covid-19

[Loki]

How can you not see the connection with hot spots and public transit?

You realize that if the planet is destroyed, we're all dead, right?

[Timbuk2]

I made a thread on what we can learn form the pandemic - key items like moving away from public transit should be in the conversation when all this is over.

Not feasible. It is challenging and prohibitively expensive to commute into central city areas by car. I cannot reasonably commute to my office in London by car, nor can any of my colleagues - indeed I cannot name a single one of them that does. Many Londoners don't own a car and cannot afford one if they wanted one. My fiancée doesn't even have a drivers licence. The number of applications to obtain a drivers licence also is now decreasing year on year in the UK as the latest generation move away from car ownership as a means of transport.

Public transport is, and should be, the most viable option. More frequent and larger capacity services are desperately needed here, not less.

The 'conversation to be had when this is all over' in regard to public transport is timing of when it should be restricted in concert with other lockdown measures should other epidemics surface.

Public transport in London is one of the first things they are looking to open up as part of loosening lockdown measures, and necessarily so. You may not understand this in Texas, but here it is a necessity.

[Flixy]

A conservative interpretation of all-cause mortality in the UK suggests an excess mortality twice that indicated by the official covid death statistics, over the course of the pandemic. Over 40,000 deaths and rising—a staggering number, and a tragedy beyond words. And this estimate is already out of date! Though this approach has its limitations, it is—for the time being—the least biased approach to estimating the true covid death toll, even though it includes indirect deaths. The latest Swedish report on excess mortality is more than two weeks out of date, but even that report cast doubt on our prideful boasts of being exceptionally good at accurately identifying covid deaths. https://amp.ft.com/content/67e6a4ee-...3-e239799fa6ab

In the Netherlands excess mortality is also about double the registered covid deaths (which is also why they always include that the official numbers are likely underreporting). I think this is the case in most countries, although for example Belgium also reports suspected cases as part of the COVID deaths which makes their numbers probably closer to reality.

[Lewkowski]

Not feasible. It is challenging and prohibitively expensive to commute into central city areas by car. I cannot reasonably commute to my office in London by car, nor can any of my colleagues - indeed I cannot name a single one of them that does. Many Londoners don't own a car and cannot afford one if they wanted one. My fiancée doesn't even have a drivers licence. The number of applications to obtain a drivers licence also is now decreasing year on year in the UK as the latest generation move away from car ownership as a means of transport.

Public transport is, and should be, the most viable option. More frequent and larger capacity services are desperately needed here, not less.

The 'conversation to be had when this is all over' in regard to public transport is timing of when it should be restricted in concert with other lockdown measures should other epidemics surface.

Public transport in London is one of the first things they are looking to open up as part of loosening lockdown measures, and necessarily so. You may not understand this in Texas, but here it is a necessity.

I don't know how its funded in London. But it *should* be funded by fares 100%. If no tax dollars are going toward it then by all means keep it. But government should not be subsidizing something that will cause pandemics to be worse.

[RandBlade]

I don't know how its funded in London. But it *should* be funded by fares 100%. If no tax dollars are going toward it then by all means keep it. But government should not be subsidizing something that will cause pandemics to be worse.

I assume you have the same philosophy with roads? 100% privately funded no tax dollars at all?

[LittleFuzzy]

I don't know how its funded in London. But it *should* be funded by fares 100%. If no tax dollars are going toward it then by all means keep it. But government should not be subsidizing something that will cause pandemics to be worse.

You heard it here, folks. Public campaign financing should be for Democrats only. Since the Republicans demonstrably just make pandemics worse.

[Timbuk2]

I don't know how its funded in London. But it *should* be funded by fares 100%. If no tax dollars are going toward it then by all means keep it. But government should not be subsidizing something that will cause pandemics to be worse.

Couldn't disagree more. The government should fund infrastructure which keeps the country running, gets people to work, and supports the economy.

"Will cause pandemics to be worse" is a bizarre concept to apply. The pandemic is described as a once-in-a-century event. As I mentioned before, what we can learn from this pandemic which may be applied should another once-in-a-century pandemic happen in the next generation or many generations later, is around timing of implementation of lockdowns and the accompanying restrictions/bans on close-proximity gatherings, which includes but is not limited to public transport.

