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Thread: Christian Marine Makes World Better Place

  1. #1

    Default Christian Marine Makes World Better Place

    http://www.mysanantonio.com/default/...et-1548348.php

    ****

    Kenneth Kobobel Sr., a 72-year-old Marine veteran, had yet to put on his eyeglasses when he heard a knock at the door of his office in a northwest Houston strip mall around 9:45 a.m. on Friday.

    The great-grandfather was chatting with his brother inside the office, making plans for the day, and figured the towering man waiting outside was one of his workers coming to collect his Friday paycheck.

    But when Kobobel opened the door, a man he had never seen before forced his way inside and put a 9mm handgun to his forehead.

    "You're dead!" he said the man screamed. "Give me the money! You're dead!"

    But the next few, frantic minutes actually would turn out to be the robber's last.

    He forced Kobobel to his knees, his brother to the ground. He emptied the brother's wallet, and Kobobel gave him $20. But the robber kept looking, Kobobel said, and patted down one of his pockets, finding a tight wad of bills totaling more than $800.

    "You lied to me!" the man screamed. "You're dead!"

    He said the robber struck him on the head with the barrel of the 9mm and tossed the desk and credenza looking for more money. The robber finally seemed satisfied they had no more cash and said to "count to 100 before you even think of walking to that door."

    Running him down

    At the count of 20, Kobobel called 911. Then the senior citizen was out the door, asking neighbors if they saw which way the robber went. He climbed into his 1997 Lexus sedan just as his son, 47-year-old Kenneth Kobobel Jr., pulled up outside.

    The son watched his father speed off in pursuit of the robber, not surprised in the least.

    "He's an ex-Marine," the son said. "He doesn't put up with a whole lot of nothing."

    His father remembers the next few minutes through the haze of an adrenaline rush. He said he spotted the robber in a parking lot of a strip mall on Northline and headed toward him.

    "He turned and saw me and pointed the gun at me," Kobobel said.

    He said the man fired at him at least once.

    Kobobel rammed him with his car, but the robber jumped right back up and recocked his gun, he said.

    "I hit him again," he said. "I hit him pretty good that time."

    Other details sketchy

    Police said Kobobel rammed the man against a metal fence in the parking lot of a strip mall near 7313 Northline, about half a block away from his business. Details about the incident then become sketchy, police said. Investigators said they are trying to determine if another vehicle besides Kobobel's also hit the robber.

    Kobobel got out of his car and looked around and didn't see the man, asking residents of the nearby apartment complex if they'd seen him run by. They pointed to the robber lying nearby in the parking lot.

    Kobobel, a former lawyer who lives in Spring, walked over and removed the gun from the man's reach, and saw that he was seriously injured.

    "I thought it was good that I caught this jerk who'd robbed me," Kobobel said, "but what I didn't like was that this man was laying there and his life was ebbing away. I'm a Christian, and I wouldn't want to see anybody die."

    Police have yet to release the robber's identity.

    Kobobel, who owns the small strip mall on Little York that houses his business office, a church and driving school, said he's "emotionally tore up" about the man's death.

    "I would have given him the $800 if he'd still be alive," he said. "I didn't want anybody to die on my account."

    Read more: http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/sta...#ixzz1VX1axKLi


    ********

    Thank you Mr. Kobbel for making the world a better place. Who knows how many more people would have been victimized if you hadn't decided to chase this criminal down and end him. When the first bump wasn't good enough you really tore into that piece of filth!

    Oh and play close attention to all the comments on the story guys. This happened in Texas and in Texas we think the only good criminal is a *DEAD* criminal.

  2. #2
    Thank you Mr. Kobbel for making the world a better place. Who knows how many more people would have been victimized if you hadn't decided to chase this criminal down and end him. When the first bump wasn't good enough you really tore into that piece of filth!
    To bad this guy disagrees with you on account of his Christian faith.
    "I would have given him the $800 if he'd still be alive," he said. "I didn't want anybody to die on my account."

