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Is there any wonder that team Trump would be curious about what actually happened and why Biden was so determined to get that prosecutor fired?
For everyone's favorite sub-reddit.
https://i.redd.it/gn36vpvdy6p31.png
Is there any wonder that team Trump would be curious about what actually happened and why Biden was so determined to get that prosecutor fired?
And according to the sworn testimony of Viktor Shokin (the guy Biden bragged about being fired) he was primarily fire due to his investigation of Burisma Holdings who had Hunter on as the BoD.
Why exactly did Burisma hire Hunter Biden? Either they erroneously believed the Obama administration and VP Biden were corrupt or they correctly believed it. The fact that Biden went out of his way to deliver a personal threat on a billion dollars seems a bit excessive if this was just run of the mill corruption. Why was Biden so personally vested in a prosecutor in the Ukraine? Makes you wonder...
Yes, "according to the sworn testimony" of a corrupt prosecutor who was universally regarded as being corrupt and a hindrance to the work against corruption who was fired for being so corrupt that Ukrainians, western govts and international orgs could no longer tolerate his efforts to obstruct corruption cases, including the Burisma case which he was not pursuing but had rather shelved. The "sworn testimony" of that guy. Good job Lewk Tracy, we'll look into this.Originally Posted by Lewkowski
Yes, it "makes you wonder" if you're a bit thick. Because Shokin wasn't actively investigating Burisma but instead had managed to obstruct that investigation, a realistic outcome of having him fired and replaced would in fact have been that the Burisma investigation would have been resumed. So what you're saying is that Joe Biden went to great lengths to personally ensure that the corrupt company his son was associated with would be investigated properly. Good job, Lewk Tracy, you've cracked this case wide open, what a genius you are, truly this is some Grade A Whole Brain Thinking.Why exactly did Burisma hire Hunter Biden? Either they erroneously believed the Obama administration and VP Biden were corrupt or they correctly believed it. The fact that Biden went out of his way to deliver a personal threat on a billion dollars seems a bit excessive if this was just run of the mill corruption. Why was Biden so personally vested in a prosecutor in the Ukraine? Makes you wonder...
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
Lol these people are genuinely just a bunch of small-time crooks
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"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
Pretty funny that the guy who thinks anyone even daring to look sideways at Trumps numerous corrupt dealings both in and out of office is acting 'politically motivated' and 'partisan' (remember when he was convinced Strzok texts blew the lid on some deep-state conspiracy to overthrown Trump for his dealings with Russia?) is looking at the Ukraine transcript and going, 'yup, this is legit, he tots just wants to uncover if there were any shady dealings' even though there are actually legitimate channels to go through if you want to do that which don't involved shaking down the president of a foreign country or sending your own personal attorney sniffing around.
And when I say it's 'pretty funny', I mean it's funny in the same way heavily catch-phrase oriented comedy is funny, like the Fast Show or the Rock's promos, where you know the catch-phrase is coming but the funny part is seeing how they work up to it and then, boom, there it is.
Last edited by Steely Glint; 09-28-2019 at 04:34 PM.
When the sky above us fell
We descended into hell
Into kingdom come
It's just so dumb. This is truly Stupid Watergate.
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
Remember when it was all 'The FBI probe doesn't count because it started life with the Steele dossier, which began as oppo research' and then the president of the US is using the power of his office to go on a fishing expedition on his presumed 2020 rival and suddenly it's all "don't worry about how it happened, what if it's true?"
When the sky above us fell
We descended into hell
Into kingdom come
Strzok again? The guy Mulluer wanted off his team? So which horse do you back Mueller or Strzok? Why do I bother you won't answer just like when Comey and McCabe has conflicting testimony y'all wouldn't say which person you thought was lying. The bottom line with Strzok is he texted about having an "insurance plan" against Trump and acted in a partisan fashion with the Clinton e-mail investigation. Add to that he slept with his colleague while they were both working on a highly politically sensitive case. If that isn't both professionally an epic fail it at the very least calls into his account his utter lack of judgement.
You're really turning ad hominem into an art form.
But sure, we probably shouldn't allow anyone who repeatedly cheats on his wife to hold a high office.
Hope is the denial of reality
During the primaries Cruz was my guy after Paul dropped out. Trump's infidelities and toxic abuse of eminent domain were reasons why I don't like him personally.
