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Thread: It's been a good year for Change

  1. #1
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    Default It's been a good year for Change

    I am really surprised nobody made a topic about B.H. Obama having reached the anniversary of his occupancy of the White House. I never was a supporter of President Obama, and I still don't think too much of him. But I know quite a few people in the old CC were supporting him so I am a bit puzzled as to why it went unnoticed in this forum.

    To be honest, the last few months I have only followed the headlines with regards to American politics, so some great feat the Obama administration achieved may have eluded me. But all in all I can't really see how anybody can be happy with a White House that squandered the good will of the first year and the humongous majorities in House and Senate on doing next to nothing.

    I reckon Obama has about 2,5 years more to start actually doing something other than emergency measures for financial institutions before the elections circus starts again. And if he's really serious about not being a one-term president he really should his hands dirty and come up with some results people can believe in.
    Congratulations America

  2. #2

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Don't think he's done that bad this year. It was impossible to meet the standards set by the fanboys and it was impossible to satisfy the Obamaphobes. All in all, pretty average. The one thing I do like about the whole thing from campaign to actual presidency is that he made and stated specific goals which he can be held accountable for. Something which is severely lacking in most politicians who rather indulge in unquantifiable vague policies.
    I could have had class. I could have been a contender.
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  3. #3

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    To be honest, he's tried or suggested a lot of the stuff I feared he would...and didn't really go down any of the centrist paths that were also promised.

    I only put half the blame on the fanboys. Obama himself is the one who made tons of promises.

  4. #4

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadnaught
    I only put half the blame on the fanboys. Obama himself is the one who made tons of promises.
    You blame making specific promises on ... que?

    So, let me get this straight. Would you rather have a politician who didn't make specific promises to avoid giving his opponents ammunition whenever he can't keep one?

    http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/

    Heh, he also kept close to a ton of promises
    I could have had class. I could have been a contender.
    I could have been somebody. Instead of a bum
    Which is what I am

    I aim at the stars
    But sometimes I hit London

  5. #5

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    I didn't say the problem was specific promises, I said he made tons of promises.

  6. #6

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    When John Stewart ridicules you for his entire show and you are a democrat, something is amiss.

    Did anyone see the latest Daily Show?
    Quote Originally Posted by Aimless View Post
    It's not okay to shoot an innocent bank clerk but shooting a felon to death is commendable and do you should receive a reward rather than a punishment

  7. #7

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadnaught
    I didn't say the problem was specific promises, I said he made tons of promises.
    And this is particularly wrong because ... ?

    You only need one promise if you're going to be vague and say: "I'll endeavour to make America a better and safer place to live (applause)". It takes more promises when you're actually willing to flesh it out into specifics.
    I could have had class. I could have been a contender.
    I could have been somebody. Instead of a bum
    Which is what I am

    I aim at the stars
    But sometimes I hit London

  8. #8

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by ImAnOgre
    When John Stewart ridicules you for his entire show and you are a democrat, something is amiss.

    Did anyone see the latest Daily Show?
    Nope, not been following the last few weeks.

    And I'm guessing you're not a regular viewer since, although Jon Stewart himself is biased towards the left, the show has been ripping on Democrats and Republicans alike for years. The only Republicans he has ripped on more than anyone else is Fox News.
    I could have had class. I could have been a contender.
    I could have been somebody. Instead of a bum
    Which is what I am

    I aim at the stars
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  9. #9

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust
    Don't think he's done that bad this year. It was impossible to meet the standards set by the fanboys and it was impossible to satisfy the Obamaphobes. All in all, pretty average. The one thing I do like about the whole thing from campaign to actual presidency is that he made and stated specific goals which he can be held accountable for. Something which is severely lacking in most politicians who rather indulge in unquantifiable vague policies.
    I'm sorry but if you can't accomplish even modest goals with an overwhelming majority of Congress on your side, you really have no one to blame but yourself. But wait, prior executive experience doesn't matter, right?
    Hope is the denial of reality

  10. #10

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    I said before the primaries that my sole goal was to repudiate the disastrous policies of the Bush administration. Barring a wingnut, I was going to vote Dem for the POTUS. So I got everything I wanted.

    Also, Obama has handled the worst crisis since the Depression, one that many analysts of various credos feared would collapse the system. He also shook up health care reform, though we'll see what we get in the end. He has re-opened dialog with some of our "enemies," and applied more effective pressure on Iran that W ever did. He is rightly closing down the War That Should Never Have Been, and is trying to resolve the other war he inherited: the war that was FUBARed by W. He's doing all of this with far less of an eye to political gain that W. I'd say we came out way the **** ahead.

