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What is the point? I had more then one source for the information & you agree with the main premise!Quote:
Originally Posted by ']['ear
Bigger question being what sources will you find acceptable? What sources do you declare are impartial and unbiased?
The BIGGER question is really what does Michigan do moving forward? Detroit as a city is dead. It's not the hub of automobile engineering or commerce that it used to be, but plenty of folks want to re-invigorate the state. It's really quite a great state, full of natural beauty and positioned nicely around the Great Lakes, and Canada.
There was a thing on the History channel the other night about Michigan and Ohio, trading the upper peninsula for Toledo when making state boundaries, trying to anticipate which had more value in land or port activity. Some said that's the reason for continued animosity in sports between Michigan State and Ohio State. :haha:
Because the point keeps resurfacing. You routinely cite professional liars.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lewkowski
Pretty much anybody who strives to get the facts right. Fact is that none of the sources you cited do so, and in fact each is guilty of intentionally get the facts WRONG in cases where this is no ambiguity.Quote:
Bigger question being what sources will you find acceptable? What sources do you declare are impartial and unbiased?
Did you see this article choobie?
http://money.cnn.com/2010/09/22/news...tune/index.htmQuote:
Outsourcing turns from Rio and Bangalore to . . . Detroit?
By Doron Levin, contributorSeptember 22, 2010: 1:10 PM ET
FORTUNE -- The downtown business district of Detroit, Michigan contains precious few beacons of economic optimism these days amid the empty office buildings, vacant lots and unsold condos.
One notable and unlikely bright spot is Somerset, New Jersey-based GalaxE.Solutions. The firm opened its doors a few months ago in a near-empty office tower with a promise by its chief executive officer to hire 500 workers from Detroit over the next five years. Only the landing of a flying saucer might have been more unexpected.
Tim Bryan, who founded and runs GalaxE, is a CEO on a mission to lower the costs of the proprietary software his company builds for some of the nation's biggest corporations. So far he's moved some of his operations to Bangalore and Hyderabad, India; and he has considered Brazil for hiring software talent at the lowest price.
But here's the rub: some of GalaxE's clients specify that their software must be written and maintained in the U.S. "I looked in Newark, I looked in Camden, N.J., I looked in Trenton, in Cleveland, in West Virginia," said Bryan. "I chose Detroit, and I really love the place."
For Bryan, the implosion and restructuring of the U.S. auto industry translates into cheaply priced office space plus an abundance of information technology professionals who can't move to where the jobs are because the value of their houses is under water. His company, which employs 900 worldwide, is projected to more than double in size over the next five years, he said, its growth fueled partly by demand for proprietary software systems that manage health-care, including reimbursement, records and emerging skills such gene mapping.
"For a young IT pro I look around and see low-cost housing, sports teams, casinos, bars and restaurants," he said. "It hearkens to my memory of being a young person in New York City -- the world is your oyster."
Bryan acknowledged that the expected political earthquake on Nov. 2 could have repercussions for new health care legislation, including possible revision. "Certain portions of the genie aren't going back in the bottle," he said. "Universal coverage may be difficult to undo."
So far GalaxE has hired 40 people in Detroit and has openings for 100. The company occupies a three floors in a sparsely-occupied office building, paying $14 a square foot for space compared with $17.25 a square foot in Somerset. A typical IT worker who receives $63,000 in salary in Detroit would earn more than $79,000 in Somerset, according to information provided by the company.
To sweeten GalaxE's move, the state of Michigan is providing more than $5 million in state and local tax incentives over the next five years.
A few blocks south of GalaxE sits the General Motors Co. headquarters on the Detroit River, home to the largest U.S. automaker, which is operating with financial assistance from the U.S. until the government can sell its stake. "In my lifetime no one actually expected GM to go into bankruptcy," Bryan said. "As GM and the auto industry got into trouble the distress of Detroit was understated. It got lost."
Bryan said he hopes to form a partnerships with local community colleges that will lead to training programs to provide future IT workers for his firm and others like it. "All I've heard is about how half the college graduates are leaving Michigan. We've got to do something to stop that."
Cool.
I don't know how much control the state government exercises over the school districts. I know that before recently the only class a high school kid had to take was government. After that they could fill up their days with basket weaving (now there are minimum math and English requirments, and if I'm not mistaken there's even a language requirement!) I know that before the last 10 years or so there was no state wide testing and no porficiency exam for graduation. I do know that the way grade levels are divided up are different from community to community. I know some communities have requirements like a disclaimer that evolution is just a theory in their highschool biology classes but some do not. And from there, back to where all this started with Loki's quick and dirty explanation for why Michigan is having economic problems, I have yet to see anything that indicates MI's secondary schools are by and large worse than any state without a fucked up economy. (Though, I'm sure we're worse than some and better than others). And from there I don't see any basis for saying the state's economy is bad because of the quality of the secondary schools. His posts were totally unsupported - because they were right off the top of his head - and don't make a lot of sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleFuzzy
http://money.cnn.com/video/news/2010...sert.cnnmoney/
ASSIGNMENT: DETROIT
Eleven videos to watch. From its food crisis to developing small businesses, and revitalizing neighborhoods.
What? Poppy Harlow?
