My comment had nothing to do with safety or relative risk but of efficacy.Originally Posted by RandBlade
My comment had nothing to do with safety or relative risk but of efficacy.
"When I meet God, I am going to ask him two questions: Why relativity? And why turbulence? I really believe he will have an answer for the first." - Werner Heisenberg (maybe)
Yes and it has been shown to be efficacious.
Dept. of Public Health made an announcement this week that has (understandably) been interpreted as encouragement to hang out with people from different households, go shopping in stores, visit relatives etc. starting 3 weeks after getting the first dose of covid vaccine. People vaccinated with Vaxzevria probably constitute the largest group to which this info will apply, and it's now being deployed to less frail elderly (community-dwelling elderly > 65y)—who have received this encouragement with great excitement. Meanwhile, growing numbers of HCWs—esp. in covid hotspots, obv—are reporting that they themselves have gotten covid over a month after getting the first dose of Vaxzevria (typically ~6wks after, possibly coinciding with a particularly large vaccination drive in that group). No systematically gathered data yet, for this group. But it's a useful illustration of the dangers of prematurely loosening restrictions (ie. while number of cases remains high).
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
Second AZN jab received today.
Really really hope the side effects are easier on me this time. Got chemo scheduled for Thursday and need to be fit on the Tuesday for the pre-chemo bloods and obs check.
But that's it. Next week, for the first time in over a year, I'm going to go into a supermarket and and browse things. I will also leave with the biggest Toblerone they sell, a seriously big bag of Roast Beef Monster Munch and a large packet of chocolate hob-nobs.
Enjoy
Congratulations America
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He has a point
damn it now all I can think about is toblerone
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
Happy for you that you've got your second vaccine, enjoy heading back into the real world.
Went to a pub for the first time since the pandemic began today for a roast and a pint, while seeing my parents. Was lovely to see them again and engage with the real world again, also good to see how busy the place was considering it was outdoors only and pretty cold. Good to start to get back to normal as we put the pandemic behind us.
Bog roll. Don't forget bog roll.
Yes, does have a feeling of progressing normality here.Happy for you that you've got your second vaccine, enjoy heading back into the real world.
Went to a pub for the first time since the pandemic began today for a roast and a pint, while seeing my parents. Was lovely to see them again and engage with the real world again, also good to see how busy the place was considering it was outdoors only and pretty cold. Good to start to get back to normal as we put the pandemic behind us.
We too had a visit to my wife's parent's, in Argyll, over the weekend. Involved a flight from Gatwick up to Glasgow for us. Both airports were >90% empty, very few flights on the boards, flight itself was around a third full.
We had a medical letter granting permission for us to travel (my wife's mother is terminally ill, so dispensation is allowed). However, at no point were we asked why we were travelling nor if we had any special dispensation.
My wife and I also took a lateral-flow test at home before we traveled - results in 30 minutes - just to confirm we were covid-negative before jumping on a plane.
Gatwick Departures :
In case anyone was still uncertain about the remarkably successful life-saving nature of the Astrazeneca vaccine - or the wisdom and success of a one dose for everyone vulnerable strategy, some absolutely jaw dropping data from the UK today: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/202...d-vaccination/
Since September last year more than 74,000 people have been admitted to hospital in this country with Covid symptoms.
Of those a grand total of 32 had been vaccinated (one dose) at least 3 weeks prior.
Not 32 hundred, not 3.2%, just 32 people in total out of 74,000.
Unless there's a mistake in the data here, that is absolutely stunningly successful from one dose of either Pfizer or Astrazeneca. There should be absolutely no doubt whatsoever that getting one dose to as many people as possible works and ends the pandemic. That's an almost 100% success rate from the tens of millions of vaccines given out already.
Also no justification whatsoever for continuing domestic restrictions in this nation once we're done with the vaccine rollout. I'm disappointed how slow lifting lockdown is, but there's no justification for vaccine passports, social distancing or anything else domestically once vaccinations are done.
French Health Minister Olivier Véran: “The risk of a blood clot from flying across the Atlantic is 50 times higher than from having the AstraZeneca vaccine.”
Smart words from the Health Minister at a time that France Is reporting consistently over 30k Covid cases per day.
What a shame some unscientific antivaxxers and political idiots decided to trash the reputation of this safe and efficacious vaccine rather than listening to the scientific experts who never said to stop using it?
For shame on all those who chose to play politics over this.
Terrible images coming out of India where it seems to have gone from nowhere to OMG HOLY SHIT in a couple of weeks. Reports of cities running out of Oxygen for their hospitals.
Only just gone into Lockdown too, so it could get worse before it gets better.
The mad thing is despite not having been vaccinated yet, they were celebrating like they'd beaten this thing only a month ago. England Cricket Team were playing against India a month ago with 60,000 fans in the stadium which looked so alien for us now but is apparently normal there at the time. Worrying now.
Over 300k cases today, well over 200k yesterday. Even accounting for their much higher population, when you consider they're not testing much per capita either and the positivity rate is through the roof, this is really out of control.
Horrific indeed.
At work we have a very large representation of colleagues based in India. As of this morning 9 direct or indirect colleagues of mine have Covid. 1 is not suffering beyond mild fatigue, 8 are much more serious with some I understand on oxygen.