    And you say "nothing," Hazir? Shame on you.

    Quote Originally Posted by ImAnOgre
    When John Stewart ridicules you for his entire show and you are a democrat, something is amiss.

    Did anyone see the latest Daily Show?
    That means nothing. Did you ever see Stewart during the Clinton administration? The executive is the prime target of comedy. Period.

  11. #11

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    I.E. He mostly continued Bush's policies and talked about changing some of them. Change indeed. I especially like the "talking to our enemies" part. Remind me what results that has brought about (not that I'm against it).
    Hope is the denial of reality

  12. #12

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Loki

    I'm sorry but if you can't accomplish even modest goals with an overwhelming majority of Congress on your side, you really have no one to blame but yourself. But wait, prior executive experience doesn't matter, right?
    Democrats aren't as homogeneous as republicans. But I do wonder, what part of my post sparked that particular comment? Is this a reaction of my assessment he did pretty average?

    I have this feeling of Deja-Vu. Would it be better for you if I said: "He the most kick ass president" ever so you can get your freak on and get it out of your system.
    I could have had class. I could have been a contender.
    I could have been somebody. Instead of a bum
    Which is what I am

    I aim at the stars
    But sometimes I hit London

  13. #13

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Democrats aren't as homogeneous as republicans.
    I dunno about that: Republicans are heterogeneous as fuck.

    You've got your Small Government Pro-Business Oligarchs, who are cunts, you've got your Jesus Freak Social Regressives, who are stupid cunts, and you've got your Neo-Con War Whores, who are worthless cunts.

    I think the sterotype, though, is that Republicans are more likely to stick to the party line than Democrats.
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  14. #14

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Loki
    I'm sorry but if you can't accomplish even modest goals with an overwhelming majority of Congress on your side, you really have no one to blame but yourself.
    But he doesn't have an overwhelming majority of Congress on his side. Congress has an overwhelming majority of Democrats. If in your world it logically follows that all Democrats are going to agree with Obama all the time on all positions because Obama too is a Democrat then it must follow that you and I agree on all positions because we're both former members of Atari CC, and current members of TWF.
    . . .

  15. #15
    Senior Member Flixy's Avatar
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    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by '
    ['ear]I said before the primaries that my sole goal was to repudiate the disastrous policies of the Bush administration. Barring a wingnut, I was going to vote Dem for the POTUS. So I got everything I wanted.

    Also, Obama has handled the worst crisis since the Depression, one that many analysts of various credos feared would collapse the system. He also shook up health care reform, though we'll see what we get in the end. He has re-opened dialog with some of our "enemies," and applied more effective pressure on Iran that W ever did. He is rightly closing down the War That Should Never Have Been, and is trying to resolve the other war he inherited: the war that was FUBARed by W. He's doing all of this with far less of an eye to political gain that W. I'd say we came out way the **** ahead.

    And you say "nothing," Hazir? Shame on you.

    The war in Iraq, he didn't really do much there, the surge which drastically decreased the violence started under W. Both Iraq and Afghanistan he basically continued the policies as he inherited them, not much change (not saying that is a bad thing).

    And it doesn't look like relations have improved with either Iran or North Korea.
    Keep on keepin' the beat alive!

  16. #16

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Flixy
    And it doesn't look like relations have improved with either Iran or North Korea.
    We can't really improve relations with countries who are more interested in preserving their leaders iron grip on control of the populace, and whose leaders would rather engage in pissing matches than diplomacy.
    . . .

  17. #17
    Senior Member Flixy's Avatar
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    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Illusions

    We can't really improve relations with countries who are more interested in preserving their leaders iron grip on control of the populace, and whose leaders would rather engage in pissing matches than diplomacy.
    Hey, Tear claimed 'effective' pressure against Iran..
    Keep on keepin' the beat alive!

  18. #18

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Flixy
    Hey, Tear claimed 'effective' pressure against Iran..
    What results would lead him to believe this? Last I've heard they still use deadly force to quell protests, or even whispers of protest against the current government or the Ayatollah, and its not like Ahmadinejad has stepped down or anything.
    . . .