    He should have let the authorities deal with this guy, I'm glad he would have undone what he did if he could.

  3. #3
    I choose to interpret it differently. If they guy needed help and needed $800 I'm sure he would have given it to him. But having a gun waved in your face by a criminal intent on continuing his evil ways... yeah its go time for that marine.

  4. #4
    You're misreading his comment. Kobobel was clearly expressing regret and would, in retrospect, rather have lost the money than to kill the man as well as fuck up his car. He says that he didn't want the man to die. Perhaps he's just trying to cover his ass come trial time, but I'm not sure how you can be literate and still interpret his remarks as being supportive of your fetisch for killing people.
    "One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."

  5. #5
    You're all forgetting that the marine is a Christian, but Lewk is not. Lewk does not have a Christian bone in him, he would rather spit on the grave of Christ than permit a criminal to live.

  6. #6
    At the same time Bush is a Republican and obama is a democrat. He may be a bad Christian but he does identify himself as a Christian, and who's to stop him?
    "One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Aimless View Post
    At the same time Bush is a Republican and obama is a democrat. He may be a bad Christian but he does identify himself as a Christian, and who's to stop him?
    Christ. Lewk doesn't believe a word Christ had to say.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Aimless View Post
    At the same time Bush is a Republican and obama is a democrat. He may be a bad Christian but he does identify himself as a Christian, and who's to stop him?
    Papal hit squads?
    The light that once I thought compassion still casting shadows in your action
    The words you shared were cold transactions that bring me to curse what you've done
    When you're up there absorbed in greatness with such success you've grown complacent
    I hope you scorch your many faces when you fly too close to the sun

  9. #9
    Lewk is trolling again, how quaint.

    Lesson #1: put your eyeglasses on before you unlock the front door.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    You're all forgetting that the marine is a Christian, but Lewk is not. Lewk does not have a Christian bone in him, he would rather spit on the grave of Christ than permit a criminal to live.
    Spitting on an empty tomb... rather silly ain't it? I mean the whole point of spitting on someone's grave is to desecrate their final resting place. However since Christ rose again the gesture would be pointless and in fact may even be symbolic of spitting on the powerless grave that could not contain the Almighty.

    In any event - one of the points in my thread is that self-identified Christian's also do not have a problem with making the world a better place by fighting back against criminals. I remember you singing a different tune during the London riots...

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    Spitting on an empty tomb... rather silly ain't it? I mean the whole point of spitting on someone's grave is to desecrate their final resting place. However since Christ rose again the gesture would be pointless and in fact may even be symbolic of spitting on the powerless grave that could not contain the Almighty. In any event - one of the points in my thread is that self-identified Christian's also do not have a problem with making the world a better place by fighting back against criminals.
    Please provide a quote from Christ where he says people should enjoy making the world a better place by killing criminals?
    I remember you singing a different tune during the London riots...
    I never said it would be glorious for someone to chase down a fleeing suspect and run them down repeatedly. I never said we should enjoy someone's death. I never said I believed in Christ either.

    I did say we should stop those acting in the riots with force if necessary, ideally with rubber bullets or water cannons if it proved necessary before real bullets. Kind of different to rejoicing in the death of people.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    Spitting on an empty tomb... rather silly ain't it? I mean the whole point of spitting on someone's grave is to desecrate their final resting place. However since Christ rose again the gesture would be pointless and in fact may even be symbolic of spitting on the powerless grave that could not contain the Almighty.

    In any event - one of the points in my thread is that self-identified Christian's also do not have a problem with making the world a better place by fighting back against criminals. I remember you singing a different tune during the London riots...
    except that the self identified christian in the article seems to have a problem with what happened. it's in the article, check it out
    "One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Aimless View Post
    it's in the article, check it out
    Since he won't: "but what I didn't like was that this man was laying there and his life was ebbing away. I'm a Christian, and I wouldn't want to see anybody die."