That said we don't impeach people for making errors in judgement from 10+ years ago. And as a general rule elected officials are held accountable by the people. Anyone who paid any attention to politics knew Trump was an adulterer and he was still elected, making it effectively a non-story now.
Not the case for "insurance policy" spook.
don't ever do that.
Faith is Hope (see Loki's sig for details)
If hindsight is 20-20, why is it so often ignored?
What exactly are you laughing about? Your president's previous criminal attempt to obstruct justice, or his latest one?
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
I still don't understand what you think the significance of any of this is?
When the sky above us fell
We descended into hell
Into kingdom come
Why does anyone do anything
As someone who did not vote for Trump, I would be perfectly content to see him not win re-election depending on who won instead. But I also am shocked and appalled at the media/bureaucracy reaction to Trump and its non-stop efforts to undermine the 2016 election. I believe it is corrosive to our democracy.
Wait, so Ukraine asks for lethal defense aid. Joe Biden (as Obama point person on Ukraine) denies missiles. Joe Biden's son gets a no-show $50,000/month job with a Ukrainian energy company. Joe Biden leans on Ukraine government to fire officials in exchange for aid, and brags about it openly. But Trump is corruptly meddling in the Ukraine?
Why don't we state the obvious here: elected officials of stronger nations throw their weight around with weaker nations.
'holding the executive to account is corrosive to our democracy' is a hell of a take.
You could probably get a it printed in the New York Times, they love that faux-centrist shit.
When the sky above us fell
We descended into hell
Into kingdom come
Please re-read the reporting on these events instead of embarrassing yourself like this. You're an adult, and you're presumably both literate and capable of basic critical thinking. Use these abilities.Why does anyone do anything
As someone who did not vote for Trump, I would be perfectly content to see him not win re-election depending on who won instead. But I also am shocked and appalled at the media/bureaucracy reaction to Trump and its non-stop efforts to undermine the 2016 election. I believe it is corrosive to our democracy.
Wait, so Ukraine asks for lethal defense aid. Joe Biden (as Obama point person on Ukraine) denies missiles. Joe Biden's son gets a no-show $50,000/month job with a Ukrainian energy company. Joe Biden leans on Ukraine government to fire officials in exchange for aid, and brags about it openly. But Trump is corruptly meddling in the Ukraine?
Why don't we state the obvious here: elected officials of stronger nations throw their weight around with weaker nations.
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
Dread, are you Giuliani's protege or something? Everything you write about Trump is either outright false or spun to such an extent that no intelligent person would actually believe it. The implication is either that you've suddenly become an idiot (which I don't believe to be the case) or that you decided that everyone here is an idiot. Do your arguments actually work against anyone? Is this how the uber-wealthy convince themselves that no one who gives them a tax cut can truly be a bad president?
Hope is the denial of reality
PLOT TWIST: Dread is Giuliani.
When the sky above us fell
We descended into hell
Into kingdom come
Official statements from the President of a democratic constitutional Republic—ostensibly the leader of the free world—threatening both an elected legislator and a whistleblower for engaging in legally protected actions that constitute political threats:
Like so many of Trump's statements and actions, this alone should be impeachable. The cowed silence of his servile Republican enablers shames the entire nation, the nascent Banana[s] Republic of America.
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
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Can't stop laughing... how is this dingus a legislator?
Last edited by Aimless; 09-30-2019 at 01:10 AM.
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
It's what the base wants to hear. And it gives talking points to people like Dread.
Hope is the denial of reality
Acting political figures asking another government to assist in investigating their political opponent? Why are we here again?Asking Ukraine to cooperate with the DOJ, be that Barr or Mueller (both employed by the United States government Department of Justice, one the head of the dept the other appointed as a Special Counsel) is no different.
The President asking another country to cooperate in a possible corruption probe into a political rival is no different than US Senators asking another country to cooperate in a possible obstruction of justice/collusion probe into a political rival. They are the exact same thing. What's good for the goose has to be good for the gander. I know liberals love their double standards but come on already.
Does celebrity surpass law? I think it does.
Faith is Hope (see Loki's sig for details)
If hindsight is 20-20, why is it so often ignored?
Saying something over and over again doesn't make it true. Even if we accept the flawed premise that Trump's actions in 2016 were similar in caliber to Biden's, it wasn't Biden who asked foreigners for cooperation in investigating Trump. That would be Mueller, a Republican tasked precisely with investigating Trump. If you can't see the difference between a special prosecutor investigating a sitting president and a sitting president investigating his own political rival, then you real don't deserve democracy.Acting political figures asking another government to assist in investigating their political opponent? Why are we here again?
