UK Election: 6 May 2010

[Timbuk2]

'Microphone still switched on' political gaffes are nothing new, and I don't recall them ever having consequences of any note.

Dubya had one where he whispered something to an aide about a reporter he didn't like - insulted him. People just accepted it with a wry smile and moved on.

Plus, politicians reacting realistically, just as any man on the street might, makes them seem more human. When Two Jags Prescott punched that man who'd thrown an egg at him, his popularity actually rose.

What I didn't particularly like about this case was Brown's fawning, grovelling apologies and rather pathetic excuses. I'd appreciate him more if he'd said simply that he didn't realise his microphone was still on, and made no further comment on the matter.

[GGT]

This is a big fucking deal - Biden

Live mic problems are nothing new around here, but I was under the impression it's not common in the UK. Brown was supposed to mingle with "common folk" to improve his image, and the final debate is soon so.....

Two Jags Prescott? Well pip pip what a name!

[RandBlade]

Isn't the fact that he's a complete failure as a PM enough reason for him to loose already?

You'd hope so.

I don't get it. Could a British person explain this to us? Is this an issue of you can't call someone a bigot if they're a woman or a minority, or an issue of "if you disagree with me, you're bigot" on Brown's part?

I think its more a case of being a two-faced hypocrite and insulting your own supporters isn't a good idea 8 days before the election. Plus it kind of backs up a lot of gossip and rumours about the nasty nature of Brown. To me (as someone intersted in politics) I thought the interesting part caught on mic wasn't his insult but the fact he immediately was seeking someone to blame - his aide Sue Nye. Again backing up the gossip that in Brown's world its always the women's fault.

But for the public I think the damning part is that (A) what she said wasn't that extreme, kind of normal for 'white working class' people of that generation and (B) she is/was a lifelong Labour supporter and while he drove off saying that she was telling the news journalists how happy she was to have met her Prime Minister/party leader and she'd be voting Labour again, always does.

She represents his typical supporter and he insulted her. Not clever.

'Microphone still switched on' political gaffes are nothing new, and I don't recall them ever having consequences of any note.

Dubya had one where he whispered something to an aide about a reporter he didn't like - insulted him. People just accepted it with a wry smile and moved on.

Yes, but I suspect the difference is that reported wasn't about to vote for him, nor did he represent Dubya's typical supporters.

It'd be more comparable if Dubya had been caught on mic attacking "redneck bible-bashers"

Plus, politicians reacting realistically, just as any man on the street might, makes them seem more human. When Two Jags Prescott punched that man who'd thrown an egg at him, his popularity actually rose.

Again, he was reacting to a protestor, not a lifelong supporter.

What I didn't particularly like about this case was Brown's fawning, grovelling apologies and rather pathetic excuses. I'd appreciate him more if he'd said simply that he didn't realise his microphone was still on, and made no further comment on the matter.

Indeed. The fact that his apologies were so fake didn't help, that awful grin afterwards on her doorstep made it seem like he thought it was a joke (he might, but he shouldn't portray that while apologising).

Had this been an opponent of Brown's I don't think there'd have been such a big deal. The fact that she's a lifelong supporter is the killer, the fact that she represents the bulk of his supporters is the killer. Most voters are elderly and she represents the typical Labour voter of that generation and he insulted her. Not smart at all.

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One of my grandfather's is a lifelong Labour supporter, who's been a bit disillusioned with Labour but still likely to have voted for them. He would have agreed with everything that grandmother said and it would not surprise me one jot if yesterday was the final nail in the coffin and he casts a protest vote for Lib-Dem/UKIP instead. Yes they're kind of opposites but he'd never be seen dead voting Tory. There are going to be a lot of elderly people who are Labour supporters who will have been offended by Brown yesterday.

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He's also known as "Two Shags Prescott"

[Timbuk2]

There are going to be a lot of elderly people who are Labour supporters who will have been offended by Brown yesterday.

On this I suspect you're right.

He's also known as "Two Shags Prescott"

And after the incident I alluded to the headlines ran "Two Fists Prescott"

[CitizenCain]

Had this been an opponent of Brown's I don't think there'd have been such a big deal. The fact that she's a lifelong supporter is the killer, the fact that she represents the bulk of his supporters is the killer. Most voters are elderly and she represents the typical Labour voter of that generation and he insulted her. Not smart at all.

So, the real problem here is that the bulk of his supporters are bigots, if I'm reading you correctly.

Enh. Democracy - probably only a good idea for populations that have gone through eugenics.

[RandBlade]

So, the real problem here is that the bulk of his supporters are bigots, if I'm reading you correctly..

Yes.

Although what she said wasn't really that bigotted if you watch the full video anyway. I disagree with her, unsurprisingly, but wouldn't have called her that.

Funny video from blogger Guido Fawkes, combining Labour's 3 big stunts/stories this week: The Celebrity endorsement (Elvis impersonator), bigotgate and in-between the two Peppa Pig (Peppa was supposed to endorse them too until the creators of Peppa Pig said no she's not )

[GGT]

Peppa Pig? Maybe Piglet or Pippy Longstocking are available?

Seriously, you guys are looking more and more like the US with our tabloid and twittering. What he said really wasn't that bad, but his blaming the aide immediately struck me as....what's the word....cheeky?

[Timbuk2]

but his blaming the aide immediately struck me as....what's the word....cheeky?

Dishonest? Weak? Buck-passing? Spineless? Take your pick.

[Steely Glint]

Now we know why Blair fought so hard to prevent Brown taking over as leader for as long as possible.

[Timbuk2]

Hmmm ... wonder whether Blair's rubbing his hands in glee at all this ...

[Steely Glint]

I doubt it.

