Covert Steam network access.Originally Posted by Khendraja'aro
Have your "hearing needs" been satisfied?
Covert Steam network access.
Have your "hearing needs" been satisfied?
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-- Thomas Jefferson: American Founding Father, clairvoyant and seditious traitor.
Throw me in with the nuke people. Got the 7 stars and while going for the 8th the princess nuked the screen for a second cause I got to close.
What exactly is covert about internet access of a program which clearly states that it needs internet access to work?
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
The fact that it periodically phones home (when not authorizing games) to check on whether or not your account's been banned and/or decide whether to erase all the games purchased on Steam from your hard drive. Sounds a lot like a trojan/virus to me... and at least the Mellisa virus only deleted some crappy DOS/Windows file, and not all your games.
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-- Thomas Jefferson: American Founding Father, clairvoyant and seditious traitor.
I think you may need to look up the definition of "virus" and "trojan" - you're once again confused on the meaning of things. The TOS of Steam is for all the world to see. Hardly anything "covert" about it.The fact that it periodically phones home (when not authorizing games) to check on whether or not your account's been banned and/or decide whether to erase all the games purchased on Steam from your hard drive. Sounds a lot like a trojan/virus to me... and at least the Mellisa virus only deleted some crappy DOS/Windows file, and not all your games.
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
I absolutely hated Steam for the first few years, but they really improved it a lot between 05-06 after the colossal failure that was Half Life 2's mandatory installation of a buggy, annoying and intrusive early version. Now I buy most of my PC games through it, it's really developed into a nice digital distribution platform. And I'll definitely be releasing my games through it, it's a godsend for indies.
ANYWAY...
Now that I'm going to be installing Windows 7 this coming week I'll finally get a chance to check out Just Cause 2, I've been hearing good things about it but it doesn't look like a game I'd want to get for my 360.
Yeah, they're being real open and up front about it by burying those little details in 15,000 words of legalese that they know no one will ever read all the way through.
Still no Linux support, though... is there?
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-- Thomas Jefferson: American Founding Father, clairvoyant and seditious traitor.
Later this summer. Of course that's probably Valve Time.
If you can't be bothered to read it, that's not Steam's problem.
I had much fun explaining to people like you why their cable service would be restored only after the weekend and, no, that's not a breach of contract and, no, the cable company is not liable if someone else cuts the cable in their frontyard.
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
Legally? No
PR/Ethically? Of course
EULA is unread legalese, anything in there is not 'up front'. Do you read 100% of all your softwares EULAs?
I read Steam's TOS and it's actually not too byzantine.
And what do you propose as an alternative?
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
Valve has always been up front about how Steam works, CS for something like this would demand it. The EULA is also around 5100 words, not some retarded 15,000 like already claimed.
Steam even makes you agree to a 2nd blurb every time you make a purchase, and its not like its hard to find the "oh no, Valve stole my games!" clause:
Hidden under the, now get this, the ONLINE CONDUCT, CHEATING AND ILLEGAL BEHAVIOR subheading.Valve may terminate your Account or a particular Subscription for any conduct or activity that Valve believes is illegal, constitutes a Cheat, or which otherwise negatively affects the enjoyment of Steam by other Subscribers.
Anything extreme/unusual should be clearly visible outside of the EULA. EG on the packaging of a game that requires internet activation/constant internet connection it says so on the packaging. Not buried within the EULA.
Steam games already have an internet activation warning on the boxes of the few physical discs games they publish
Hell, even shit companies like EA do that.
Yes, they have an activation warning, I've never seen a "your game could be deleted if you cheat" warning. Which kind of backs up Cain's point.
Well, that goes without saying. Any internet related software has a clause which states that if they catch you trying to manipulate the software, you'll be banned from the service. That's nothing new there.
And let's face it: The only way you can "cheat" with games like, say, Braid distributed over Steam is if you try to activate the game without actually buying it. I dare say that banning you from Steam altogether is justified in this case. And if you're caught using wallhacks in CS:S, then they're perfectly justified in banning you from using CS:S as well.
Are you new to this internet thing or why do they have to spell that out for you?
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
Or if you're an abusive asshole in online gaming chat, even.
Frankly, for how many people act like retarded 13 year olds online (99.99%+), I'm not even opposed to the idea of nuking someone's game for being too obnoxious, but they should at least be upfront about it. and like you said, burying it in an EULA no one reads doesn't qualify.
Anyway, if you wanna keep on arguing with the Steam fanbois, go crazy. When you get tired of it, let me know - I've got a brick wall you could give the same treatment to.
