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Thread: UK General Election 12 December

  1. #211
    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    We are at record employment levels
    Because you don't, and never have, included all the unemployed.
    .

  2. #212
    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    Apples and oranges



    Massive corporate tax cuts in the 1980s do absolutely nothing to help unemployment.

    If you believe that I've got a bridge to sell you.
    I'm not buying your fucking bridges. No one is.
    Why do we build the wall, my children, my children? We build the wall to keep us free.
    How does the wall keep us free, my children, my children? The wall keeps out the enemy. And we build the wall to keep us free.
    Who do we call the enemy, my children, my children? The enemy is poverty. And the wall keeps out the enemy. And we build the wall to keep us free.
    That's why we build the wall. We build the wall to keep us free. Because we have and they have not, my children, my my children. Because they want what we have got.
    What do we have that they should want, my children, my children? We have a wall to work upon. We have work and they have none. And our work is never done. And the war is never won.
    The enemy is poverty, the wall keeps out the enemy, and we build the wall to keep us free. That's why we build the wall, we build the wall to keep us free.

  3. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Glint View Post
    Massive corporate tax cuts in the 1980s do absolutely nothing to help unemployment.
    Yes it did. Massively!
    The 80s reforms led to much-improved employment rates and also ended the scenario running in the 70s were people were only employed by loss-making industries due to major subsidies from the government. Thatcherism led to the closure of old industries and companies and the start up of many more newer ones.

    Median household incomes improved massively over the 80s: https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulat...yearending2018
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    Being upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  4. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    Yes it did. Massively!
    There's a graph right there telling you that it didn't. Are you blind or something?

    Unemployment didn't get down to what it had been pre-Thatcher's tax cuts until like 2015, over three decades later and you're all, like "yeah, corporate tax cuts totally make unemployment go down you guys"?

    Little tip for you: when corporations get tax cuts, what they tell you they do with the extra money is they'll reinvest it into the economy and create more jobs, but in reality what they actually do is they just keep it.

    Median household incomes improved massively over the 80s


    Median household incomes always rise, barring recessions. There's nothing special about what happened in the 80s, except there was a recession.
    Why do we build the wall, my children, my children? We build the wall to keep us free.
    How does the wall keep us free, my children, my children? The wall keeps out the enemy. And we build the wall to keep us free.
    Who do we call the enemy, my children, my children? The enemy is poverty. And the wall keeps out the enemy. And we build the wall to keep us free.
    That's why we build the wall. We build the wall to keep us free. Because we have and they have not, my children, my my children. Because they want what we have got.
    What do we have that they should want, my children, my children? We have a wall to work upon. We have work and they have none. And our work is never done. And the war is never won.
    The enemy is poverty, the wall keeps out the enemy, and we build the wall to keep us free. That's why we build the wall, we build the wall to keep us free.

  5. #215
    Quote Originally Posted by Steely Glint View Post
    There's a graph right there telling you that it didn't. Are you blind or something?
    There's a graph right there telling me it did. Are you blind? In which year do you see tax cuts happening from and what was the unemployment rate in that year?
    Unemployment didn't get down to what it had been pre-Thatcher's tax cuts until like 2015, over three decades later and you're all, like "yeah, corporate tax cuts totally make unemployment go down you guys"?
    Seems like you can't read graphs or analyse cause and effect. There were over 3 million unemployed in 1982 and the corporation tax rates were cut from 1983 onwards. I don't seem to recall us having more than 3 million unemployed since 1983 do you?
    Little tip for you: when corporations get tax cuts, what they tell you they do with the extra money is they'll reinvest it into the economy and create more jobs, but in reality what they actually do is they just keep it.
    The whole point of them making a profit is for them to keep it. In order to get a profit to keep it they must invest in the country - if they don't invest, they go out of business and get replaced my more agile companies who do invest and create jobs.


    Median household incomes always rise, barring recessions. There's nothing special about what happened in the 80s, except there was a recession.
    Your graph shows my point. Median household incomes rose the most (proportionately) in the 1980s. As we are talking percentage increases normally you should expect to see an exponential graph going up when the baseline is set to 100 on a particular date but that graph is not exponential, if anything it is more logarithmically increasing which is depressing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    Being upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  6. #216
    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    There's a graph right there telling me it did. Are you blind? In which year do you see tax cuts happening from and what was the unemployment rate in that year?
    Seems like you can't read graphs or analyse cause and effect. There were over 3 million unemployed in 1982 and the corporation tax rates were cut from 1983 onwards. I don't seem to recall us having more than 3 million unemployed since 1983 do you?
    We'd just come out a recession, of course the unemployment rate is going to fall. Didn't fall all the way back to where it was when the top rate corporate tax rate was 40 or 50% though, did it?

    If a high rate of corporate tax means high unemployment, how did we manage to keep the unemployment under 5% for the entirely of the post war period when the rate of corporation tax was > 40% (and the income tax they paid previous to the introduction of corporation tax was similar), until the point where Thatcher cuts taxes to under 40% and subsequent governments eventually take it down to the mid 20s and lower, but unemployment doesn't drop back to below 5% until decades later, in the twenty-teens? I'm not saying cutting corporation tax caused unemployment to rise, obviously, but where is this connection you keep insisting is so obvious?