    Are you learning yet Lewk?
    I could have had class. I could have been a contender.
    I could have been somebody. Instead of a bum
    Which is what I am

    I aim at the stars
    But sometimes I hit London

  14. #14
    De Oppresso Liber CitizenCain's Avatar
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    Just for shits and giggles... the world probably is a better place now that there's one less armed robber running around, pistol-whipping senior citizens and shooting at Lexus drivers. The [now deceased] gunman sounded dangerously unstable, and needlessly violent to me - letting him live to pistol whip some more frail senior citizen to death doesn't strike me as much of a favor to anyone.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
    Since he won't: "but what I didn't like was that this man was laying there and his life was ebbing away. I'm a Christian, and I wouldn't want to see anybody die."

    Are you learning yet Lewk?
    Meh, you could argue that ex-Marine boy's attitude is just as unchristian as Lewk's, if you really wanted to. I'm too lazy and uninterested to do it, but it could be done, so this is probably not the best way to skewer Lewk's contradictory belief systems.
    "I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."

    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."

    -- Thomas Jefferson: American Founding Father, clairvoyant and seditious traitor.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by CitizenCain View Post
    Just for shits and giggles... the world probably is a better place now that there's one less armed robber running around, pistol-whipping senior citizens and shooting at Lexus drivers. The [now deceased] gunman sounded dangerously unstable, and needlessly violent to me - letting him live to pistol whip some more frail senior citizen to death doesn't strike me as much of a favor to anyone.
    On a purely atheistic, life has no intrinsic value, people have no souls kind of way - you're probably right.
    Meh, you could argue that ex-Marine boy's attitude is just as unchristian as Lewk's, if you really wanted to. I'm too lazy and uninterested to do it, but it could be done, so this is probably not the best way to skewer Lewk's contradictory belief systems.
    I'd like to see how his attitude is unchristian.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    You're all forgetting that the marine is a Christian, but Lewk is not. Lewk does not have a Christian bone in him, he would rather spit on the grave of Christ than permit a criminal to live.
    A no true Scotsman from an atheist Ingurlander? There's a guffaw.
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  17. #17
    De Oppresso Liber CitizenCain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    On a purely atheistic, life has no intrinsic value, people have no souls kind of way - you're probably right.
    Uh, a little backwards on why there, but... alright.

    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    I'd like to see how his attitude is unchristian.
    Well, I'm off to fornicate, intoxicate and commit other assorted offenses against discredited, millenia-old ideas on morality, so I'm in a bit of hurry... but were I inclined to make that argument, my primary thrust would be the duties laid out in scripture for the strong to protect the weak, and how enabling and rewarding a violent, armed robber would be loosing wolves on the flock, rather than protecting them, as this geriatric ex-Marine clearly demonstrated he has the ability to do.

    Hell, you could even get all Pulp Fiction on it if you wanted...

    The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of darkness, for he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know I am The Lord when I lay my vengeance upon you.
    "I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."

    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."

    -- Thomas Jefferson: American Founding Father, clairvoyant and seditious traitor.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by CitizenCain View Post
    Well, I'm off to fornicate, intoxicate and commit other assorted offenses against discredited, millenia-old ideas on morality, so I'm in a bit of hurry... but were I inclined to make that argument, my primary thrust would be the duties laid out in scripture for the strong to protect the weak, and how enabling and rewarding a violent, armed robber would be loosing wolves on the flock, rather than protecting them, as this geriatric ex-Marine clearly demonstrated he has the ability to do.

    Hell, you could even get all Pulp Fiction on it if you wanted...

    The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of darkness, for he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know I am The Lord when I lay my vengeance upon you.
    That's Ezekiel. When did Ezekiel become Christ? I asked for a reference specifically relating to Christ, not Judaism.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nessus View Post
    A no true Scotsman from an atheist Ingurlander? There's a guffaw.

