. The Breximaniacs made a non-binding referendum binding, what's stopping remoaners from tossing out the rule book as well and only go for a win?
While I'd have no horse in that race, it would be fun to watch. Though maybe I should have gone for a blood sport analogy.
Congratulations America
Looks like a may have misinterpreted that then. Wasn't very to be honest and doesn't change anything my end.
The referendum was always morally and politically if not legally binding. The government said before the referendum it would honour the result and only the most extreme Remainiacs have suggested that it should be ignored.
I'm guessing a word is missing there, maybe clear? The point is that the Irish have Irish citizenship and you do not. Why you find it unfair the Irish have Irish citizenship is beyond me. Should we be seeking to prevent Irish citizens from getting Irish citizenship in order to level the playing field with you?
You are wrong as usual. The citizenship of the European Union does exist separate from the citizenship of a memberstate of the European Union despite the fac that the citizenship of a memberstate of the European Union is an absolute prerequisite for the citizenship of the European Union. The citizenship of the European Union bestowes different rights upon its bearers than the citizenship of a memberstate of the European Union. Also it doesn't bestow rights upon the barer of the citizenship of a memberstate of the European Union in the memberstate of which he is a citizen. The relevance of the citizenship of the European Union has a close relationship to the use of the Freedom of Movement. If you don't use the latter, you can also not use the rights given to the citizen.
Congratulations America
Yeah, clear. Sorry using phone.
And you're trying desperately to put words into my mouth aren't you? I have never said such a thing. I find it unfair that some British citizens (i.e. the majority of NI who identify as British) will continue to get EU citizenship.
Why you want to deny the rest of the UK EU citizenship is beyond me.
Well, that is a question up for debate for those UK citizens using their rights as EU citizens already. These people have 'activated' their EU citizenship so to say and one can have serious doubts if the subsequent rights can be taken away just like that. Which is why the EU prefers to NOT change anything in the rights of these people and if pressuring the UK to do exactly the same. You and Gobonbopop can forget it, you are UK citizens and don't lose any rights due to Brexit, you merely lose access to rights.
Congratulations America
Again no British citizens are being granted EU citizenship post-Brexit by virtue of being British. The number of Northern Irish citizens who will hold solely British citizenship and EU citizenship is a grand total of 0 people. Irish citizens will be granted EU citizenship as part of their Irish citizenship. Irish not British.
I don't seek to deny anybody EU citizenship, it isn't my decision to make. If the EU wants to offer citizenship to people who are not citizens of a member state then by all means let them do that and I would be delighted - I can't see that being very popular within the EU though.
Sovereign parliament takes back control from unelected autocrats and idiots:
https://www.theguardian.com/politics...on-theresa-may
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
Can anybody explain what difference they think this makes?
Congratulations America
There's a man goin' 'round, takin' names
And he decides who to free and who to blame
Hark! The people speak again:
http://www.bmgresearch.co.uk/indepen...tion-tensions/
Young people, Labour voters, people with degrees and full-time jobs, students. Of course, FPTP will shield the Tories to some extent from the threat of democracy, but even so.
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
Time for a big fat LOL; the bank of England is going to allow European banks to do business in the UK without those banks having to set up independent subsidiaries in the UK. That means in essence that regardless of the final deal the EU sets the rules for how a part of the financial sector in London works. Take back control indeed.
Congratulations America
On the other hand, this move to make broadband access a right is a positive.
It also made the idiotic conservatives at another board I frequent foam at the mouth. Because their US-centrism wasn't capable of even remotely considering that the word "right" is not necessarily 100% identical to the US definition of the word.
They promptly wailed: "Now everyone gets internet for FREE! That's stealing from me! And SLAVERY!"
A bunch of petty morons who heartily subscribe to "But what has the government ever done for ME? ME? ME! ME!"
These people should go live in a mud hut somewhere remote if they don't want to live in a society and share a bit of their wealth.
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
They have no wealth.
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
IMF tells Brexiteers: The experts were right, Brexit is already badly damaging the UK's economy
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/bu...-a8119886.html
damn those experts!
"In a field where an overlooked bug could cost millions, you want people who will speak their minds, even if they’re sometimes obnoxious about it."