    P.S Corbyn is proposing to increase the main rate to 26%, which is still lower than it was under Thatcher, and you're all like "this is going to destroy the economy, no one will ever start a business again". It's fucking ridiculous.

    The whole point of them making a profit is for them to keep it. In order to get a profit to keep it they must invest in the country - if they don't invest, they go out of business and get replaced my more agile companies who do invest and create jobs.
    Right. They're going to invest what they need to invest whatever happens, because it's necessary for the survival of their companies. Lowering taxes for Widget Corp doesn't suddenly make the market for widgets bigger, does it?
    Why do we build the wall, my children, my children? We build the wall to keep us free.
    How does the wall keep us free, my children, my children? The wall keeps out the enemy. And we build the wall to keep us free.
    Who do we call the enemy, my children, my children? The enemy is poverty. And the wall keeps out the enemy. And we build the wall to keep us free.
    That's why we build the wall. We build the wall to keep us free. Because we have and they have not, my children, my my children. Because they want what we have got.
    What do we have that they should want, my children, my children? We have a wall to work upon. We have work and they have none. And our work is never done. And the war is never won.
    The enemy is poverty, the wall keeps out the enemy, and we build the wall to keep us free. That's why we build the wall, we build the wall to keep us free.

  7. #217
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    Gosh, the Torygraph is overflowing with filosemitism these days. I guess they decided anti-semitism Corbyn's weakest point. Also a great way of distracting from the truth, like that Brexit can't be done and be over with by the end of January.
    Greece shows us that there is a kind of politician worse than the ones that break their election promises; the ones that keep their election promises.

  8. #218
    Such a genuinely despicable man is a fitting leader for such a genuinely repugnant ideology:

    “Humanity's greatest advances are not in its discoveries, but in how those discoveries are applied to reduce inequity.”
    — Bill Gates

  9. #219
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    The alternatives are more different than better. And for the most despicable leader title Corbyn is a serious contender.
    Greece shows us that there is a kind of politician worse than the ones that break their election promises; the ones that keep their election promises.

  10. #220
    He's a fitting leader for his own detestable clique, but I don't see him winning the premiership anytime soon.
    “Humanity's greatest advances are not in its discoveries, but in how those discoveries are applied to reduce inequity.”
    — Bill Gates

  11. #221
    Quote Originally Posted by Aimless View Post
    Such a genuinely despicable man is a fitting leader for such a genuinely repugnant ideology:

    If he'd said that I'd agree it was repugnant but that headline is misleading and not what was said.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    Being upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  12. #222
    Yeah, the full quote isn't actually much better, and both versions put words to the same ignorant xenophobic populism.
    “Humanity's greatest advances are not in its discoveries, but in how those discoveries are applied to reduce inequity.”
    — Bill Gates

  13. #223
    Quote the full quote and say what's wrong with it please. The full quote I've seen is very considered.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    Being upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  14. #224
    What about taking a journalist's phone and putting it in his pocket when being faced with a picture of a child sleeping on a hospital floor?

    What a *&^%ing piece of ^%$£.

  15. #225
    Tories try to distract from Johnson's phone grabbing interview by lying about Hancock's adviser being punched. Journalists jump on it only to find video evidence shows no such thing.

    The lies and deceit continue.

  16. #226
    Quote Originally Posted by gogobongopop View Post
    Tories try to distract from Johnson's phone grabbing interview by lying about Hancock's adviser being punched. Journalists jump on it only to find video evidence shows no such thing.

    The lies and deceit continue.
    Video shows that Hancock's advisor was hit by a protestor who wasn't looking where he was swinging his arm. An accident but at the time probably wouldn't have realised it was an accident. Funny how the guy waving his arm about not looking what he was doing should be given the benefit of the doubt (as he should) but the person who was hit shouldn't be given any benefit of the doubt for thinking he could have been hit on purpose rather than accidentally.
    Quote Originally Posted by gogobongopop View Post
    What about taking a journalist's phone and putting it in his pocket when being faced with a picture of a child sleeping on a hospital floor?

    What a *&^%ing piece of ^%$£.
    What about it? He unexpectedly gets passed a phone, he momentarily puts it in his pocket then apologises.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    Being upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  17. #227
    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    What about it? He unexpectedly gets passed a phone, he momentarily puts it in his pocket then apologises.
    He took the phone. Watch it. He took the phone to shutdown the line of questioning. He only apologised when the journalist called him out on it.

  18. #228
    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    Video shows that Hancock's advisor was hit by a protestor who wasn't looking where he was swinging his arm. An accident but at the time probably wouldn't have realised it was an accident. Funny how the guy waving his arm about not looking what he was doing should be given the benefit of the doubt (as he should) but the person who was hit shouldn't be given any benefit of the doubt for thinking he could have been hit on purpose rather than accidentally.
    Funny how the journalists have since apologised for spreading fake news from a senior Tory source.

