Worker Shortage?

[Ominous Gamer]

I've been seeing these stories for a while now and the public message is finally starting to shift from "lazy workers" to "horrible employers". All those sob stories of no one wanting to work are just covers for companies who make bank forcing locations to run on skeleton crews for minimal pay.

https://www.businessinsider.com/work...ortage-2021-10

[Lewkowski]

Really depends on the labor market you are in but many places are raising their wages, and they wouldn't be doing it if they had ample employees.

[Ominous Gamer]

But that started before the pandemic and was largely contributed to it being cheaper to pay competitively than the existing cycle of training and having them move to a competitor.

[ar81]

There is shortage of workers where companies want to underpay workers.
Even in Germany you see arguments about "the jobs Germans do not want to take" and when you look closer, it is a job of almost slavery with discrimination mistreatment attached.

[wiggin]

I've been seeing these stories for a while now and the public message is finally starting to shift from "lazy workers" to "horrible employers". All those sob stories of no one wanting to work are just covers for companies who make bank forcing locations to run on skeleton crews for minimal pay.

https://www.businessinsider.com/work...ortage-2021-10

I think there are many intersecting factors at work here, most of which have been exacerbated by the pandemic but not directly caused by it. Treating it as something as black and white as either 'lazy workers' or 'horrible employers' is obviously simplistic.

The reality is that we do have extremely high levels of job openings in the current economy, and a number of places are badly shortstaffed. For every story about someone who applies to jobs and can't get an interview, you have various employers who talk about open positions for which there are no applicants. And Lewk is right that there has been a trend (accelerating lately) for lower wage work to have more generous pay provisions, mostly due to staffing pressures.

I suspect that the current labor market turmoil is related to many different factors:

- Some workers are unhappy about Covid risk due to either inadequate precautions or personal circumstances
- Some workers are unhappy about vaccine mandates or other restrictions (e.g. distancing, masking) and are staying away/leaving
- Some workers are unable to join the workforce because they are caring for children/etc. who would otherwise be in full time school but might even now be in some sort of hybrid learning - or, if they're back full time, might be leaving every few weeks for mandatory isolation/quarantines. This schedule is incompatible with many jobs, especially in person ones.
- Some workers are just fed up with crappy conditions/pay and won't be enticed back until compensation/conditions improve or their situation becomes untenable without a traditional job.
- Some workers are fed up with life in general and are leaving their jobs for something different.

The people who work in my company are paid far better than the kinds of jobs discussed in your link - even our interns make way over $15/hr, let alone FTEs. But we've still had a number of resignations during Covid - one due to the first reason listed above, and several for the last reason. My wife's company is hemorrhaging scientists, engineers, and managers. Our own recruiting has been finding a lot of people who are gainfully employed in good jobs but who are just looking for something else. The Big Quit isn't just overworked/underpaid Gen Z types, it's affecting all kinds of jobs of wildly different pay/conditions/Covid risk. Thus simply describing the phenomenon as 'lazy workers sucking from the government teat' doesn't explain the huge numbers of resignations and talent shortages at high skills jobs... but neither does 'awful bosses exploiting the little guy'.

I think the labor shortage is real, and precisely because it's real, workers at the bottom end of the income ladder have way more leverage - and can afford to tell a crappy employer to shove it. But I think the proliferation of bad boss stories is not a cause of the labor shortage, but rather a symptom of it.

[Loki]

I'm going to be joining the ranks of the lazy soon. Burnt out by the students (work ethic has plummeted to a level I would never imagine), by political interference, and general decline in positive social interactions (having to do this for a mediocre salary doesn't help). I have no doubt Covid contributed to each of those factors.

[wiggin]

Are you quitting? Moving elsewhere? Leaving the ivory tower? Whatever you end up doing, good luck!

[Steely Glint]

People deciding to change from one job to another job doesn't create a worker shortage.

[wiggin]

Actually, it does. There's friction in the labor market - it takes time for people to finish up one role and start another and get up to speed - productivity takes a real dip when you have lots of turnover in the market.

There's other things driving more the shortage, of course - we've always been running at a shortage for certain kinds of work, which is exacerbated if people take time off between roles. I haven't even touched on the effects of delayed graduation for a bunch of students who took off time from Covid, or challenges in importing talent from elsewhere in the current environment. And many large companies are ramping up production of nearly everything right now because of dramatically increased and sustained consumer demand. Then there are lots of Covid-specific shortages that have cropped up - I think I've already mentioned how my company is competing directly with Covid vaccine manufacturers for manufacturing and process development talent. They're hoovering up huge numbers of employees (and certain raw materials, equipment, etc...).

My point is that the current labor crunch is variegated and has many different causes across different regions, sectors, and skill levels. There are rarely simple stories to explain such a profound and wide-ranging issue.

[Steely Glint]

The first stories about labour shortages and companies struggling to find staff started appearing back in May, if not earlier.

[Loki]

Are you quitting? Moving elsewhere? Leaving the ivory tower? Whatever you end up doing, good luck!

Not sure if quitting is the right word in academia. But I won't be coming back for next academic year. I'd leave earlier than that, but I don't want to be homeless. Definitely leaving this location. The academic part is up in the air, but if I do remain, it won't be in a place like this. I'd definitely take a non-academic job if I was properly compensated for it. As a non-engineer, finding that kind of a job straight from academia isn't terribly easy though.

