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Thread: Stop the presses--Tom Nichols is leaving the Republican Party

  1. #1

    Default Stop the presses--Tom Nichols is leaving the Republican Party

    Article, for when you've recovered from the shock of learning that he hadn't done so already:

    https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/ar...-party/572419/

    Nichols is, by his own admission, not a particularly important Republican. This is, however, an important article; it helps other conservatives identify (in their own language) where it hurts—and it shows them a way forward, out of the pain.
    “Humanity's greatest advances are not in its discoveries, but in how those discoveries are applied to reduce inequity.”
    — Bill Gates

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Aimless View Post
    Article, for when you've recovered from the shock of learning that he hadn't done so already:

    https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/ar...-party/572419/

    Nichols is, by his own admission, not a particularly important Republican. This is, however, an important article; it helps other conservatives identify (in their own language) where it hurts—and it shows them a way forward, out of the pain.
    His political views are that of a Reagan democrat more-so than a typical Republican. Based on his policy position declaring himself as an independent makes a lot of sense.

  3. #3
    No, he's a pretty consistent conservative. Your conservatism is entirely contingent on how the GOP defines it in any given day.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    No, he's a pretty consistent conservative. Your conservatism is entirely contingent on how the GOP defines it in any given day.
    Pro-Abortion. Anti-Death Penalty. He doesn't elaborate on the "I don't think whats good for corporations is good for the country" but that normally is a clear anti-business pro-regulation position. Oh and he's a critic of defense spending. These are pretty far off base from the Republican platform.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    Pro-Abortion. Anti-Death Penalty.
    A third of Republicans believe abortion should be legal. About the same proportion believe capital punishment should be abolished. Over a dozen Republican legislators have sponsored or co-sponsored bills to stop capital punishment in their states, including some red states. Your views of both Conservatism in general and Republican voters in particular constitute an increasingly non-representative tribal caricature.

    He doesn't elaborate on the "I don't think whats good for corporations is good for the country"
    Don't fabricate quotes. Quote what he actually said:

    I don’t think what’s good for massive corporations is always good for America.
    This is completely different from your fabricated quote. It's also a reasonable position even for conservatives. More importantly, the Republican party and its core voters have now come out in support of protectionism in the form of direct govt. interference (eg. through criticism, tariffs, calling for investigations, subsidizing farmers harmed by tariffs) intended to reverse increasing globalization and drive large corporations back to the US against their interests.

    Oh and he's a critic of defense spending.
    Oh and you keep having difficulties reading articles:

    I think that our defense budget is too big, too centered on expensive toys, and that we are still too entranced by nuclear weapons.
    This isn't a general criticism of defense; it implies a specific and nuanced criticism of defense expenditures--much more specific and nuanced than eg. the Tea Party movement's opposition to massive defense budgets.

    These are pretty far off base from the Republican platform.
    The Republican platform no longer represents principled conservatism in the US.
    “Humanity's greatest advances are not in its discoveries, but in how those discoveries are applied to reduce inequity.”
    — Bill Gates

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    Pro-Abortion. Anti-Death Penalty. He doesn't elaborate on the "I don't think whats good for corporations is good for the country" but that normally is a clear anti-business pro-regulation position. Oh and he's a critic of defense spending. These are pretty far off base from the Republican platform.
    Thanks for proving my point. Conservatism isn't blindly supporting the GOP stance on the current wedge issues. It's about conserving institutions, suspicion of new trends and ideas, the maintenance of social order, and opposition to radical change. There's nothing inherently conservative about opposing abortion of supporting the death penalty. It's the end goal of those policies that matters. For you, short-term political wins are the ends in themselves. You have no deeper commitment to conservatism or any other coherent system of thought.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    Thanks for proving my point. Conservatism isn't blindly supporting the GOP stance on the current wedge issues. It's about conserving institutions, suspicion of new trends and ideas, the maintenance of social order, and opposition to radical change. There's nothing inherently conservative about opposing abortion of supporting the death penalty. It's the end goal of those policies that matters. For you, short-term political wins are the ends in themselves. You have no deeper commitment to conservatism or any other coherent system of thought.
    I think we're getting pedantic here. Please of people who consider themselves 'conservative' aren't primarily about maintaining the status quo. The "New is good = progressive" and "old is good = conservative" are a dated way about how people view politics and the camp they reside in.

  8. #8
    Please of people who consider themselves 'conservative' aren't primarily about maintaining the status quo.
    No, they are. It's right there in the name.

    Unless you count turning the clock back to about 1956 socially speaking as changing the status quo, which I suppose is technically correct.
    Truth serves them
    Embrace and defend her case
    Part flattery, part threats
    "For those who cling to this domination will partake in its fall"


  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    I think we're getting pedantic here. Please of people who consider themselves 'conservative' aren't primarily about maintaining the status quo. The "New is good = progressive" and "old is good = conservative" are a dated way about how people view politics and the camp they reside in.
    No, I'm basing my definition on Burke. You're basing yours on Hannity. If you want to blindly support the GOP, including when it reverses itself in the span of a few years, that's your choice. Just don't claim to be a conservative. The current GOP is a reactionary party. It's willing to destroy institutions and undermine the constitutional order for the sake of returning to an earlier time period when white, male Christians went unchallenged.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    No, I'm basing my definition on Burke. You're basing yours on Hannity. If you want to blindly support the GOP, including when it reverses itself in the span of a few years, that's your choice. Just don't claim to be a conservative. The current GOP is a reactionary party. It's willing to destroy institutions and undermine the constitutional order for the sake of returning to an earlier time period when white, male Christians went unchallenged.
    It is like you are living in an alternative reality. The Modern GOP is a big tent party that actively supports minorities, women and people of all faiths to run under their banner. Not because they are a minority (because that would be racist a hell) but because they are the best person for the job.

  11. #11
    Lewk by this point you should understand that we have all known you far to long for that bullshit to get any type of reaction but a laugh.

    I mean... Seriously who do you think you're kidding?
    "In a field where an overlooked bug could cost millions, you want people who will speak their minds, even if they’re sometimes obnoxious about it."

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    It is like you are living in an alternative reality. The Modern GOP is a big tent party that actively supports minorities, women and people of all faiths to run under their banner. Not because they are a minority (because that would be racist a hell) but because they are the best person for the job.


    That's a lot of idiots who don't realize that the GOP really has their interests at heart.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  13. #13
    “Humanity's greatest advances are not in its discoveries, but in how those discoveries are applied to reduce inequity.”
    — Bill Gates

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