  19. #229
    Quote Originally Posted by gogobongopop View Post
    Funny how the journalists have since apologised for spreading fake news from a senior Tory source.
    Looks to me like a misunderstanding. Somebody was hit but it looks like it was accidental rather than on purpose. So that's cleared up, everyone can move on.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    Being upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  20. #230
    None of what you've said refutes my point in any way. It was reported as an attack. A punch. From a senior Tory source.

    Lies.

  21. #231
    Something is a lie only if it is a falsehood deliberately said knowing it is false. Tempers were high, the protestor swung his arm and did hit him, later video footage showed it to be a careless accident rather than on purpose. That should be the end of the matter, if the person who hit Hancock's colleague wants to apolgise to him then that would be big of him but otherwise it should be the end of the matter.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    Being upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  22. #232
    Tell all that to the senior Tories that ran to Peston and Kuenssberg as quickly as possible to create a new and exciting story. Perfect for distracting from Johnson's interview this morning.

    It's so transparent and pathetic. This government in a nutshell.

  23. #233
    Why do we build the wall, my children, my children? We build the wall to keep us free.
    How does the wall keep us free, my children, my children? The wall keeps out the enemy. And we build the wall to keep us free.
    Who do we call the enemy, my children, my children? The enemy is poverty. And the wall keeps out the enemy. And we build the wall to keep us free.
    That's why we build the wall. We build the wall to keep us free. Because we have and they have not, my children, my my children. Because they want what we have got.
    What do we have that they should want, my children, my children? We have a wall to work upon. We have work and they have none. And our work is never done. And the war is never won.
    The enemy is poverty, the wall keeps out the enemy, and we build the wall to keep us free. That's why we build the wall, we build the wall to keep us free.

  24. #234
    Also I'm hearing reports that Randblade grenaded a school today. I don't know if this is true or not, but what the fuck Randblade? I've told the police.

    * finger to ear mic*

    Oh, wait, no it's not true. It turns out he was graded at a school, and it wasn't today, it was years ago when he was a child. Still, just a misunderstanding that I just carelessly shared with the police and not a falsehood because I didn't know it was false. No harm to foul, eh?
    Why do we build the wall, my children, my children? We build the wall to keep us free.
    How does the wall keep us free, my children, my children? The wall keeps out the enemy. And we build the wall to keep us free.
    Who do we call the enemy, my children, my children? The enemy is poverty. And the wall keeps out the enemy. And we build the wall to keep us free.
    That's why we build the wall. We build the wall to keep us free. Because we have and they have not, my children, my my children. Because they want what we have got.
    What do we have that they should want, my children, my children? We have a wall to work upon. We have work and they have none. And our work is never done. And the war is never won.
    The enemy is poverty, the wall keeps out the enemy, and we build the wall to keep us free. That's why we build the wall, we build the wall to keep us free.

  25. #235
    Oh give over. This is not original but was nicely done and made me smile, and it will have the added side bonus that it will really piss off Hugh Grant
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    Being upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  26. #236
    Quote Originally Posted by gogobongopop View Post
    He took the phone. Watch it. He took the phone to shutdown the line of questioning. He only apologised when the journalist called him out on it.
    He was in the middle of an interview, he continued with the interview. Honestly . . .
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    Being upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  27. #237
    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    He was in the middle of an interview, he continued with the interview. Honestly . . .
    Honestly what? What have I said that's wrong?

    It's appalling behaviour from a prime minister, or any MP.

  28. #238
    To continue the interview and say he would look at it after the interview? That's pretty standard behaviour. How often have you seen an interview where the interviewee stops to stare at a phone? When prompted again he did look at it and responded.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ominous Gamer View Post
    Being upset is understandable, but be upset at yourself for poor planning, not at the world by acting like a spoiled bitch during an interview.

  29. #239
    I agree. But I don't have issue what that, as I've clearly stated and you seem to ignore.

    What's not standard behaviour is to take the journalist's phone and pocket it. You may disagree, but my perception is that he did this because a.) he lacks the emotional intelligence and empathy to process the information and respond in a manner that conforms to his script, and b.) as a result of A his only option was to try and shutdown the use of the phone as a tool the journalist was using.

    I don't believe it's behaviour we should tolerate in our leaders. You clearly disagree and that's fine. I'm not hugely interested or ever swayed by your opinion on the standards you think our politicians should adhere to.

  30. #240
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    I guess RandBlade is going to use his vote Thursday believing in the lies being peddled by De Pfeffel and cie. No doubt he will do so thinking he's a Conservative.

    I have no hope that he will be able to look at his options with an open mind. That means I also have no hope that he will make a choice which will be better for himself, England, the United Kingdom and Europe.

    I have no doubt either that soon he's going to regret the choices he made. Choices that will damage Europe, the United Kingdom, England and finally himself. The ravages of Brexit will not stop at his door.
    Last edited by Hazir; 12-10-2019 at 10:28 PM.
    Greece shows us that there is a kind of politician worse than the ones that break their election promises; the ones that keep their election promises.

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