  19. #19
    Senior Member Flixy's Avatar
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    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Illusions

    What results would lead him to believe this? Last I've heard they still use deadly force to quell protests, or even whispers of protest against the current government or the Ayatollah, and its not like Ahmadinejad has stepped down or anything.
    That is exactly what I wanted to know
    Keep on keepin' the beat alive!

  20. #20

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Flixy
    [The war in Iraq, he didn't really do much there, the surge which drastically decreased the violence started under W. Both Iraq and Afghanistan he basically continued the policies as he inherited them, not much change (not saying that is a bad thing).
    His policy in Afghanistan is quite different, and he's no longer sweeping it under the rug.

    And it doesn't look like relations have improved with either Iran or North Korea.
    Actually, relations with Russia have warmed, Obama has cut the preposterous missile defense system in eastern european countries that drove Russia nuts, and Russia will likely reciprocate by supporting increased pressure on Iran. Just watch.

    A benefit of not walking around pounding your chest to prove how tough you are. Like Bush Sr. compared to Reagan,

    Best possible Iran policy thus far is to bring Russia and China closer. China will be different, but I'm betting that some economic pressure will be effective.

    In contrast, Iran is a concern mainly BECAUSE of W. He removed the main counter-balance in the region.

  21. #21

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Ziggy, where's the Obameter? Come on man.
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  22. #22

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by EyeKhan
    Ziggy, where's the Obameter? Come on man.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust
    You blame making specific promises on ... que?

    So, let me get this straight. Would you rather have a politician who didn't make specific promises to avoid giving his opponents ammunition whenever he can't keep one?

    http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/

    Heh, he also kept close to a ton of promises
    Keep up will you, I do hate to repeat myself.

    I could have had class. I could have been a contender.
    I could have been somebody. Instead of a bum
    Which is what I am

    I aim at the stars
    But sometimes I hit London

  23. #23

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    I could have had class. I could have been a contender.
    I could have been somebody. Instead of a bum
    Which is what I am

    I aim at the stars
    But sometimes I hit London

  24. #24

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Illusions
    But he doesn't have an overwhelming majority of Congress on his side. Congress has an overwhelming majority of Democrats. If in your world it logically follows that all Democrats are going to agree with Obama all the time on all positions because Obama too is a Democrat then it must follow that you and I agree on all positions because we're both former members of Atari CC, and current members of TWF.
    This is as good as any president has had it in the last several decades. Again, what's the excuse? Most recent presidents not only didn't have 60% of the Senate on their side, they usually had to deal with the other party controlling Congress. In fact, the last president to have 60% of the Senate from their own party was Carter - another great president.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  25. #25

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Loki
    This is as good as any president has had it in the last several decades. Again, what's the excuse?
    Some of the proposed changes are highly controversial.
    . . .

  26. #26

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Illusions
    Some of the proposed changes are highly controversial.
    A) You mean like Bush's massive tax cut? Iraq war? Or Clinton's allowing China into the WTO or NAFTA? Or Bush Sr.'s tax increase? Or Reagan's social security reform? Every president deals with highly controversial issues.

    B) If Obama actually had some relevant experience, he'd focus more on policies he can actually get implemented.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  27. #27
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    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Loki

    A) You mean like Bush's massive tax cut? Iraq war? Or Clinton's allowing China into the WTO or NAFTA? Or Bush Sr.'s tax increase? Or Reagan's social security reform? Every president deals with highly controversial issues.

    B) If Obama actually had some relevant experience, he'd focus more on policies he can actually get implemented.
    I still can't help but thinking that Hillary might have meant a little bit less 'Change' but a whole lot more results.
    Congratulations America

  28. #28

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Hazir
    I still can't help but thinking that Hillary might have meant a little bit less 'Change' but a whole lot more results.
    Probably. I would imagine she'd make an average president.
    Hope is the denial of reality

  29. #29

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust

    Keep up will you, I do hate to repeat myself.

    You should post it like you did in CC so we can all see it without even trying.
    The Rules
    Copper- behave toward others to elicit treatment you would like (the manipulative rule)
    Gold- treat others how you would like them to treat you (the self regard rule)
    Platinum - treat others the way they would like to be treated (the PC rule)

  30. #30

    Default Re: It's been a good year for Change

    If keeping things from getting worse is enough, then yeah, he's done okay. His accomplishments are lacking, though. With the republicans winning the Mass. seat, he might get something done. The loss might unite the remaining democrats into a frenzy of agreement, and a quagmire of energized republicans.
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