Many there cannot be hospitalised either, due firstly to a lack of beds, and secondly that one must present a positive Covid test result being admitted - testing is not prevalent there yet so obtaining one is a challenge. One (UK-based) colleague was telling me last night that his sister and parents (all living in India) are all assumed Covid-positive and suffering serious symptoms. The sister, while suffering herself, has been frantically trying to obtain a test for the parents so that they can be admitted to hospital.
Such is our dependence on India resources, we have one major Project on hold due to sickness, and two other major Projects at risk.
While the UK is emerging from this pandemic and there is a great sense of optimism here, this stands as a stark reminder how bloody fucking awful this disease is and how far we are from overcoming it.
Shit that sounds awful.
Just got #2.
Atta boy
Some updates from the ACIP meeting:
Number will most likely be revised upward a little as cases become more likely to be diagnosed—and as reporting begins to catch up. Most importantly, moving forward, perhaps the risk of death will be lower among these patients, with increased awareness and a very straightforward diagnostic & treatment protocol.
Simplified overview of pros and cons:
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EDIT: recommendation:
Twitter Link
Belies the complexity of the challenge irl.
Last edited by Aimless; 04-23-2021 at 10:37 PM.
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
One shot of Astrazeneca vaccine now pumping in my and my wife's bloodstreams.
Excellent! Great news, happy for you.
Fingers crossed I'm hoping won't need to wait too much longer now.
Interesting twist (needs corroboration):
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"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
According to the planning I should be able to get a first shot some time during the next three weeks. Most likely Pfizer or Moderna, since AZN has pretty much been nixed for my age group and it has been said by the man in charge of vaccination that it's likely we won't see it back in use at all overhere.
Congratulations America
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Remember, conservatives are supposed to be the smart ones
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
When the sky above us fell
We descended into hell
Into kingdom come
I have discovered that 50% is exactly one half.
And I have discovered that this 50% meme is the most useless meme of internet too.
Freedom - When people learn to embrace criticism about politicians, since politicians are just employees like you and me.
Of course patent protections should remain. If they didn't, there wouldn't be any vaccines in the first place.
Billions of vaccines are being distributed to the world's poorest by Covax, not via ending the reason we even have vaccines in the first place.
Only a drooling imbecile would say otherwise.
I'm trying to wrap my head around what's going on in India, but I simply can't.
Congratulations America
Me neither. Can't help but think that Bangladesh will be next, even with lockdown measures in place. Meanwhile, at least 4 cases of the Indian variant have been found in Sweden, but no real measures have been put into place to deal with it, so my guess is there are already many more.
I'm seeing more and more HCWs—nurses, but esp. doctors—talking openly about (or even doing) dumb shit like taking little trips to other parts of Sweden to relax and inject some luxury into their lives, meeting up in restaurants with friends, having parties at home, etc. Many of these people have received at least one dose of some vaccine, but far from all. Among people under 50 who've received two doses of any covid vaccine, I think at least 2-3/1000 have become infected more than 2 weeks after receiving their second dose, primarily among women (likely reflecting HCWs), and about the same for people 3wks after receiving 1 dose. The implication is that it might be a little irresponsible to encourage people to mingle just 3 weeks after receiving 1 dose.
My region has managed to buck the trend again, after a surge. My main ward is no longer one of the primary covid wards, and we've been able to resume our elective investigations & treatments (though always ready to switch again on short notice). The only covid patients I've come into contact with are those who've been transferred here from other regions for treatment of other conditions unrelated to covid. A good friend of mine got covid, but he's stable and at home atm.
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
A Miami school has discouraged teachers from getting the Covid vaccine, saying any vaccinated employees will be barred from interacting with students.
The Centner Academy, a fee-paying school, is located in Miami's Design District. Annual tuition begins at $15,160 (£10,898) for pre-school students and goes up to nearly $30,000 for middle school students, who are around 13-15 years old.
Co-founder Leila Centner informed parents on Monday that, when possible, the academy's policy is to not employ anyone who has received a Covid-19 vaccine at this time, CBS Miami reported.
In a letter last week to staff, first reported by the New York Times, Mrs Centner said teachers must notify the school if they had already received the jab.
"We cannot allow recently vaccinated people to be near our students until more information is known," Mrs Centner wrote.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-56905752
GB news, and I haven't seen any confirmation, but presumably from an official source:
Twitter Link
Guessing the mRNA vaccines will be similar in this respect (capacity for scaling production processes).
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
Good news, humanity is defeating the virus.
Also good news that lessons seem to have been learnt, rather than quibbling over price countries have now learnt they need to pay whatever it takes to the likes of firms like Pfizer to get this ASAP. Investment works.
A shame it took so long to learn those lessons, but they've been learnt now at least. As I've been saying, the cost of vaccines even at a vast profit for Pfizer etc is a fraction of the cost of the pandemic. Countries that tried to economise on vaccines failed, but now that they paying whatever it takes to Pfizer, the production is coming and we'll all be out of this soon.
The irony of course is that Pfizer are now charging much more for the new contracts than the ones that were haggled over last year, so the countries that stalled their contracts through excessive haggling have ended up having more deaths and more expense as well as months lost, but that's water under the bridge now. Time to just get on with it now, but that should be a very valuable lesson people need to learn for next time.
RB, I don't even disagree with your basic point all that much (though I haven't bothered to check the truth of the underlying assumptions), but the self-congratulatory and passive aggressive way in which you make it makes me want to argue with you.
"When I meet God, I am going to ask him two questions: Why relativity? And why turbulence? I really believe he will have an answer for the first." - Werner Heisenberg (maybe)
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