Thanks. Looking forward to a new start.

[wiggin]

The first stories about labour shortages and companies struggling to find staff started appearing back in May, if not earlier.

I'm certain that there is an implied point here, but I am unclear about what it is.

Not sure if quitting is the right word in academia. But I won't be coming back for next academic year. I'd leave earlier than that, but I don't want to be homeless. Definitely leaving this location. The academic part is up in the air, but if I do remain, it won't be in a place like this. I'd definitely take a non-academic job if I was properly compensated for it. As a non-engineer, finding that kind of a job straight from academia isn't terribly easy though.

Thanks. Looking forward to a new start.

Good luck! Academics is a really hard nut to crack, so there's no shame in deciding it's not for you - or moving to a place that's a better fit.

[Loki]

Based on numerous conversations this year, if people had an alternative, we'd be looking at a majority of non-senior people leaving (a significant, but smaller, number is leaving regardless). It really is that bad. I'm assuming it's not unique to my particular college.

[Aimless]

I'm going to be joining the ranks of the lazy soon. Burnt out by the students (work ethic has plummeted to a level I would never imagine), by political interference, and general decline in positive social interactions (having to do this for a mediocre salary doesn't help). I have no doubt Covid contributed to each of those factors.

Come to Uppsala. It sucks, but it's good.

[Loki]

Come to Uppsala. It sucks, but it's good.

I actually would, but there are no openings in my field and I doubt I could get it over some of the ridiculously hard-working Nordics.

[LittleFuzzy]

I was just reading today that the five (10?) states with the highest rate of people leaving jobs in July (last month with data fully collated) were also the ones with the highest covid infection rates at that time.

[Aimless]

I actually would, but there are no openings in my field and I doubt I could get it over some of the ridiculously hard-working Nordics.

Pfft they're not that hard-working, they're just excellent liars in all seriousness, I think there's just a very different balance here, between research (and leisure) and other demands on time and attention (teaching, bureaucracy, job-security issues, etc). It frees up a great deal of time and energy for productive work. Every time I get a glimpse of the working conditions of American academics outside STEM fields—esp. those who're in an early stage of their careers, or, at least, without tenure—it makes me wonder whether all these fantastic institutions actually want their academics to be productive or not. The whole setup seems designed to sap people of creative and intellectual energy. But I hope you find a path forward that makes you happy—and, hopefully, takes you far away from Georgia.

[Loki]

To combine the two posts above: when you realize your government is knowingly taking steps that might kill you, frequently as a show of deference to you know who, it's hard to rationalize making sacrifices for the sake of one's employer.

[Aimless]

I was just reading today that the five (10?) states with the highest rate of people leaving jobs in July (last month with data fully collated) were also the ones with the highest covid infection rates at that time.

To combine the two posts above: when you realize your government is knowingly taking steps that might kill you, frequently as a show of deference to you know who, it's hard to rationalize making sacrifices for the sake of one's employer.

Problem solved you guys:



I gotta admit I've been surprised by the extent to which colleges and unis seem to have drunk the MAGA kool-aid... I can see how many businesses may be incentivized to jeopardize their employees' lives, but I see no reasonable justification at all for this sort of nuttery in colleges and unis. What utter dingdongs.

[Loki]

Public colleges are ultimately run by officials appointed by governors or state legislatures. Those officials rarely have any educational experience and are chosen for financial contributions to the ruling party. So if the ruling party is outright hostile to universities, it makes sure the officials running the system are as well.

[Steely Glint]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...-clock-ticking

[Dreadnaught]

Based on numerous conversations this year, if people had an alternative, we'd be looking at a majority of non-senior people leaving (a significant, but smaller, number is leaving regardless). It really is that bad. I'm assuming it's not unique to my particular college.

Academia is hard

Any chance you can do consulting in your field or not really?

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...-clock-ticking

I think the Longshoremen union at the Port of Los Angeles is partly to blame here, but overall the whole system is clogged so to some extent it's hard to say this is really the fault of Amazon or the Longshoremen.

[GGT]

http://theworldforgotten.com/showthread.php?t=7893

[Loki]

Academia is hard

Any chance you can do consulting in your field or not really?

It's harder in a red-state where your employers have zero interest in your mission. As an example, student performance is an at all-time low across the board (based on an objective rubric), but this isn't even on the radar of the higher-ups.

I tried, but like in most fields, most jobs in consulting require you to have already worked in consulting. Hopefully, more will open up before I'm collecting unemployment checks.

[Loki]

See entire thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/Professors/..._in_particular

Current academia in a nutshell.

[Steely Glint]

A modern parable.

Twitter Link

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Twitter Link

[ar81]

When they say there is a worker shortage, it means they are not getting enough candidates for low pay jobs with miserable conditions.

[GGT]

See entire thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/Professors/..._in_particular

Current academia in a nutshell.

Damn, that's bleak.

But since you have a PhD in Political Science, it's kinda surprising that you didn't anticipate these (mostly political) problems years ago, when you were a TA yourself. Did the Covid Pandemic make you "woke" to all the bureaucratic red tape that turns Academia into a pain in the ass, or was it something else?

[Loki]

Most of these weren't nearly as much of a problem as long as most students at least pretended to care. The admin side is what it is.

[GGT]

Made me think of Jackson Browne's song The Pretender

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ROK1-VvOQ0