  19. #19
    Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of darkness, for he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know I am The Lord when I lay my vengeance upon you.
    Yeah, the Lord, doesn't say the shepherd should be killing anyone let alone being happy about the killing.
    "One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    That's Ezekiel. When did Ezekiel become Christ? I asked for a reference specifically relating to Christ, not Judaism.D
    What percentage of Christianity is actually based on the words of Christ?
    Hope is the denial of reality

  21. #21
    Under the premise that Christians should never kill anyone that would make the concept of the Christian soldier kind of odd wouldn't it? And yet Christ praised the centurion (a military rank in the Roman Empire) as having faith.

    Ultimately the bad guy who terrorized others was killed. This is a good thing for a variety of reasons.

    1. The guy is dead and can not harm other people. It is likely that he would have committed many future crimes.
    2. Society doesn't have to pay for him to be in jail for his trail or any of that other stuff. This has probably saved the tax payers hundreds of thousands of dollars.
    3. This sends a message to other criminals that if you commit a crime society will look the other way when your vengeful victims kill you in broad daylight in front of multiple witnesses. That's a pretty sweet message IMO.

    In an act of courage this senior citizen risked his own life in order to protect the community from violence. He should be held up as an example of what good men do. Most people wouldn't have that kind of fortitude and bravery. But then again most people don't become Marines!

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    Under the premise that Christians should never kill anyone that would make the concept of the Christian soldier kind of odd wouldn't it? And yet Christ praised the centurion (a military rank in the Roman Empire) as having faith.

    Ultimately the bad guy who terrorized others was killed. This is a good thing for a variety of reasons.

    1. The guy is dead and can not harm other people. It is likely that he would have committed many future crimes.
    2. Society doesn't have to pay for him to be in jail for his trail or any of that other stuff. This has probably saved the tax payers hundreds of thousands of dollars.
    3. This sends a message to other criminals that if you commit a crime society will look the other way when your vengeful victims kill you in broad daylight in front of multiple witnesses. That's a pretty sweet message IMO.

    In an act of courage this senior citizen risked his own life in order to protect the community from violence. He should be held up as an example of what good men do. Most people wouldn't have that kind of fortitude and bravery. But then again most people don't become Marines!
    And yet you sided with the Godless Bolshevists. Tsk tsk.
    In the future, the Berlin wall will be a mile high, and made of steel. You too will be made to crawl, to lick children's blood from jackboots. There will be no creativity, only productivity. Instead of love there will be fear and distrust, instead of surrender there will be submission. Contact will be replaced with isolation, and joy with shame. Hope will cease to exist as a concept. The Earth will be covered with steel and concrete. There will be an electronic policeman in every head. Your children will be born in chains, live only to serve, and die in anguish and ignorance.
    The universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference.

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    2. Society doesn't have to pay for him to be in jail for his trail or any of that other stuff. This has probably saved the tax payers hundreds of thousands of dollars.
    3. This sends a message to other criminals that if you commit a crime society will look the other way when your vengeful victims kill you in broad daylight in front of multiple witnesses. That's a pretty sweet message IMO.
    Hmm... How is the investigation of the "sketchy details of the incident" being paid for? I'm really not sure, but doesn't this money essentially come out of tax payers' pockets as well?
    And I don't really see where you're getting your reason No.3 from. To me, it appears it should be "This sends a message to other criminals that if you commit a crime some guy will make a thread celebrating your death in an online forum when your vengeful victims kill you in broad daylight in front of multiple witnesses" at best. Which is as meaningless as any reason could possibly get, really.
    Carthāgō dēlenda est

  24. #24
    Am I right that the guy could really face some manslaughter charges here?