I thought you (and others) might be interested in the series on Detroit. Not the journalist's name. :coffee:
Oh. I guess I missed the intro you wrote to that link. :oQuote:
Originally Posted by GGT
So it shouldn't be difficult to name one.Quote:
Originally Posted by ']['ear
And I'm not playing your little games. You'll keep spewing your propaganda.
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Originally Posted by Lewkowski
You two are so cute. Out of context, this exchange has been like the opening scene of a romantic comedy where the two love interests meet and hate each other, then end up making angry love half-way into the film. :fart:Quote:
Originally Posted by ']['ear
Thanks a lot, Chacha.Quote:
Originally Posted by EyeKhan
Of course, getting laid would probably help both of them out a lot, so it might as well be together.
We're both married, Lolli. I can't speak for Lewk's nookie levels, but mine are A-Okay.
Mmmhmmm.
I have always sworn I would never said this, but...
Pics or it didn't happen.
Right-o. Just disregarded everything you've ever said about yourself.
Along this time I'm picturing a sexless spinster. :p
That's me.
I'm totally saving myself for marriage - I just never said whose. ;)
Heh. I LOLed
Good.
I think you need to LOL more.
Depends. Is this the forum of light banter and straw men? It has that appearance.
That's a good point - but I am blaming Chacha for my misbehavior in this thread. He just gave me this image that I can't seem to get rid of.
A roundabout way of answering. Yes, I have fun here. I am intrigued here, amused here, confounded here and angered here. I feel comfortable in expressing all of these. For now.
You just seem, to me, to be angry more often than anything else. I guess you know what you are looking for, though.
I think there's a lot of BS here, at least from some people. I don't feel like pretending it isn't there.
It's just less than entertaining for the people stuck watching, you know.
And I'm sure you only exist for my amusement.
Actually, I think some people love it. Fuzzy didn't come in to say his piece. He came in to bait me to say more. Transparent trolling, can't honestly be construed as anything but. Maybe he wanted fireworks, or maybe he wanted to facilitate my self-destruction because he doesn't like me. Does it matter? Rules is rules. He's not abiding by them in the very limited way that Wraith has ever talked about it. It's like voters agreed that there needed to be some law changes, kicked around some ideas in the public venues, then were never notiied of what the actual new laws were. Bad idea.
Just like the Chaloobi thing. I said my piece, and it was unpleasant but defensible. He went ape shit, and I argued with him. Rise and repeat. Was I wrong? Was Chaloobi? Both? I think I have the right to voice a reasonable opinion, even if it is unpleasant. Something bigoted would be unreasonable. Expressing concern, even judging, Subject X is something that one should be able to do in a forum like this. Or maybe not: maybe we will sanitize the forum such that nothing unpleasant gets said. But I lurked for a few days before resuming posting. Other people were being too aggressive or too personal.
And no, I'm not trying to raise hell by bringing it up. I just want to have a reasonable discussion about what is reasonable. I think my pursuit of the issue with Wraith was. If you aren't going to be transparent, just permaban me Wraith. Because I'm not going to tolerate you high-handedness and secretiveness.
But I'll say something further: I think there are different ways of playing the TWF/CC forum. For some it is literally a game (yes, they have been revealed referring to it as such, in what I think is all earnestness). Others view it as a place to air and argue their opinions. But I'll honestly say that a couple of people, and I won't name names, will do what they can to get me to be ruled wrong, all to score those points. It's all about points for them, baby. Maybe it's to come out ahead in their game, or maybe it's to further their own agendas by invalidating mine and any plausible arguments I might make by association. That's how I see it. Those with points to score will call it "lawyering." Or maybe some will say I'm paranoid. Well, there's no paranoia elsewhere in my life; nobody is "out to get me." I just smell some stink here. If I can't fit in, so be it.
You bully people Tear. You are belligerent, you pick fights, and you smear them. You get quite nasty when things get going. And you explained why in that goodbye thread. You're in an unfortunate position, a miserable position, and you NEED to vent the feelings that creates. I understand that, and I sympathize. But that doesn't make the way you treat people here right, Tear. We are not your punching bags. You don't want to direct that ugliness at anyone in "real life"tm, but you have no right to force it on us in their stead. I used to be able to carry on an extended debate with you, but I haven't been able to do that for a while, I have to keep disengaging because the only choices available are to fall quiet or tacitly accept the role you selfishly want to force on me. But I can't stay quiet because that is effectively letting you silence me, just another manifestation of bullying, and it would go against that promise I made to myself to not let others silence again, after my freshman year of college.
"It's not paranoia if people really are out to get me"? Okay, big boy, good luck with that.Quote:
Originally Posted by ']['ear
How many threads hijacked into discussing how crazy ']['ear is this week? 3, 4?
I was trying to hijack it for much better purposes. :downcast:
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Originally Posted by littlelolligagged
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Originally Posted by ']['ear
Christ. Get a fuckin' (chat) room why don't you. You're pollutin' my thread with yer fucked up fire mission. Shit. :mad:Quote:
Originally Posted by littlelolligagged
Also -regarding this:
I can't think of a better <sniff> compliment. <wipes tear>Quote:
Originally Posted by littlelolligagged
(Oh! Another image!) :D
O FOR FUCK'S SAKE TEAR. WHY? THINGS WERE GOING SO GOOD THESE LONG WEEKS. WHY?????Quote:
Originally Posted by ']['ear