[Ominous Gamer]

Air pollution: kills 8.8 million people a year
Covid 19: 188,437 confirmed deaths

Lewk: FUCK THOSE BUSES!

[Enoch the Red]

Air pollution: kills 8.8 million people a year
Covid 19: 2.6 million confirmed deaths

Lewk: FUCK THOSE BUSES!

I think deaths should be cases.

[Ominous Gamer]

I think deaths should be cases.

Yep, copied the wrong number. Cases would be worse, 2.6 million vs ~7 billion.

[Steely Glint]

"And when Michael Gove says 'but prime ministers don't attend all Cobra meetings', I cannot recall a Cobra meeting when it was called with Blair or Brown as prime minister when the prime minister wasn't in the chair."

https://www.thenational.scot/news/18...tific-adviser/

[RandBlade]

https://www.thenational.scot/news/18...tific-adviser/

https://twitter.com/sajidjavid/statu...736644611?s=19

[Steely Glint]

So we should have governance by Twitter replies should we? Studies were not of a settled science, hence why the Lancet editor was advising people to calm down.

Of course the Lancet editor has a chequered past himself, especially standing by Dr Wakefield for far too long helping feed the antivax bullshit that has since developed. But he did belatedly renounce that it only took many years not days or weeks.

If there's doubt amongst scientists about how bad the pandemic could be, some people saying it could be very bad and others saying maybe not so much, do you think it's prudent to just assume the people saying it won't be so bad are right or do you think more of a 'hope for the best, prepare for the worst' approach would be better?

https://twitter.com/sajidjavid/statu...736644611?s=19

Saying that previous Tory prime ministers were just as irresponsible cavalier as Johnson is perhaps not the defence that you and Javid seem to think it is.

There is, however, a difference between missing a COBR meeting about the migrant crisis in Calais (as Cameron did in 2015) and one about a infectious disease which had the potential to shut down the UK economy and kill 10s of thousands.

There is also a difference between missing one such meeting and missing five of them.

[RandBlade]

If there's doubt amongst scientists about how bad the pandemic could be, some people saying it could be very bad and others saying maybe not so much, do you think it's prudent to just assume the people saying it won't be so bad are right or do you think more of a 'hope for the best, prepare for the worst' approach would be better?

I do, which is what was done. The science advisory group (SAGE) and Nervtag were called to prepare and regular meetings held to monitor the situation and prepare.

Saying that previous Tory prime ministers were just as irresponsible cavalier as Johnson is perhaps not the defence that you and Javid seem to think it is.

There is, however, a difference between missing a COBR meeting about the migrant crisis in Calais (as Cameron did in 2015) and one about a infectious disease which had the potential to shut down the UK economy and kill 10s of thousands.

There is also a difference between missing one such meeting and missing five of them.

He didn't "miss" them if he wasn't due at them. Or are you grossly negligent for not attending meetings you're not due to go to?

COBRA is just an acronym for Cabinet Office Briefing Room A. Or COBR is without the A. The PM doesn't attend most briefings, that is the Secretary of State's responsibility normally.

When did you decide we should abolish Cabinet governance and have one President responsible for everything?

[Steely Glint]

I do, which is what was done.

The fuck it was. Why do we have a shortage of PPE or testing Apparatus? We didn't we have a lockdown till near the end of March?

He didn't "miss" them if he wasn't due at them. Or are you grossly negligent for not attending meetings you're not due to go to?

Probably if there was a meeting that is directly relevant to my responsibilities, like "Is [thing Steely is responsible for] going to be completely fucked next month?" and I was like "think I'll sit this one out, chief. not coming to the next four, either. let me know how it goes, though." that might be frowned upon, yes.

COBRA is just an acronym for Cabinet Office Briefing Room A. Or COBR is without the A.

The PM doesn't attend most briefings, that is the Secretary of State's responsibility normally.

Keyword: normally.

When did you decide we should abolish Cabinet governance and have one President responsible for everything?

Might be nice to have a PM who was responsible for something.

[RandBlade]

Woah!

Twitter Link

[RandBlade]

WTI Oil now Minus $37.63 per barrel.