  25. #25
    Stingy DM Veldan Rath's Avatar
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    Yeah, but I don't see it going anywhere.
    Brevior saltare cum deformibus viris est vita

  26. #26
    De Oppresso Liber CitizenCain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    That's Ezekiel. When did Ezekiel become Christ? I asked for a reference specifically relating to Christ, not Judaism.
    No, you asked about Christianity. Under Christianity, Christ is the fulfillment of the Judaic covenants and prophecies... which is why there's an Old Testament in the Bible (and why it's not quite the same as the Jewish Torah and Talmud). If you don't like the Ezekiel quote, that's fine (it just jumped to mind on account of the movie, not on account of being directly on point), but as Loki already observed, Christianity is more than just what Christ said, like it or not.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aimless View Post
    Yeah, the Lord, doesn't say the shepherd should be killing anyone let alone being happy about the killing.
    No, shepherds kill wolves. This fact is even noted in scripture. As to being happy about it, well... there's nothing in scripture that would explicitly preclude or condemn taking pleasure in the kill - we can't control our emotional responses, only what what we do with them - so I'd say there's nothing wrong with that either, though, killing a dangerous predator and Lewk's gloating and unseemly public rejoicing about it are two different things, of course.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadnaught View Post
    Am I right that the guy could really face some manslaughter charges here?
    In modern jurisprudence, you can face manslaughter charges for almost anything (in the US anyway) - I remember a recent story about a weapons engineer who got charged with murder for defending himself and his fiancee against a biker gang.

    Of course, if the story's accurate, and the robber fired at the driver, then the driver would be justified in running the gunman over with the car, and shouldn't face criminal charges.
    "I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."

    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."

    -- Thomas Jefferson: American Founding Father, clairvoyant and seditious traitor.

  27. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    What percentage of Christianity is actually based on the words of Christ?
    Depends, I'd say close to zero for some so-called Christians. Which is why I specifically inquired about a quote from Christ himself.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewkowski View Post
    Under the premise that Christians should never kill anyone that would make the concept of the Christian soldier kind of odd wouldn't it? And yet Christ praised the centurion (a military rank in the Roman Empire) as having faith.
    Please provide a single quote from Christ himself that would glorify this.
    Quote Originally Posted by CitizenCain View Post
    No, you asked about Christianity. Under Christianity, Christ is the fulfillment of the Judaic covenants and prophecies... which is why there's an Old Testament in the Bible (and why it's not quite the same as the Jewish Torah and Talmud). If you don't like the Ezekiel quote, that's fine (it just jumped to mind on account of the movie, not on account of being directly on point), but as Loki already observed, Christianity is more than just what Christ said, like it or not.
    That's not what I asked.
    Please provide a quote from Christ where he says people should enjoy making the world a better place by killing criminals?
    Christ/he - not Christianity.

  28. #28
    De Oppresso Liber CitizenCain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RandBlade View Post
    Please provide a single quote from Christ himself that would glorify this.
    That's not what I asked. Christ/he - not Christianity.
    No, your response to me was: "I'd like to see how his attitude is unchristian."

    Emphasis added.

    See, you requested an interpretation on Christianity, not a quote from Jesus. And you could have phrased it differently, and asked what Christ's teachings would say, but you didn't - you asked about Christianity, which includes the Old Testament, as Christ is the fulfillment of Old Testament prophecies, without which, Christ is of no importance whatsoever.

    If you had asked me for a quote where Christ said people should enjoy making the world a better place by killing, I would have given you the rhetorical slap that question deserves, asked you where Christ said people should enjoy video games and then thrashed that strawman I set up where you take the position that enjoying electronic media is unChristian, because Jesus never said people should enjoy it.
    "I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."

    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."

    -- Thomas Jefferson: American Founding Father, clairvoyant and seditious traitor.

  29. #29
    Two distinct issues.

    1: How is Lewk's view back up by a quote from Christ [no Ian]
    2: How is the Marine's view unchristian [Ian is there]

    Ian is turning up with one issue only.

  30. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Proverbs
    Do not gloat when your enemy falls; when he stumbles, do not let your heart rejoice.
    I miss Miang
    "One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."

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