[Timbuk2]

On a personal level - it wouldn't surprise me. Brown's eagerness to ascend to the throne caused more than a little personal discomfort for Blair. Some would say he was stabbed in the back.

From a Labour party point of view, no, I doubt he's too chuffed with Brown's shenanigans.

[RandBlade]

Brown looks like he's going to take Blair's 3-time winning party and take it instead into third place at the election. On a party level I can't imagine he's happy at all, on a personal level I bet he can't help but laugh.

"I told you so" are sometimes the four most pleasurable words in the world

[Steely Glint]

To be fair, Labour is heading for third place because of the Lib Dem surge, and the Lib Dem surge is more to do with Clegg doing well in the first debate than Brown's incompetence.

[RandBlade]

I think its a bit of both Steely. If Brown was semi-decent then his support should have stayed up more.

Even without the debates quite a lot of the pre-debate polls had the LD's almost or even at the same level as Labour.

[Timbuk2]

I just wish I could be a bit more at ease with voting for the LDs. Their anti-nuclear-power policy is really grating me.

[Steely Glint]

That's why I want a Tory-Lib coalition which where I can pick and chose the policies I want from both parties. Sadly, as I live in a very safe Labour seat I will have no say in any of these things.

[RandBlade]

That's why I want a Tory-Lib coalition which where I can pick and chose the policies I want from both parties. Sadly, as I live in a very safe Labour seat I will have no say in any of these things.

If we could get the best bits of those two even I'd support that! Problem is I'd be concerned you'd end up with the lowest common denominator instead. My ideal election result would be a Tory majority, a decent sized Lib-Dem opposition to hold them honest, Labour consigned to third-place.

From the third debate, I'm biased but I thought that was Cameron's best performance by far; Clegg I found good in the first two, but I found a bit "meh" today - neither positive nor negative; Brown is well and truly a disgraceful horrid man and it was very good to see today him being thoroughly attacked on what is his weakest not strongest front: the economy. He's been an awful Chancellor and PM and we should hopefully be well shot of him in just 8 days time.

[Steely Glint]

This was the first one I actually watched. I though Clegg was ahead for the first half, up until immigration, it was much more even for the rest. Brown was utter shit for the first half, but did a bit better towards the end - still very much finished third though.

[RandBlade]

YouGov poll on who won the debate: Cameron 41%, Clegg 32% and Brown 25%

Would be very good if that was the shares for each party next Thursday

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Ironically the one issue I agree with Clegg is immigration, I believe in free migration and would be OK with an amnesty but bizarrely Clegg said this wasn't his policy and there'd be no amnesty - it is their policy and he's defended it quite well at the last 2 debates. Would have been better if he'd defended his policy again rather than suddenly pretend its not his policy

[Loki]

I think its actually only a massive deal in the political arena. Most people know that everyone is different in public and in private. Still, this might lose him the election.

Anyway, he must hear 300000 retards every day saying essentialy the same thing - "why are all these darkies/muslims/poles in my area, blah blah blah?" Whenever anyone says that to me (e.g. taxi drivers), i immediately begin to suspect them of being racist as well. Its not usually long before they hit me with a "taking our jobs and our women".

He hasn't fallen at all in the polls, so I somehow I doubt it.

To be fair, Labour is heading for third place because of the Lib Dem surge, and the Lib Dem surge is more to do with Clegg doing well in the first debate than Brown's incompetence.

Even if Labour finishes third in total votes, they'll finish second in seats, potentially even having a plurality. You have a nice political system.

[GGT]

I hope to watch the third one in replay on CSPAN or something. Mostly to watch Brown with this new-found media coverage. That's kind of like cheating but whatever.

Besides noticing his tic and very uncomfortable behavior on camera, his words didn't "transcend" anything at all. He just comes across as bloated and puffy, and out of touch. Frustrated with "the regular folk", dissing them behind their backs but trying to use them for points. Made me wonder if he's genuine but uncomfortable in media, or if he's all puff 'n stuff relying on "handlers", like a puppet.

Television can work both ways, and it's not wise to vote based on telegenics, but Brown just seemed...smelly. He looks like he wants to let a big fart rip in the right company, then tell them either he didn't fart, or he passed gas (excuse me), or now didn't that smell like roses? No laughing or sniggering. Among friends for crying out loud.

[RandBlade]

He doesn't have much further to fall in the polls, even Foot with his "longest suicide note in history" polled better than Brown is polling right now! He's down to his core vote and insulting his core vote - the only people supporting him - isn't the best idea. Will they bother to vote next Thursday now?

Interestingly Brown did rather well for him last week - but he was awful tonight in the final debate. Looked quite demoralised a lot and virtually apologised for yesterday again in his opening statement. Having to apologise in the introduction to a debate is hardly the best start he could have got!

[Steely Glint]

Even if Labour finishes third in total votes, they'll finish second in seats, potentially even having a plurality. You have a nice political system.

No, but at least it produces 'decisive results' even they're increasingly unrelated to the way people actually cast their votes. Shit, I thought the electoral college was bad.

[Loki]

No, but at least it produces 'decisive results' even they're increasingly unrelated to the way people actually cast their votes. Shit, I thought the electoral college was bad.

The main problem with the Lib Dems is they have no natural base. The Tories do well in south England, and Labour in north England and Scotland. The Lib Dems just end up finishing second everywhere.

[Steely Glint]

But at least it's decisive. That's the main thing.

[Loki]

The way things are looking, you will probably end up with a hung parliament

[Steely Glint]

no but, loki, right

apart from that

decisive

[Loki]

Is there any particular reason you have 650 MPs by the way? That's about 7 times more representation per capita than the US.

[Steely Glint]

it's because britain is 7 times more democratic than america