[GGT]

Some US states are loosening restrictions and opening up certain businesses.

https://www.npr.org/sections/coronav...-crisis-limits

Not sure how Georgia can say they're following Trump's "guidelines" for phase 1 when testing is still less than 1% of the population....and first responders still can't get the masks they need. But then, this was the Governor who acted surprised just a week ago that asymptomatic people were spreading the virus. The home of the CDC. Can't make this shit up.

[GGT]

The falling price of oil got buried. It only makes sense for the supply-side and trickle-down financiers who don't consider viral pandemics as part of their "risk analysis". Exuberant optimism (for capitalism and freee markets) is exposed as a charade, a game that's propped up by political actors and lobbyists, in favor of corporatism that benefits the top 1-10%, at the expense of everyone else.

No wonder it's so painful to admit that a virus can take down our economies, based on "conventional wisdom" that doesn't make sense. We've underfunded Public Health for decades, and turned all healthcare into Profits vs People political campaigns.

This virus is forcing us to re-evaluate our priorities and structural flaws. Long time coming. But I'm not convinced we'll make the necessary changes. It might be construed as SSSocialism, lol


Also, Sweden's per capita death rate is double the rate of its neighboring nations. Maybe they're assuming that their hospitals are better funded and supplied...or that their population is "smart" enough to follow voluntary guidelines? I don't know why they're relying on "herd immunity" when that's been debunked by epidemiologists. See the UK's similar (failed) policies.

Either way, it's crazy to compare the US healthcare system to nations with socialized health care/national health service. The US is a #1 failure.

[Steely Glint]

NHS staff already tested for coronavirus have been informed their test results might have been inaccurate, a health minister has admitted.

Helen Whately, the social care minister, told Sky News that those healthcare workers are now being offered another COVID-19 test after their initial test was deemed to have been "not up to scratch".


The Daily Telegraph reported on Wednesday that a leaked document revealed tests on thousands of NHS staff were found to be flawed.


The memo from Public Health England (PHE), dated 11 April, warned of "degraded" performance, meaning the test results are less reliable than first thought, the newspaper said.


It also said PHE testing centres have now been told to stop using existing tests by Thursday and to instead use tests supplied by commercial firms.

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavir...lawed-11976873

Fucks sake.

[Aimless]

A conservative interpretation of all-cause mortality in the UK suggests an excess mortality twice that indicated by the official covid death statistics, over the course of the pandemic. Over 40,000 deaths and rising—a staggering number, and a tragedy beyond words. And this estimate is already out of date! Though this approach has its limitations, it is—for the time being—the least biased approach to estimating the true covid death toll, even though it includes indirect deaths. The latest Swedish report on excess mortality is more than two weeks out of date, but even that report cast doubt on our prideful boasts of being exceptionally good at accurately identifying covid deaths. https://amp.ft.com/content/67e6a4ee-...3-e239799fa6ab

[RandBlade]

The idea we should move towards or against public transport permanently due to a once in a century pandemic is absurd.

I think there's mounting evidence that public transport AND high population densities are key to this virus spreading. Mapping the virus to high population densities there is a very clear overlap.

But that's true for a pandemic now. The pandemic won't last forever. Making permanent changes due to that would be as absurd as keeping a lockdown forever.

[Loki]

I'm sure he'd also support a ban on churches seeing the role they're playing in spreading this virus.

[GGT]

I'm sure he'd also support a ban on churches seeing the role they're playing in spreading this virus.

Along with prisons, nursing homes, Veteran homes, and meat processing plants. And don't forget about cruise ships, airports, and international travel.

[Aimless]

These people are getting exponentially worse:

Twitter Link

[Hazir]

Oh all the things we could scrap for the parts of the country that are in a boat with the remaining Koch brother; roads, mail delivery, phone and internet coverage, television. We could kick them right back to the middle ages. Where they psychologically should feel right at their place.

[RandBlade]

'I Teach At Oxford, But I Don’t Want It To Win The Coronavirus Vaccine Race'

This has to be one of the most abject moronic articles ever, wow: https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/ent...b6b2e5b83ba372

[Loki]

Surprising field for the professor.

[Aimless]

As much as I'm enjoying reading studies—and thought-provoking discussions about them—I can't help but feel like there's an epidemic of particularly iffy science going on, one that has snared even some otherwise exceptional scientists. All these over-hyped preprints, gah.

[RandBlade]

White parks matter.

Twitter Link

WTF?