Because a ban (from the central online serves) is the same as deleting software you've paid for.
Stop being such an incredible retard, please.
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-- Thomas Jefferson: American Founding Father, clairvoyant and seditious traitor.
So, what do you propose in the case of a Wallhacking, Aimbotting CS:S player? Or what do you propose in the case of a Botting and TeleportHacking player in WoW? What do you propose in the case of someone Duping in Everquest? What do you propose in the case of someone activating/decrypting a Steam game he actually did not buy?
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
Do we have any verifiable accounts of Valve deleting an entire account (not disabling or banning it) for only cheating? I've never seen Valve go that far. In fact in their last sweep they gave extra items to the legit TF2 players, and didn't mess with the cheaters' accounts. Valve didn't even ban the accounts of users who used grey MW2 activation keys.
The whole, "I wasn't warned I couldn't act like a dumbass", argument is stupid. You're claiming that you entered a public area in a place of business, and acted in such a way that would have legally resulted in a trespress; resulting in a loss of supplied services. Yet you want to bitch that the business didn't supply a large enough warning on the front door not to act like a dumbass? Even the locos we ban from the library know that won't work.
Last edited by Ominous Gamer; 05-17-2010 at 01:37 PM.
Banning them from online play on the central servers? As has been the tried-and-true punishment since online gaming began.
Billions of dollars in profits?
Come to think of it, Razor1911 should sue Rockstar and Valve for IP infringement and violating the DMCA.
There have been reports of that... but given Valve's policy of lock/deleting threads and banning users with deleted accounts from their forums, it's kinda hard to get verification either way.
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-- Thomas Jefferson: American Founding Father, clairvoyant and seditious traitor.
So you have nothing, because we all know that the Valve forums are the only forum for online expression and grievance airing.
Are you trying to be a massive retard, or just succeeding accidentally?
I assume a Steam user like yourself would know the strong linkage between Steam accounts and the Valve community account/message board.
Kindly don't be such a retard/stop trying to get one past me.
If you want unverifiable bitching about people getting their Steam accounts banned/deleted (and losing access to *all* their purchased games), you can use Google. To verify that's the case, the folks at Valve would have to admit it's the case, and oddly, I don't see that happening.
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-- Thomas Jefferson: American Founding Father, clairvoyant and seditious traitor.
You made several seemingly baseless claims of Valve's Steam acting like a trojan/virus by deleting entire accounts worth of content off of customers' computers. You failed to provide evidence of such a claim.
Looks like trolling. Acts like trolling.
This could be such a happy little thread.
NHL 09: Playing as Nashville (medium setting is a little too easy, so opted for a lesser team) 20 games to go for the playoffs, one point leader.
Spoiler:
I could have had class. I could have been a contender.
I could have been somebody. Instead of a bum
Which is what I am
I aim at the stars
But sometimes I hit London
Holy shit, you're a douche.
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-- Thomas Jefferson: American Founding Father, clairvoyant and seditious traitor.
Being banned from multiplayer is one thing, but what about single player? I play games Single Player and would rather not rely on an outside company, that could go bankrupt in the future, in order to play my games.
Either way, anything in the EULA is not up front which is all I came to discuss.
---------------------------
Back to playing Batman:Arkham Asylum while I await the patch for Dragonage. Batman game gets really messed up at points, I'm loving it
Steam has a built in release switch that would allowed them to unlock all their content from Steam should bankrupcty day ever come. The CEO has reaffirmed that this has been tested and works, and it is written in their user and developer EULAs.
I am curious how that would technically work when their servers go offline. So I install a game from CD which requires Steam activation a year or two after Steam goes bankrupt, it can't find the server which says the switch has been flicked so then what ... not denying it works, but wonder if it requires you to be online at roughly the time they go bankrupt etc
Or lets say I have a downloaded and paid for a game from Steam, later on get a new PC a few years after they go bankrupt - but they're bankrupt now, how do I install my game? I have no CD for it.
I have discs that are 15 years old which still work. Were Steam to go under in say 8 years time a game I buy through them I can't just reinstall when I want to play it.
I have no idea who would end controlling the server redirects, or if the switch would be a standalone overrid. Considering the size of the Steam community, I highly doubt either would be an actual issue. I suspect it could be some sort of p2p type distribution considering their hiring history.
Steam has a backup option built into the program for paranoid people just like youOr lets say I have a downloaded and paid for a game from Steam, later on get a new PC a few years after they go bankrupt - but they're bankrupt now, how do I install my game? I have no CD for it.
One word: Escrow.
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
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