The President asking another country to cooperate in a possible corruption probe into a political rival is no different than US Senators asking another country to cooperate in a possible obstruction of justice/collusion probe into a political rival. They are the exact same thing. What's good for the goose has to be good for the gander. I know liberals love their double standards but come on already.
Hope is the denial of reality
An either case if there was a potential crime done it deserves investigating. When it comes to international diplomacy giving the heads up and asking for cooperation from an ally isn't inappropriate. The DOJ is part of the executive branch and ultimately the buck stops with Trump. It is his responsibility as president to make sure the executive branch functions properly and to smooth things over when we need international cooperation when we investigate corruption that involves our citizens overseas.
Which part of my statement is false?
There is an intentional divide between the president and the DOJ. The same is true in virtually every Western democracy. The fact you think it's acceptable for the president to tell the DOJ who to go after and that it's acceptable for a president to blackmail other countries in the pursuit of his personal interests tells me you don't give a damn about either democracy or America's national interest. Your only interest is in making libs cry.
Hope is the denial of reality
Blackmail? Did you believe the Schiff parody? (He himself called it a parody) There was no blackmail. There was no pressure. Trump released the transcript and the Ukraine president said there was no coercion.
And your argument is that the Senate is the appropriate body to conduct foreign policy with world leaders as opposed to the President? Really?
I understand you think this is super smart, but it is actually super dumb - senile grandpa level dumb. There is a clear difference between a president covertly pressuring a foreign government to investigate a relative of a political opponent in order to damage that opponent in an upcoming election, and a legally appointed prosecutor tasked with investigating specific allegations asking officials of a foreign govt. for assistance with that investigation. The difference is that one is a covert quid-pro-quo arrangement for personal political gain in contravention of election laws - ie. a corrupt abuse of power - while the other is legal and legitimate. Trump covertly pressured Ukraine to work with his personal lawyer for personal gain, using public funds as leverage. That is corrupt. It is criminal.Acting political figures asking another government to assist in investigating their political opponent? Why are we here again?
The President asking another country to cooperate in a possible corruption probe into a political rival is no different than US Senators asking another country to cooperate in a possible obstruction of justice/collusion probe into a political rival. They are the exact same thing. What's good for the goose has to be good for the gander. I know liberals love their double standards but come on already.
No, this is super stupid. The DOJ being a part of the executive branch does not in fact give Trump - personally - the authority to abuse his power in an attempt to damage a political opponent in anticipation of an upcoming election in a quid-pro-quo arrangement involving already-appropriated public funds. You're trying to make it sound like it's perfectly normal for POTUS to act like the leader of a banana republic, but it is in fact the very opposite of normal. It is abnormally corrupt.
There was considerable pressure. The repeated requests/demands constitute pressure in and of themselves. The withholding of aid constitutes amplification of that pressure. No leader of a sovereign nation will ever admit to have been pressured in such a humiliating fashion, especially when he believes his administration's and his country's prospects depend on not angering the person responsible for the humiliation. If Trump had farted in his face, he would assure us that fart was incredible and most wonderfully perfumed. His statements have no evidentiary value whatsoever; the pressure is self-evident.
This is not an example of foreign policy--it's an example of corruption in domestic politics. The Senate is the appropriate body to investigate and remove a criminally corrupt President. Well, in theory at least--we all know that the Senate Republican conference is not capable of fulfilling their duty to safeguard the constitution and the republic against the most corrupt American president in modern history.And your argument is that the Senate is the appropriate body to conduct foreign policy with world leaders as opposed to the President? Really?
Last edited by Aimless; 09-30-2019 at 12:23 PM.
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
Let's do a simple double standards test: would you justify/excuse these behaviors if the president was a Democrat?
Team Trump, in coordination with Trump TV, move the goal posts every damn day. It's clearly a pattern now: first comes denial (we didn't do that), followed by obfuscation/projection (look at what the Dems are doing), then admit to the deed (but insist it's not wrong). Insert a conspiracy theory and 'alternative facts' along the way....while demonizing the press, intelligence agencies and even congressional oversight. What could possible go wrong?
And oh yeah, Trump is calling the whistleblower a traitor and spy. Giuliani is the real whistleblower and a hero! OMG who falls for this?
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